The Training Room - Unethical but Legal?

[namedisplay]

 

In 2019 I enrolled with The Training Room for a software development course which I fully intended to complete. I suffer from MDD, Anxiety and ADHD and I was concerned that this would affect my course in some way, this is information that I gave over the phone to the person selling me the course. 

My mental health suffered when I discovered that the course was nothing more than large blocks of text and a “tutor” who could only answer questions about the blocks of text.  This was extremely difficult for my ADHD, but I really wanted to obtain the qualifications- so I requested information regarding extending my course from The Training Room, to which I received no response. 

I didn’t pursue it because I had a job, was making the payments and things were going well. Then, the pandemic struck and I lost my job and was refused furlough because I had started after the government cut off date. My mental state suffered further along with my financial state, and even though I managed to get onto Universal Credit, I was struggling.

I rang The Training Room and eventually I was told it would cost an initial £200 and then £15 per month until I finished the course. As time went on, my mental health slowly improved with the help of my psychiatrist and psychologist.  However, when my course deadline hit, The Training Room told me, for the first time, that I wasn't eligible to extend my deadline because I hadn't completed enough of the course. This shocked me, as nothing had been said about this before this point. I explained my financial and mental situation and was given a ‘generous’ offer which allowed me to stay on the course for a maximum of four months after my deadline for a fee of £350. If I had been able to afford that option, I would have taken it, however, as I informed them both in writing and over the phone, I was struggling to complete the course within the deadline because of my financial and health issues – charging me more and giving me minimal time to complete the course merely exacerbated the problem.

The Training Room is threatening me with legal action if I do not pay the full course fees of over £2000 and I do not have the money, nor do I think it is fair that they should charge me this. They did not listen to me, and were dishonest with me from the start.

I’m not the only person who has had this experience with the Training Room.  Is it really legal for them to be so unethical? Am I going to be forced to pay this even though it’s completely unreasonable? Any advice or insights would be really appreciated.
 

[dx100uk]

scan up their letter to one mass PDF after removing anything that can ID you here

 

read upload carefully

 

 

[mantis shrimp]

sight of any contract with them would also be useful. 

[namedisplay]

This is the contract from when I enrolled.

TTR PT LTD.pdf

[dx100uk]

Letter too please

 

DX

[Manxman in exile]

Apologies if I've missed it, but don't you have a copy of the terms and conditions of the course you enrolled on and what it required?

 

I may be mistaken but I think what you've posted is an agreement re how the course was financed, and not about the course itself.

[stu007]

Hi

 

I have to agree the Terms and Conditions are missing from that PDF also that PDF is only the Credit Agreement for your Course.

 

Can you post up the Letter from them threatening Legal Action as we need to see exactly what is states?

 

Can you post up the Full Agreement/Contract you signed with them for the Course (fully redacted) not just the Credit Agreement you have posted as that is not the Agreement /Contract that you signed with them.

 

When you asked to extend the Course did you explain it was for Medical reasons and did you provide them with evidence of this with a letter from your Doctor/Consultant you were undergoing this medical treatment for at the time?

 

Also can you clarify this link is them?

The Training Room

WWW.THETRAININGROOM.COM

---

Here at The Training Room we offer an array of courses to qualify you for a job you love. Find out more and apply for your dream course today.

 

If the above is correct did you follow their Complaint Procedure as they have set out:

Complaints Procedure

WWW.THETRAININGROOM.COM

---

Here at The Training Room we offer an array of courses to qualify you for a job you love. Find out more and apply for your dream course today.

 

[mantis shrimp]

That document is a loan agreement; it is therefore likely that the claim against you is for money due under a loan. 

[Manxman in exile]

Yes.  I suspect the OP might have two separate issues: one surrounding the course requirements and the other the credit agreement for the fees.

[mantis shrimp]

And a claim for money will be in respect of the credit agreement. 

[namedisplay]

I found the terms and conditions and another file.  I'm pretty sure the only thing I signed was the credit agreement.

Pre-Contractual-Explanation.pdf TTRTermsandConditions.pdf

[Manxman in exile]

OK.  Aren't your circumstances covered by 13 in the TTR Terms and Conditions?  Or have I misunderstood?

 

You can apply for an extension to the training period if you've been ill, but it's at TTR's discretion whether they grant it or not.  An extension is not guaranteed and if offered may come at extra cost.

