Seahorse v Cabot

[andrew1]

Perhaps I should send them an invoice for my consultancy fee?

 

 

 

Thats a good idea and we can find a good DCA to collect it - do you think http://www.coveritup .co.uk could PASS OFF as a dca?

[Seahorse]

We still have scruples. It wouldn't be very convincing.

 

I wonder if Ken is going to try to convince Joe Public that he is cleaning up his act, though. I found this lot's IP address in my server logs today...

 

Polhill Communications. Financial Services PR

 

22 pages read. So not just an accidental stumbling into the blog, I'm thinking.

[thinksmart]

Wow what a huge thread! These giuys are causing sooo much misery and angst. Just wondering if anyone has any answers to the following based on actual experiences through the Courts...

 

1) If a creditor defaults on a CCA request so committing an offence and continues to press (either by letter/phone or by legal action) for repayment of the alleged debt can he be successfully sued for damages?

 

2) Does defaulting on a CCA actually count for anything in the final reckoning at Court? Any success stories?

 

3) Does a "representation" of a notice of assignment which was clearly printed after the fact actually impress a Court enough to accept it as evidence that a real one was genuinely sent?

 

4) Is an illegible and very rough looking photocopy of what was probably a fax or microfiched agreement acceptable as evidence? Anyone managed to get one of those chucked out?

 

5) If a creditor persistently fails to supply copies of credit greements and/or notices of assignments, even flying in the face of multiple CCA requests and CPR Part 18 requests how long can they get away with it without the Court striking the cae out?

 

6) and fianally I promise (for now - wink) has ANYONE ever managed to get a copy of an actual DEED of assignment?

 

By the way, and I'm sad to advise this, but I'm reliably told that even if a case has been struck out the Claimant can still apply for an application to have it reinstated within the following 30 days. The system sucks what can I say!?

[elizabeth1]

Wow what a huge thread! These giuys are causing sooo much misery and angst. Just wondering if anyone has any answers to the following based on actual experiences through the Courts...

 

1) If a creditor defaults on a CCA request so committing an offence and continues to press (either by letter/phone or by legal action) for repayment of the alleged debt can he be successfully sued for damages?

yes they can be sued for this

 

2) Does defaulting on a CCA actually count for anything in the final reckoning at Court? Any success stories? Yes it does count and damages can be claimed etc.. through a court

 

3) Does a "representation" of a notice of assignment which was clearly printed after the fact actually impress a Court enough to accept it as evidence that a real one was genuinely sent? I wouldn't have thought so - but I have no experience of this personally

 

4) Is an illegible and very rough looking photocopy of what was probably a fax or microfiched agreement acceptable as evidence? Anyone managed to get one of those chucked out? Not at all - in my hubbies case Cabots had sent us & courts illegible copies of application forms and T&C's -judge was most angry and wouldn't even consider these scraps of paper - see my thread here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/cabot/111844-another-cabot-court-case.html judge has told Hodsons Agent that their clients (cabots) need to get this paperwork in order NOW - he was totally annoyed with the messy illegible copies - he ordered they do present fully legible documents in court. Companies like Cabots need to learn that patience is running out with this messy "crap" being presented to Judges and they'll NOT stand for it at all. Hodsons Agent will tell of her blushes in court when judge screwed his face up at what was being passed off as a CCA was shown - judges want clear legible documents

 

5) If a creditor persistently fails to supply copies of credit greements and/or notices of assignments, even flying in the face of multiple CCA requests and CPR Part 18 requests how long can they get away with it without the Court striking the cae out? they won't get away with it - you can suggest case case is struck out on the basis you made several requests.

 

6) and fianally I promise (for now - wink) has ANYONE ever managed to get a copy of an actual DEED of assignment? I haven't seen a deed of assignment - but there are a few sale agreements knocking about. These don't matter until the comp[any can prove the account is theirs by means of an enforceable CCA - the remainder of the paperwork comes after that point.

 

By the way, and I'm sad to advise this, but I'm reliably told that even if a case has been struck out the Claimant can still apply for an application to have it reinstated within the following 30 days. The system sucks what can I say!?

