kings hill/hodsons[cabot] claimform - mogan Stanley card **DISCONTINUED**

[mrrj]

Recieved a letter from the courts today ,they have fast tracked my case and set a directions hearing for the end of the month. Can anyone explain what fast track is . cheers

[debt_mountain]

Recieved a letter from the courts today ,they have fast tracked my case and set a directions hearing for the end of the month. Can anyone explain what fast track is . cheers

It means that it is not in the small claims track and there is a possibility of the losing party having to pay upto £750. on the plus side it means full disclosure is required.

[mrrj]

How can full disclosure help me me when cabot have suplied me all that i required under the cca (even though most of it is not as should be ) ?

[debt_mountain]

Just means that should you want more the judge can make sure you get it. Di you get the sales agreement? (I have just reread your thread and you did) I am reading though these and I really think that the assignment is not legal and if that is the case most assignments will be in the same way and challengable. I was just trying to point out the only benefit I can see of Fast Track.

 

I would study up on the legality of the assignment and if it is not to the letter of the law go after them.

[mrrj]

Thanx DM like you say it would be hard for cabot to push that DOA as being leagaly binding for my account , roll on court date.

[debt_mountain]

When is your next date, the one earlier in the thread 21st June ish has past?

[mrrj]

I have a Directions hearing at the end of this month which i have to attend.

[mrrj]

Went to directions hearing today and it cuoldnt have gone worse .

 

The judge agreed that the cca and statements were unreadable

he told cabot that i need readable copies but said it would be fine if they just typed them out ?????.

 

I told him that i never received a copy of notice of assignment but he said fine cabot can send you one .

 

He also told me it wasnt worth fighting because if it goes to trial it would cost me thousands.

Not exactly how i saw it going

[ODC]

This is unbelievable.

They did not produce an executed copy of CCA yet he will allow them to type one out.

 

What about the signatures etc.

It seems a strange remark for a supposedly impartial judge to make:-x

[debt_mountain]

No way.....that cannot be right. They can't just create these sort of things willy nilly, although we know not to put it past them.

 

What is the next step? is it on to trial ? or another further directions hearing?

 

I would pull all the info you can on the prescribed requirements for the CCA and what make a legal assignment and send that to the judge and ask that he have Cabot supply the evidence for each of the requirements.

 

The fact that the deed of assignment doesn't show your name shows that the debt was never properly assigned, anyone can print a notice of assignment but they need to prove they did own the debt and that the followed the legal assignment process.

 

Why was this put to fast track? was it over £5K?

[Seahorse]

Has this judge been smoking that skunk weed, or what? I thinks someone needs to send him back to school. Surely it can't be right a judge just making the rules as he goes along? I always thought they were there to INTERPRET AND APPLY the law, not make it.

 

It just seems to me the guy should be in a home making baskets, if that's the way he thinks.

[Rhia]

What's this all about. Surely the Judge knows that they have to rpoduce a copy of the original executed agreement in court in order to rule whether the debt is enforceable or not?

Statements? Anyone can produce a copy of a statement using a pc or is he inviting them to unravel in court. V strange you need to educate the Judge what is accepted in a properly executed agreement.

[rory32]

Often judges are not very aware of consumer law so you have to point it out to them chapter and verse. What relevant statute and sections did you quote?

[mrrj]

I kept telling the judge i was within my rights to have a properly executed version of the ca and the doa he said why i can see your signature just cant read the terms as for the doa he said they dont have to show me a copy filled in because of the figures inside

[rory32]

I kept telling the judge i was within my rights to have a properly executed version of the ca

You need to tell the judge why. So give the judge a copy of the relevant statute, section 78(1) (your request for a copy of the agreement), section 78(6) (failure to supply a copy of the agreement) section 60(1) and section 61(1) (making of the agreement), section 127(3) (judicial control).

 

I will also look out some links for you to have a read of.

 

You need to go in as well armed as possible and assume that the judge needs everything pointed out and that he is at best ignorant and at worst ill informed on this area of the law.

[mrrj]

Well i recieved an order from the courts tyelling cabot to supply by the 09/08/07 a " a resasonable copy of the loan agreement or if not available the best copy that can be produced with a typed copy " and also " a copy of the notice of assignment" strangely they only resent the poor copy of the ca and the same copy of the doa claiming this was the notice of assignment. Im ordered by 23 august to file and serve an amended defence as to whether i dispute the terms of the credit agreement and if so on what basis , also if i dispute service of the notice of assignment . I also have to list all disputed entrys of my account statement and list why.

[mrrj]

Well the legal system sure dosnt help u much . Cabot failed to supply the readable copy of the ca so i wrote to the courts asking them to strike the case out . They sent a letter giving cabot 7 days to supply the copy or they would strike it out (4/09/07) i though this was done and dusted but today i got a court letter , cabot have applied for an extension and have got a hearing for next tuesday . Im starting to lose sight of the goal here. Anyone got any advice thanx.

[djdave]

I wouldn't panic. In my opinion, they'll still need to provide a legible copy with the prescribed terms in order to prove enforcability. You and I both know the chances of this are about the same as winning the lottery while being struck twice by lightning.

 

There's a thread somewhere about how Cabot will try to railroad the judge into finding for them, and some excellent advice about having a skeleton arguement prepared and sticking to your guns.

 

[mrrj]

Problem is dj is that the judge is allowing them to type a copy ??

[djdave]

If it helps, this is an extract from the OFT's response to my complaint about Cabot:

 

A 'true copy' of an agreement principally consists of the terms and conditions of the agreement and the statutory content of the agreement. The name, address and signature of the debtor does not have to be provided. Additionally, the creditor must supply the total sum paid under the agreement by the debtor; the total sum which has become payable under the agreement but remains unpaid; and the total sum which is to become payable under the agreement by the debtor (the latter two must include the various amounts comprised in that total sum and the date when each is/was due). However, the copy must be a copy. It need not be exact on immaterial points, but it cannot be a conjectured reconstruction. If the trader has no original copy, the trader will have difficulty showing that he has complied with the regulation by supplying a 'true copy', since nobody would know what was in the original.

 

 

When the trader comes to enforce the debt in court, he needs to have a signed copy of the agreement in order to enforce. As the law stands currently he cannot otherwise.

So don't worry about when they might knock up. When it comes to Court, they need a proper signed copy - not a replica or conjectured reconstruction.

[mrrj]

this is where it becomes tricky ,they have supplied a signed copy its just not readable . The courts have accepted it as a true copy they are just getting cabot to make it readable

[djdave]

I see. To be honest, you're going to need better advice than I can give. Sorry I can't be of more help, but I wish you luck

[42man]

Interesting this one.....If it was me I would still question whether or not the document they supply is a true copy of your signed credit agreement. With exactly the prescribed terms and conditions - bear in mind that it should have all the correct figure work on it too !!! Have you made any argument about excessive charges also ?

[42man]

Am I right in saying that they HAVE to supply the Original document in court ?....

[ODC]

That would be my understanding of the law