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PIP has been cancelled because a someone "decided" that my father can do things he can't do.


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My Father has just received a letter about his PIP, previous he was on a claim which he had scored 12 points on Daily Living, and 8 on Mobility. This new letter scores him 0 on both, which is obviously annoying and now we will need a mandatory reconsideration and no doubt get turned down and then wait 2 years for a tribunal, by which time he will be past retirement age so PIP won't restart anyway (according to what was said by an adviser when the PIP interview took place) as he is due for retirement next May, he'll also be in even worse health as his anxiety will be through the roof as the PIP was his lifeline to the extra money he needed to get by, losing PIP also loses his extra ESA top up. It's all very upsetting for him, obviously.

Whats really annoying though, is the language used in the letter, and I don't know how I'm meant to argue it in the Mandatory Reconsideration phone call.

 

I'm my fathers carer, but not registered as such as I'm registered to care for my wife, and my father only needs help for 2-3 hours a day, so not enough I'd be registered anyway. But regardless, he needs me for various things. His original PIP application took this into note. He cant make phone calls, or talk on the phone, as his anxiety gets so bad he will start choking and struggling to breath. The PIP assessment was the THIRD one, as the previous 2 had both been cancelled by assessors who deemed him a health risk if it continued, and I was not allowed to speak for him until the third appointment. 

 

In the decision letter it says "You described an inability to talk on the phone to the assessor, I HAVE DECIDED THAT YOU ARE ABLE TO DO THIS"

 

So despite proof, based on previous assessors needing to cancel, and me needing to do the majority of talking in the third one... the decision maker, decided that none of that matters. He is fine.

As part of my dads anxiety, he NEVER leaves the home. If he does, on those very rare occasions, I have to go with him. HE cant engage with strangers, and if we use a taxi as an example and the taxi fare is £3.70 but dad only has £10 on him in notes. He will give him the money and shakily say "Keep the change" and get out of the car ASAP because he can't cope with waiting for the change (I tend to pay now, just so he's not giving such a large chunk away). When we go out, he HAS to have Diazepham, and he's not seen any member of the family except me in over 2 years (including the xmas before covid) because he is unable to cope with visiting people or having them visit him. The man lives next door to a shop, and if he runs out of food or milk will not go in because it's too much him so he will wait until I visit. I was ill before for 5 days and when I got to see him, he'd been drinking black coffee only, and only eating cheese sandwiches because he'd not done his weekly shop as he needs me there to receive it, and had not been able to go to the shop next door;

 

Decision letter "No Evidence that you are unable to engage, and although to prefer to be accompanied I HAVE DECIDED THAT YOU ABLE TO COMMUNICATE AND ENGAGE WELL WITH OTHERS"

 

With regards to his anxiety on leaving the home, he was asked about planning journeys. We pointed out that I plan his journeys with him, and we go through them using google maps so it looks familiar and it's about a week of getting him ready to do it... and he has to do it with me, he can not go alone.

Decision letter "With regards to planning and following a journey I HAVE DECIDED THAT YOU ARE CAPABLE TO PLAN AND FOLLOW THROUGH A JOURNEY, WITH NO CONCERNS AS TO CHANGES"

 

he needs to use inhalers, pain medication, diazepham and walking aids when he goes out. He's not left the house for a year. HE was asked how often he uses them now. He answered honestly. Diazepham not at all, pain medication during flair ups, and inhaler he just uses his brown one daily but has had no need for the blue reliever one. Again, this is because he's not left the house for well over a year. This was pointed out, and we also pointed out that based on previous times a 10 minute walk to a shop would take us nearly an hour, as he would need to walk at a very slow pace. Would use his blue inhaler on the way there and back, would stop for a rest 3-4 times, would use his crutch to walk and would need Ibuprofen gel on his legs and wrist, and take pain killers when he gets home too and then rest for 2 days.

 

Decision letter "Your current use of medication does not support any discomfort, or restriction, and you lack of need for medicine in recent time supports this I HAVE DECIDED YOU CAN WALK 200M UNAIDED" 

 

There's also various other little things. He uses disability aids to open jars, has an Alexa and automated diaries on his tablet and TV, which all give him notifications to take medicine, and anything else he has to do that day. he uses a large handle fork, he wont use his oven or anything he has ready meals cooked in a microwave, or occasionally some chips in a halogen oven. His kitchen is at the end of a hallway which he walks down resting his arm on the side of, because he has had a few falls in there before, and he rests himself on his walking stick and counter tops in the kitchen to keep balance but cant stand in there for more than 5 minutes or so (hence quick easy foods... or halogen oven which turns itself off when done, and he goes to fetch them when he feels able to do the short 20m walk again) He was under a CBT therapist, who discharged him because he was unable to complete any sessions, they decided he was not ready or suitable for them, so then they sent a therapist to his home... where he had a panic attack, during it, and they decided he was unable to be treated that way and that if he was OK with living a more hermit life then maybe thats just what he needs but he would be referred to another specialist, which never seemed to be followed up on (nor did hospital appointments in ENT, which were cancelled for Covid reasons), he is deaf in one ear but has no hearing aid (he doesn't like things in his ear, which is his own choice and I totally understand thats against him as does he)

 

In the decision letter, they decided that he can hear perfectly well as he held a conversation (Even though I had to tell him what was said EVERY question, and I did most of the talking when allowed), decided that his anxiety is not an issue as the specialists have discharged him so he must be fine, that he needs no aids for daily living, that he can stand and prepare a healthy meal for 30 minutes, and that no prompting is needing to look after himself in any of these situations.