Well if this is so and a claimant did apply to get case reinstated after strike out - they'd be 100% certain of having their papers in order then wouldn't they? So this would be fine = they'd have a case that they'd win? So this isn't a problem really - just means everything is as it should have been? and the chances of that are ???

[Seahorse]

1) Yes it does. eg Elizabeth1 has a thread running where Cabot's puppies have beentold to get their act together. But There IS no actual agreement to produce, though.Theoretically, yes.

2) Some upcoming cases will hopefully answer this for you.

3) HAHA. See above, and watch this space.

4) Ditto.

5) Just give them one chance through their complaints procedure. When that fails, complain to the FOS. And after that, see what your judge says. He'll likely only give them the one chance too. Enough of those cass, and it's likely Cabot will start to cave rather than face court and all the expenses that entails. But it will need a few wins I think, before the penny starts to drop.

6) Oh, YES. But you would need to ask somebody else about that. I can't name names at this point in time.

 

Last point is correct. But how many times do you think they would WANT to keep coming back for a kicking?

[Seahorse]

HAHA. SNAP, Elizabeth.

[thinksmart]

HAHA. SNAP, Elizabeth.

 

Brilliant replies - thanks Elizabeth1 & Seahorse.

 

I'm comng to accept that much depends on the judge you happen to get. I was warned that one particular one near me can be a right ............

 

I'll leave you to guess who I got and how I found him! All I can say is that defaulting on CCA 1974 requests, CPR Part 18 requests, AND supplying illegible evidence didn't seem to bother him in the slightest. Fortunatley it was only a hearing for an application - fingers crossed he doesn't turn up on the BIG day! (Or that he takes those matters more seriously at that time)

[Seahorse]

He's not the same one that told another DCA's solicitor, "No agreement? OK, then. Just go away and type one up." was it?

[thinksmart]

He's not the same one that told another DCA's solicitor, "No agreement? OK, then. Just go away and type one up." was it?

 

Is that true?

 

If so I think a letter to the dailies would be in order!

[elizabeth1]

HAHA. SNAP, Elizabeth.

 

 

great minds think alike?

[Seahorse]

Now this is interesting. Fredricksons International Ltd came to visit my blog. They think of themselves as being pretty big in the debt collection and purchase industry. I wonder if they were looking for tips on what not to do? Or scoping out the competition? Or what?

 

I notice they talk good sense on their website too. Whether or not this filters down to the coal face, I have no idea. But I liked this bit. . .

 

Fredrickson International Limited has been buying debt since 1992 and has a vast amount of experience in this field. This is a point worth remembering as even once a debt has been sold to a third party, your organisation’s reputation can still be affected. Fredrickson International understands this risk and ensures our clients do not suffer as a result of our actions.

 

It is indeed a point worth remembering. As no doubt Barclaycard can testify, since Cabot seems so intent on dragging them down with them.

[andrew1]

I take it you have written to Barclays and informed them of the way Cabot are deficating their name have you? ( despite Barclays pay rolling them into business in the first place - they won't like it) or shall we send them a little CFC mailer?

[Seahorse]

I'm afraid that Barclaycard will be informed of Cabot's misdeeds in a Letter Before Action prior to have to defend themselves against breaches of the Data Protection Act.

 

But then again, it might be better to mention it in my preliminary letter asking for my unlawful penalties and charges to be refunded, as well as all that interest they charged me without my agreement to do so.

[thinksmart]

If memory serves Fredricksons International are the bunch that issue proceedings for around 10% of the amount which they claim they are owed (with the provision that they withhold the right to sue for the rest later) presumably because they realise that their case is so weak and the costs are much less to try for 10% and see what happens. Also more chance of a frightened Defendant buckling and paying what seems like an affordable amount. Yep they tried it on me - my defence was rock solid in that it had already been F&F settled, so they withdrew (ungracefully without letting me know). However a year again they had another punt on exactly the same basis. My defence the 2nd time was a little more blunt promising that they would withdraw again exactly as they had the first time. Which they did - again without any sort of notice or apology. I'm waiting for the next attempt - think a 3rd go would warrant me making a counterclaim for compensation for vexacious litigancy and harrassment.