 

Edit:  I can't see anything that says that to be eligible for an extension you need to have completed so much of the course

Edited January 28, 2022 by Manxman in exile

[namedisplay]

So does that mean I screwed myself by signing the credit agreement? 

[lenny100]

this reminds me of the old "trainline" scam a few years ao, very simmler story and tactics . If i remember right they lost big time in court and most of these agrements were null and void due to miss selling etc

Edited January 28, 2022 by lenny100

[Manxman in exile]

I'm not sure but I think you may have two separate but related issues.

 

The first is the course.  You are meant to complete it within a certain time frame - the "training period".   If you cannot do so you can apply for a discretionary extension in certain circumstances (eg illness) but the training provider is not obliged to grant an extension.  If they do grant an extension they can charge you for it.

 

I may have missed it but I can't see anything in their T&Cs that says you have to have completed two thirds (or whatever) of the course in order to be eligible for an extension.  So if they have used that as a ground for refusing you an extension (rather than just saying it was at their discretion) you might be able to challenge it.  But if they do give you an extension they can charge you for it.

 

At least that is how I read the training course T&Cs.  See if others agree with me.

 

The second issue is the finance agreement.  I'm no expert in this area but you seem to have agreed to take out a loan to pay for the course.  Whether you are bound by the terms of that loan agreement I don't know, but I suspect you might be.  Other posters know much more about this sort of agreement than I do and will be able to give you better advice than I can.

 

One avenue of escape for you might be under The Consumer Contract (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations, 2013.    If you bought the training course online you have a 14 day window during which you can cancel the course for a full refund if you have not already started the course.  (Or at least that is my understanding of the Regs).  If you have already started the course you cannot normally cancel it and get a refund UNLESS the course provider did not provide certain information to you at the outset about your right to cancel it.  In that case your right to cancel the course is extended to a year.  (It's not quite that simple but that is the gist of it).

 

So IF they did not provide the required information to you in an acceptable format, you JUST MIGHT still be able to cancel the course depending on when you signed up to do it.  But it might be a bit tenuous.

 

But I'm not a lawyer so don't take anything I say as legal advice.  I'm not qualified to give it.  Before you do anything see what other posters think.  I may be completely wrong.

 

I don't know what the "trainline" scam is that @lenny100 refers to, but I would suggest you explore that too.

 

 

Edited January 28, 2022 by Manxman in exile

[Manxman in exile]

OK.  Looking more closely at the T&Cs I would suggest that the information requirements of the Regulations I referred to in my previous post are met.  So I suspect that probably means that you might not be able to get out of the course and that you probably can't get out of the finance agreement either.

 

But as I said before, my take on this might be completely wrong-headed.  Wait and see what others say.

 

(Oh - I also note that 75 in the T&Cs say that they won't refund if a pre-existing health condition prevents you from completing the course.  I'm not sure if this might apply to your circumstances too?)

Edited January 28, 2022 by Manxman in exile

[stu007]

Hi

 

I could be wrong here so could @namedisplay please clarify if I am correct or completely wrong?

 

In your post#1 you mention that due to your health issues and your mental state at the time you rang the Training Room and was told it would cost and initial £200 and then £15 per month until you finished the course.

 

Then further in post#1 The Training Room told you you were not eligible for an extension because you hadn't completed enough of the course.

 

With the above I now refer Post#12 which mentions your circumstances are covered by 13 in the TTR Terms and Conditions.

 

What is mentioned above seems conflicting from TTR for the following:

 

1. IMO that money of £200 and then £15 per month (on top of original Course Fees) was them at that time agreeing to an extension as per 13 in TTR Terms and Conditions

 

2. Them stating you can't extend Course as not completed enough of Course is not in TTR Terms and Conditions (that I and others can see) (Note they could be referring to 15 in TTR Terms and Conditions)

 

Can you clarify the above and were you informed those extra costs were due to an extension of your Course.

 

Again I will ask did you provide the Training Room with Medical Evidence when you asked the above?

 

We also still need to see the Letter from Training Room Threatening Legal Action (fully redacted) which you still haven't posted?

 

You need to send The Training Room a Subject Access Request (SAR) asking for 'ALL DATA' that simple phrase means whatever format they hold that data in whether it be written, email, recorded phone calls etc.