I get that this is a decision maker, but how do I argue the term "I DECIDED" when their decision seems to be totally against what was said to them, and what has happened with his previous claim. How can he have gotten worse over the last year (which he has) but now get scored 0&0 compared to 12&8, just based on someone saying "You reported this, but I DECIDED the opposite"

How do I argue this for the reconsideration, when we've given all the information, given all the medical info required, they have on their system that the appointment was postponed (TWICE, BY THEM, BECAUSE THEY THOUGHT IT WAS A HEALTH RISK)... and some decision maker has just seemingly decided that she was going to end the benefit, and then made to no account as to why things were ignored, or not looked at in any way past just writing "I DECIDED you can do this stuff"

Thanks for any help.

 

 

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Hi.

 

I can feel your frustration, assessments aren't always fair as I found out some years ago. Was this assessment recorded at all?

 

HB

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Unfortunately not at our end. We had asked it to be recorded, and one of the ones cancelled by them due to health concerns was definitely recorded... But don't remember them saying this one was. 

 

 

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Try to claim attendance allowance, while waiting for the PIP appeals process to be completed ?

 

https://www.ageuk.org.uk/information-advice/money-legal/benefits-entitlements/attendance-allowance/

 

I would suggest contacting a disability rights charity to see if there is any local help.  They help with these appeals and have a good success rate.

 

WWW.SCOPE.ORG.UK

Find out how to appeal a decision about your claim for Personal Independence Payment (PIP) or other benefits.

 

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3 hours ago, unclebulgaria67 said:

Try to claim attendance allowance, while waiting for the PIP appeals process to be completed ?

 

https://www.ageuk.org.uk/information-advice/money-legal/benefits-entitlements/attendance-allowance/

 

I would suggest contacting a disability rights charity to see if there is any local help.  They help with these appeals and have a good success rate.

 

WWW.SCOPE.ORG.UK

Find out how to appeal a decision about your claim for Personal Independence Payment (PIP) or other benefits.

 

 

He can't claim attendance allowance until he is retirement age, but will be applying as soon as he is.

There is a disability rights company near me, who do help with this sort of thing. They helped my mother when her case was in need of appeal (they took a certain percentage of back payment as payment), and did help her win, after waiting 21months for her appeal to be heard. But they would only help with the appeal once it had gotten past the Mandatory Reconsideration level, I cant remember the reason for it but it was really hard to get them involved, which was annoying as I was meant to be doing it with her but had been ill and she decided to use them in case the stress of it made me worse.

 

I should state, my wife, mum, and dad are all in receipt of PIP... for different reasons, my father probably being the least ill of all of them (mother has heart failure and mobility issues, wife has life limiting life-long illness). Over the last 10 years, I've been to ESA and PIP assessments with my wife, mother and father and have had appeals for both where I have managed to get everything together and have successfully argued the case for them at Tribunal. I feel comfortable with the process, I've just never really had one that so blatantly seems to have been a case of "We're kicking this guy off to improve our numbers, just write that we decided everything is different to what he said".  It's really thrown me back, because the evidence provided to them completely go against what they decided, and they even mention the evidence in places, or that it has been mentioned that something is a concern or that he needs something... and they just write that they "decided" its completely the opposite. 

 

How do you even deal with that? I'll try a charity and look for more advice too, but just wondering if anyone else has had such a huge 180% turn, going from a total of 20points to 0points, with no reasons for the decision besides "I decided", and how they went about arguing their case for reconsideration

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Have seen similar outcomes being reported.

 

What you have to look at is which specific descriptors got him 12 & 8 before and how these were reported by medical professional in their report at the time. Then compare with the latest assessment report.

 

What are they saying is the current position to score 0 points ? 

 

This is what you need to do, carefully examine each aspect of a PIP assessment report.  Is what they have reported accurate ?  If it is not, then your Father needs to explain what he believes is the true position and provide any evidence available such as own GP report.

 

 

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4 hours ago, unclebulgaria67 said:

Have seen similar outcomes being reported.

 

What you have to look at is which specific descriptors got him 12 & 8 before and how these were reported by medical professional in their report at the time. Then compare with the latest assessment report.

 

What are they saying is the current position to score 0 points ? 

 

This is what you need to do, carefully examine each aspect of a PIP assessment report.  Is what they have reported accurate ?  If it is not, then your Father needs to explain what he believes is the true position and provide any evidence available such as own GP report.

 

 

 

Theircreason for zero points literally just seems to be that they decided. There's no reasons. It's frequently says "you said you are unable to do this. I decided you are able to do this" 

 

I shall dig up his old PIP assessment if we still have it, he tends to keep everything as he's a bit of a hoarder, and find out where he got his points and compare them to his current situation. 

 

Thanks for that advice, seems an obvious thing to do now but I never even thought of it. 

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