[pmhcfc]

Now this is interesting. Fredricksons International Ltd came to visit my blog. They think of themselves as being pretty big in the debt collection and purchase industry. I wonder if they were looking for tips on what not to do? Or scoping out the competition? Or what?

 

I notice they talk good sense on their website too. Whether or not this filters down to the coal face, I have no idea. But I liked this bit. . .

 

 

 

It is indeed a point worth remembering. As no doubt Barclaycard can testify, since Cabot seems so intent on dragging them down with them.

 

F I have the same sort of relationship with Bryan Carter as Cabots have with Ruthbridge .... Bryan Carter ,, GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR - don't get me started on that bunch of ***** s

[andrew1]

F I have the same sort of relationship with Bryan Carter as Cabots have with Ruthbridge .... Bryan Carter ,, GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR - don't get me started on that bunch of ***** s

 

I gathered that Bryan Carter no longer exists, merged with some other outfit, they are not after you now are they?

[pmhcfc]

I gathered that Bryan Carter no longer exists, merged with some other outfit, they are not after you now are they?

 

It's now supposed to be Crellins Carter but they T/A Bryan Carter still -- There's quite a thread re BC that I'd started..Anyway,,,not hijacking,,sowry C Hoss

[Seahorse]

No news, so I thought I'd solicit some from the thread visitors. In particular, the MIB.

 

Do any more of you want to rebel, and throw of the shackles of that Imperialist, Maynard? OK, so that's putting it a bit strong. But seriously, if any of you MIB (and WIB obviously) suddenly find you have a conscience after all, you are more than welcome to contact me. Just drop me an email at [email protected]

 

Inter departmental memos, collection procedures etc, etc all more than welcome to help grow our little library. Nothing copyrighted or confidential, of course. Wouldn't want your boss hauling you up in court now, would we. And in the strictest confidence, obviously.

[Seahorse]

OK, here we go. I've just gone through my SAR bundle from Barclaycard, and all they have sent me is statements from 2001. I'd almost be prepared to say they mistakenly assumed I was trying to chase them up for unfair penalties. Except they quite categorically state that this is ALL they hold on me. Really? I think I need to resurrect my Barclaycard thread. Opening balance is £3,144.99. But they obviously can't prove how they arrived at that figure. So I will just ignore that. And since that date, I have apparently paid them £2,350. Which I would like back as clearly they cannot prove that I ever owed them the money. Now then. Should I chase Barclaycard? Or Cabot?

 

Decisions, decisions.

[elizabeth1]

This could be fun

 

I am sure if our good friends at Cabots have been chasing you for monies - they surely "OWN" this account - and we know they'd never ever chase anyone without the correct papers in line would they ? (ROFLMAO)

 

Erm!!! eanie, meanie, minie, mo - for which company should Seahorse go after? NOW THAT'S A FUN DECISION TO MAKE!!

[Seahorse]

It does really lead me to think that, if BC are telling the truth, then, they have transferred EVERYTHING over to Cabot. WHich MUST mean... Cabot have the DUTIES as well!!! And so the assignment would have been absolute.

 

And THAT being the case... it's CABOT who owe me the money.

 

Right. What I need is an aggressive firm of debt collectors to chase this down for me. Someone who doesn't care if they step outside the law. Someone like.... RUTHBRIDGE!!!

[andrew1]

..think I might know a lad or two who have an affection for breaking the odd law!

[Seahorse]

ANd to think I thought I'd be off down the court today to start action against Cabot. How could I ever have imagined there was stil so much fun to be had. Cabot AND Barclaycard. Lovely. I think I'll start with a complaint to BC today. Give them a chance to suddenly "find" my lost data. I'm busy filling out an ICO complaint form as we speak though, because I don't think they'll be telling me they made a mistake.

[debt_mountain]

Why not name them both in the court papers, let them both turn up and defend their actions.

[Curlyben]

Did someone say Absolute Assignment, I hear a LoP s136 somewhere