Arrow/Restons claimform - HSBC [1st direct] OD - Managed Loan debt

[saturdaykids]

Hi guys

I know its a little late in the day but is it worth sending CPR 31.14 overdraft specific to the solicitors, as I sent the one with five requests on. From threads I feel they play there cards close to their chests as regards to particulars of claim keeping it vague only to reveal there hand last minute,

[AndyOrch]

You could but I would assume you will only get the same response as per your post # 44

 

Andy

[saturdaykids]

Thanks Andy,

I'm sure I would! but as I am putting my defence together I thought it would hold more weight

Although from reading the threads more info will come forward as this progress's.

[AndyOrch]

Yes disclosure follows allocation...but the more questions you ask and request..the more the court will order them to disclose.

[saturdaykids]

so need to know as much about the hand they intend to play without giving any detail that can be used against me. I have an a thread in mind which pretty much mirrors my situation, so will adapt and post as soon as I can.

[saturdaykids]

guys,

the default was on the cc and not the od account which is in the POC and it was excessive charges that placed the account past the od limit. but here is the defence:

 

1.The claimant claims payment of the overdue balance due from the defendant(s) under a contract between the defendant(s) and HSBC dated on or about Jul 19 2000 and assigned to the claimant on Jan 21 2016

 

2.Particulars a/c no - xxxx

DATE 04/08/2017 ITEM Default Balance VALUE 11515.00

Post Refrl Cr NIL

Total 11515.00

 

What is the value of the claim? £12.133.00

1. Paragraph 1, I accept that I have held a current account with HSBC. I have not serviced this account since 2014 due to the punitive charges and interest being applied which made the account untenable and impossible to facilitate. The amount claimed is far in excess of any agreed overdraft limit with HSBC. I deny that the account exceeded an agreed overdraft limit due to overdrawing of funds and claim that this is a result of unfair and extortionate bank charges/penalties being applied to the account. It is therefore denied that I am indebted for any alleged outstanding residue.

 

2.Paragraph 2 is denied I do not admit to defaulting on payments nor receiving Notice served under 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974 Demand /Recall Notice and the Claimant is put to strict proof to evidence any breach.

 

3. Paragraph 3 is denied I have never been served a Notices of Assignment in accordance with s.136 Law of Property Act 1925.

 

4. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.

 

The claimant is also put to strict proof to:-.

 

(a) Provide a copy agreement/facility arrangement along with the Terms and conditions at inception, which this claim is based on.

(b) Provide a copy of the Notice served under 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974 Demand /Recall Notice and Notice of Assignment.

© Provide a breakdown of their excessive charging/fees levied to the account with justification.

(d) Show how the Claimant has reached the amount claimed.

(e) Show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim.

(f) Show how they have complied with sections III & IV of Practice Direction - Pre-action Conduct.

 

5. On receipt of this claim I immediately requested documentation by way of a CPR 31.14 request, which was received by the Claimant on the 7th July 2014. The Claimant has failed to comply with this request. Therefore the claimant in their non compliance to my requests have frustrated my attempts to clarify their claim and against pre action protocol should be considered when the question of costs arise.

 

By reason of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.

 

[saturdaykids]

haven't changed the CPR date in 5

[dx100uk]

I never signed up to nor did HSBC ever give me a £12k overdraft

They merged an alleged £xxK credit card debt into my account

[saturdaykids]

thanks for your response dx I will rewrite and also keep looking at threads unless you feel this is adequate.

[AndyOrch]

The claimant does not state or refer to an overdraft within its pleadings...they simply state " under a contract "

 

Dont add information that they are not aware of...if they wish to sue under a contract that allowed drawings of £12k..then they must provide the relevant agreement and paperwork to equate the 12k that their claim is based on.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[saturdaykids]

Thanks Andy, all the letters from claimant and solicitors note overdraft but of course its the POC that matters. will look for ideas in the threads. thanks again

[AndyOrch]

Thanks Andy, all the letters from claimant and solicitors note overdraft but of course its the POC that matters. will look for ideas in the threads. thanks again

 

Okay well if thats the case your response will have to read between the lines but also point out its inaccuracies of its pleadings

[saturdaykids]

Thanks for your response and time Andy,

I have searched the threads and have found what I feel to be use full, but without sounding paranoid should I post or pm some ideas.

[AndyOrch]

Please post here to your thread and then we can finalise a good defence.

[saturdaykids]

Thanks Andy,

so the situation is the acct. no. refers to a current acct. that was within the od facility it was charges that took it outside of the od limit. I do not recall any default notice on this acct. and the balance was under £900 and certainly not the 12k they say.

