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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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CCA Application and agreement (copy of)


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ok this is what MBNA sent out when i asked for a copy of original

executed agreement.

any thoughts ?

see below, thats what i got when i received my card !

so one is the application form and ones the agreement

but are they valid and executed ?

 

ps how do you post a jpg straight into a post box ?

agreement.JPG

executed1.JPG

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MBNA - Case Charges+PPI+CI+LA+Damages+costs

RBS Credit Card - Case Charges+CI+LA+Costs

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IMO, niether is a properly executed agreement. The first, although signed only by you, does not contain the necessary terms and is utterly unenforceable. The second, whilst containing some of the terms is not signed and hence likewise.

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thats all i have ever received from them, so where does that leave me ?

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MBNA - Case Charges+PPI+CI+LA+Damages+costs

RBS Credit Card - Case Charges+CI+LA+Costs

Barclays - Case Charges+CI+LA+Damages+costs

Halifax - Case Charges+CI+Damages+costs

Online Finance - Case Charge+CI+Damages+costs

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Guest Battleaxe

It leaves you holding the winning hand. You push ahead now, reminding MBNA that you have not received a true copy of the executed agreement.

 

You remind them that any alleged debt is unenforeceable by them and as such they cannot sell the debt the on. if this is done they will have to expalin to Judge why they did this.

 

You proceed with your claim.

 

My claim is in the same state and at the moment I have left everything in MBNA's hands they are now between a rock and hard place.

 

There is nothing they can do, but a lot you can do to get back the unlawful charges.

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Thanks BA,

 

the only thing is (not that this is a bad thing of course) i actually got my myself together and actually paid the entire balance off with MBNA, so my account is now at £0 (card withdrawn).

Clearly the fees and indeed the PPI (mis-sold) is being claimed for and i expect no trouble from them over this.

Its just with all the talk over at the CCA threads i wondered if in law there is anywhere left for me to take this unexecuted agreement idea. I know i was in a dilema about the whole idea of the CCA thing, but im over that now, and morals aside what can be done, anything ?

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MBNA - Case Charges+PPI+CI+LA+Damages+costs

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Tifo,

 

TBH mate im not really sure about the whole CCA unexecuted and executed thing thats been going on for a while, which is why i posted the photos of my MBNA ones.

I was hoping somebody with alot of knowledge about this subject jump in and say soemthing like....that means you now are awarded £50,000 and get a free holiday for life :rolleyes:

there has been loads of talk on this subject with alot of people saying that we could get most of the money we paid in the first place...back :eek:

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If you feel i have helped you then click

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MBNA - Case Charges+PPI+CI+LA+Damages+costs

RBS Credit Card - Case Charges+CI+LA+Costs

Barclays - Case Charges+CI+LA+Damages+costs

Halifax - Case Charges+CI+Damages+costs

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Hi

 

None of these are properly executed agreements. The first is an application form and that is what I got sent in the post. MBNA aka A&L also said that by law they didnt have to send an agreement that was signed!!!!!!

 

Gemspan

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Lets not forget here, that if they do not provide you with an agreement that they have signed, they CANNOT have complied with s63.4 and they CANNOT have complied with s85.

 

 

So Pro

 

Consider this - they are in default, they have sent you a pre-contractual application followed by an unsigned agreement and as my good friend m55 pointed out cannot have complied with s63.4 nor s85.... mmm rearrange a well known phrase: street without up they are sh+t paddle a

 

and

 

this imho is totally unenforceable, you have won £10,000 and a 2 week holiday each year for life.

 

Write back and give them the good news and ask them for Consolidation...

must remember to ask BA how she has done her Consolidation

 

Z

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

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Hi

 

I have a loan agreement with GE Money but it was not executed properly. However there is a section that states it is enforceable as long as it is signed by the debtor ie me!!! I will have a look for my thread and let you see it.

 

Gemspan

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/64788-agreement-not-signed-creditor.html?highlight=gemspan

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thanks all for your comments on this matter, i do feel myself warming up to this whole idea :D

 

BTW im currently working on a set of terms and conditions that will enforce zubo's comment, and therefore i now am entitled to my 2 week holiday, btw zubo i only accept cheques :lol:

 

but seriously im still not sure about the whole thing, like how should i word the challenge ect.

I will feel alot better about it when somebody else has taken them to task over it, and has actually won. I think till then i will wait and see what the outcome is especially if it goes all the way to court.

Dont Rush - Take Your Time - Dont always take me seriously

:p

 

If you feel i have helped you then click

Here, if you feel i have not helped you then click Here, if you want to complain about this go Here, if you would like bank secrets then go Here.

 

MBNA - Case Charges+PPI+CI+LA+Damages+costs

RBS Credit Card - Case Charges+CI+LA+Costs

Barclays - Case Charges+CI+LA+Damages+costs

Halifax - Case Charges+CI+Damages+costs

Online Finance - Case Charge+CI+Damages+costs

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gemspan,

 

i have looked at your thread on the subject and i find that very interesting indeed :)

what i found most interesting was, while looking over your thread the penny dropped for me why barclaycard have written off my debt.

im pretty sure its becasue they know they dont have a executed cca to take to court, according to experian credit ref agency, my barclaycard was paid up in full and then closed 18months ago !

funny thing is that i still owe £2000 on it and have not paid a penny in two years..........very weird huh ?

so unless i have a secret admirer who really really likes me, barclaycard must have decided that upon reflection they cannot chase me for the debt.

But since i stopped paying them i only received one letter, and then all correspondance stopped, they threatened me, then nothing.

Then when i looked at my credit file on experian, the debt is gone :o

 

what are your thoughts on this ?