 

They then have 30 Calendar Days to respond to your SAR Request and that Time Limit only starts once they have acknowledged your SAR Request. They can extend that Time Limit if they need to prove identity before actioning the SAR Request so be aware of that.

 

A SAR Request is now FREE and make sure you get Free Proof of Posting from the Post Office

 

 

Your right of access

ICO.ORG.UK

 

Can you please make sure you answer the questions asked of Caggers to assist you

 

 

[mantis shrimp]

I agree that the possible misselling angle needs to be investigated. This will involve understanding all the options for enrolling on and paying for the course, including what was said about the 'benefits' of this means of paying. 

 

Presumably the training company benefitted by receiving a large cash sum up front, from the lender. 

[namedisplay]

Heres the default letter.  Had a really hard time getting any kind of quality.  I hope it's readable.

 

 

I asked about an extension earlier in the year and after not receiving a reply for months I called.  Over the phone I was told that it would be £200 plus £15 for every month that I needed the extension.  That's what I expected when the 12 months came- hence my surprise when I was told I wasn't eligible.  After fighting to get an extension they asked for medical evidence; which I provided.  That's when they offered me the extension for £340 (for 4 months only).

 

I'm way beyond cancelling the course.  This is an ongoing issue because I refused to pay them for so long.  When the course was taken away from me after the 12 months I decided to enrol in University because I wanted to get some kind of qualifications.  I told them this and that my student loans barely covered my living expenses- they didn't care, they just wanted me to pay.  Due to financial pressures I dropped out of University to find work and here I am now.

 

I wish I paid more attention to the one star reviews.  They're always flaunting their high rating on trustpilot- which is what made me think they were a good option at the time.  But looking closer at the reviews, there are almost no 2, 3, or 4 star reviews. Their one star reviews all sound very reminiscent to my experience with them.  Their 5 star reviews are numerous enough to keep their ratings high but I can't help but get a feeling that they're all false.  In fact a lot of the 5 star reviews are straight up lies- some of them say things like you can take as long as you need to finish the course.  I wonder if there's any way of finding out if they purchase good reviews in order to trick people into thinking their course is anything more than pages and pages of text files.

 

Thank you for looking at this everyone.  You've been really helpful.  Way more helpful than the Ombudsman who completely brushed me (and someone who went through a similar problem with the training room) off.

 

I'll send the SAR request shortly.

 

PS: @mantis shrimp the Lender IS the Training room.  Or more specifically TTR PT LTD

png2pdf.pdf

Edited January 29, 2022 by namedisplay

[dx100uk]

Have they been sending you regular notice of sums in arrears? Letters?

 

Dx

[namedisplay]

They've been sending me regular letters and emails, yes.  Do you want me to compile all of them? What would you be looking for in them?

[mantis shrimp]

Check the legal name of the training company. Is it really the same as the lender? If this company 'lent' you money to pay itself, then I can envisage having great fun with that in court. 

[Manxman in exile]

@namedisplay  -  apologies if I missed it, but I don't think you had mentioned previously that you had had a complaint to the Ombudsman rejected?

 

Can I ask what was the nature of your complaint and how did the Ombudsman respond?

[dx100uk]

3 hours ago, dx100uk said:

Have they been sending you regular notice of sums in arrears Letters?

 

Dx

Nosia have they been sent?.. Email is not an acceptable method of comms  them.

[namedisplay]

@mantis shrimp it is indeed the same name.  What do you mean by great fun? fun to my benefit or theirs?

 

sorry @dx100uk, I'm not sure what your last post means.

 

Regarding the ombudsman,

 

I was very confused during the whole process.  I got the introduction and it sounded like they were going to contact the training room with the hopes that they would settle something (attached).

 

  I got the final response email from the training room and thought that it was a waste of time, and that the ombudsman is useless because nothing changed (also attached). 

 

Time passed and I was distracted due to focusing on my studies, and I started getting more emails and letters from the training room. 

 

I was annoyed that the ombudsman was so useless and sent them an email wondering what the heck they even did, the response is attached.  I have no idea how the process works but it seemed like they just brushed me off and did nothing.  I've attached the correspondence.

png2pdf (1).pdf

Edited January 29, 2022 by dx100uk
added A few blank lines only..dx