In my pleadings I am trying to put the claimant/solicitor to task to simply prove this contract/agreement exists as it clearly does not. so I am considering the following:

1.The claimant claims payment of the overdue balance due from the defendant(s) under a contract between the defendant(s) and HSBC dated on or about Jul 19 2000 and assigned to the claimant on Jan 21 2016

 

2.Particulars a/c no - xxxx

DATE 04/08/2017 ITEM Default Balance VALUE 11515.00

Post Refrl Cr NIL

Total 11515.00

1. The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.

 

2. The claim is denied with regards to any amount due under an agreement. The Claimant/Solicitor has refused to disclose any agreement or statements on which its claim relies upon.

 

3. I am unaware of any legal assignment the claimant refers to within its particulars and deny the notice was served pursuant to the Law of Property Act 1925.

 

On receipt of this claim I requested information pertaining to this claim from the Claimants Solicitors by way of a CPR 31.14.

To date I have yet to receive the requested paperwork.

 

Therefore with the courts permission the Claimant is put to strict proof to:

(a) Show and disclose how the Defendant has entered into an agreement; and

(b) Show and disclose how the Claimant has reached the amount claimed for;

© Show how the agreement(s) were breached/ terminated to allow the claimant relief;

(d) Show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim;

 

4. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5, it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.

 

5. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82A of the consumer credit Act 1974.

 

6. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.

[saturdaykids]

Hi Guys,

feel the above is suitable as their POC is vague and untrue. I'm sure it needs work though.

[AndyOrch]

What was your agreed authorised overdraft limit?

[saturdaykids]

Hi Andy,

was £800

[AndyOrch]

Particulars of Claim (for reference only)

 

 

1.The claimant claims payment of the overdue balance due from the defendant(s) under a contract between the defendant(s) and HSBC dated on or about Jul 19 2000 and assigned to the claimant on Jan 21 2016

 

2.Particulars a/c no - xxxx

DATE 04/08/2017 ITEM Default Balance VALUE 11515.00

Post Refrl Cr NIL

Total 11515.00

 

What is the value of the claim? £12.133.00

 

 

Defence

 

The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.

 

1. I accept that I have in the past held a current account with HSBC.My authorised overdraft limit was £800.00 I have not serviced this account since 2014 due to the punitive charges and interest being applied which made the account untenable and impossible to facilitate.

 

The amount claimed is far in excess of any agreed overdraft limit with HSBC. I deny that the account exceeded an agreed overdraft limit due to overdrawing of funds and claim that this is a result of unfair and extortionate bank charges/penalties being applied to the account.

 

It is therefore denied that I am indebted for any alleged outstanding residue. I have never been served a Notices of Assignment in accordance with s.136 Law of Property Act 1925.

 

2. I do not admit to defaulting on payments nor receiving Notice served under 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974 Demand /Recall Notice and the Claimant is put to strict proof to evidence any breach.

 

3. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.

 

The claimant is therefore put to strict proof to:-.

 

(a) Provide a copy agreement/facility arrangement along with conformation of the agreed Overdraft Limit complete with the Terms and conditions at inception, which this claim is based on.

(b) Provide a copy of the Notice served under 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974 Demand /Recall Notice and Notice of Assignment.

© Provide a breakdown of their excessive charging/fees levied to the account which equates to £11.200.00 of the claim

(d) Show how the Claimant has reached the amount claimed.

(e) Show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim.

(f) Show how they have complied with sections III & IV of Practice Direction - Pre-action Conduct.

 

4. On receipt of this claim I immediately requested documentation by way of a CPR 31.14 request. The Claimant has failed to comply with this request. Therefore the claimant in their non compliance to my requests have frustrated my attempts to clarify their claim and against pre action protocol should be considered when the question of costs arise.

 

5. By reason of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.

[saturdaykids]

Thanks Andy!!! that's fantastic . the issue date on the claim form was 15/9, so it gives me until the 18/10 I will use the mcol around the 16/10. thanks for your time it is greatly appreciated. will post outcome as and when. Thank you

[AndyOrch]

So basically if they want to argue its an amalgamated claim.....then they will have to amend their particulars.

 

Tues the 17th October 4.00pm is your deadline.

[saturdaykids]

Thanks again Andy I know its only the beginning but you guys allow people such peace of mind. will maintain thread to inform all of outcomes.

[saturdaykids]

Hey Guys,

just a look in as these 33 days take forever, thought it was up today so called the court was told no response so far but they have a little time yet. told him the 33 days were up today. He seemed to believe there was more time yet and suggested should know by the weekend did I get the YTS guy or what !

[AndyOrch]

No...not a YTS...simply staff dealing with 1000s of claims all at different stages........why are you ringing the court to check if the claim is stayed ?

 

Andy