Dont Rush - Take Your Time - Dont always take me seriously

:p

 

If you feel i have helped you then click

Here, if you feel i have not helped you then click Here, if you want to complain about this go Here, if you would like bank secrets then go Here.

 

MBNA - Case Charges+PPI+CI+LA+Damages+costs

RBS Credit Card - Case Charges+CI+LA+Costs

Barclays - Case Charges+CI+LA+Damages+costs

Halifax - Case Charges+CI+Damages+costs

Online Finance - Case Charge+CI+Damages+costs

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Hi

 

I have a loan agreement with GE Money but it was not executed properly. However there is a section that states it is enforceable as long as it is signed by the debtor ie me!!! I will have a look for my thread and let you see it.

 

Gemspan

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/64788-agreement-not-signed-creditor.html?highlight=gemspan

 

Annie

 

The section you mentioned is complete nonsense and in its own right would possibly place the enforceability of the agreement in doubt. Pam has given you some excellent advice which you really should follow through on. I would point out that there are significant issues with the agreement which makes it unexecuted and that you now are seeking repayment of all unlawful charges including interest and removal of all defaults.

 

Have you SARd them? You need to prepare a schedule of their charges you have paid + contractual interest to send them.

 

Z

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

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Guest Battleaxe
So Pro

 

Consider this - they are in default, they have sent you a pre-contractual application followed by an unsigned agreement and as my good friend m55 pointed out cannot have complied with s63.4 nor s85.... mmm rearrange a well known phrase: street without up they are sh+t paddle a

 

and

 

this imho is totally unenforceable, you have won £10,000 and a 2 week holiday each year for life.

 

Write back and give them the good news and ask them for Consolidation...

must remember to ask BA how she has done her Consolidation

 

Z

 

I filled in a spread sheet Vamps No 2, placed 37.9% CI and 24.9 respectively and went to work from the date of the first breach, all interest on the accounts from that date. As Crap One and MBNA are choosing to ignore this and I am going to ask for CI, the interest is accruing. Funny now because of the CI, both banks owe me a nice holiday in Caribbean and no more payments on the cards.

 

Crap One do not get the concept of Section 85 at all.

 

MBNA (A & L) are in breach of Sec 63.4 anyway, so they are up that proverbial creek without a paddle.

 

They can threaten, they can bluster, they can take me to Court. In the end, they can't hurt me, while they are doing this, my nest egg is growing and I might be able to affors a nip and tuck as well as a holiday in the sunshine courtesy of the generosity of two credit card companies. Heck when this started out, all I wanted back were my unlawful charges and a bit of reasonable behaviour from them. they have stalled at every turn. they are the masters of procrastination, but at the end of the day, they are in deep doo doo and I am not going away until I have been paid.

 

MIB, you know who I am, so just give up and realise you have nothing else to fight with. You no longer hold us in your thrall. It is over. You are not Spartans.

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Annie

 

The section you mentioned is complete nonsense and in its own right would possibly place the enforceability of the agreement in doubt. Pam has given you some excellent advice which you really should follow through on. I would point out that there are significant issues with the agreement which makes it unexecuted and that you now are seeking repayment of all unlawful charges including interest and removal of all defaults.

 

Have you SARd them? You need to prepare a schedule of their charges you have paid + contractual interest to send them.

 

Z

 

Hi Zubo

 

I have SAR'd GE Money and this is what they sent me. I have 3 accounts with them - 2 of them have unlawful charges on them and I have written off to have them removed. I have also charged them CI!!!!! LOL. The loan agreement was sold to Asset Link who refused to take any money from me as they wanted the whole amount - not just little bits and pieces! Now, I was having to sell my house last year (before I found this site and became empowered!!!! LOL) and was going to pay £2000 ish off. The loan was for £5800 with interest of £1115. I initially had a car loan with them but refinanced to a personal loan as it was cheaper. Asset Link were looking for just over £2000 from me to settle this. However, when I got the agreement I discovered that it hadnt been signed by them and checked all the other paperwork. the previous loan hadnt been signed for either. I think this may be normal with GE Money.

 

I have advised them that as the agreement has not been executed properly it is unenforceable. There is also nowhere on the agreement that gives them permission to sell the debt on, so that is something else I have to sort out.

 

I have sent them a stinky letter yesterday regarding all accounts and have told them that they better start to take me seriously because this is their last chance before it goes to court and to the OFT and ICO.

 

I wondered if you could direct me (or tell me! ;)) what exactly are the prescribed terms in a Consumer Credit Agreement. I have hunted around and couldnt find anything.

 

Thanks in advance.

Annie

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gemspan,

 

i have looked at your thread on the subject and i find that very interesting indeed :)

what i found most interesting was, while looking over your thread the penny dropped for me why barclaycard have written off my debt.

im pretty sure its becasue they know they dont have a executed cca to take to court, according to experian credit ref agency, my barclaycard was paid up in full and then closed 18months ago !

funny thing is that i still owe £2000 on it and have not paid a penny in two years..........very weird huh ?

so unless i have a secret admirer who really really likes me, barclaycard must have decided that upon reflection they cannot chase me for the debt.

But since i stopped paying them i only received one letter, and then all correspondance stopped, they threatened me, then nothing.

Then when i looked at my credit file on experian, the debt is gone :o

 

what are your thoughts on this ?

 

Hey Progenic7

 

Me thinks you may have a sugar mommy!!!! LOL I couldnt imagine Barclays just paying off the debt without you challenging them. Just hope she aint a bunny boiler!!!! ;):p

 

If there's anybody out there with spare cash they can pay off some of my debts for me too!!!!

 

Annie

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