Welcome secured loans/charge - sold to Alpha/Prime -repo received - ***Claim Dismissed***

[cruzhughes]

What do I need to be getting together ready for the court date in case I have to go? Still not heard anything from alpha either

[cruzhughes]

8 weeks were up 2 days ago from my first complaint to Alpha on 8th march. Still not heard anything.

 

I've also just logged in through Pcol and they didn't even upload an amount for the arrears when they issued the possession claim

[cruzhughes]

I have just received a rather interesting letter from prime in response of my complaint letter.

 

Still not getting anywhere and they are still after another £9 for the SAR when it was a CCA I wanted.

 

They have offered £150 compensation for the distress.

 

Statement attached same as last with solicitors fees added. Nothing credited

 

Will inbox you both now

 

And still no copies of correspondence that had been sent to wrong addresses.

 

Laughing at the comment that they are in the process of obtaining the £7888 from Welcome. Especially as I havebit in writing that Welcome paid them in jan

2017-05-04 Prime Credit REsponse.pdf

[cruzhughes]

Have you received letter?

 

Where do I take this next?

 

The FOS or wait.

. still no notice of assignment and.

Credit agreement from prime.

 

They also state they have enclosed copies of previous letters.

They haven't

[dx100uk]

ive put the letter earlier

 

 

quite interesting really

so they've cancelled the repo then..

 

 

and refunded the fees for sols

but given you pittance for the mistake ..

 

 

dx

[cruzhughes]

I haven't signed the form accepting the money.. I was waiting for you to read it and give me you opinion.

 

I really want to write and say they haven't enclosed previous letters though.

 

They haven't even bothered to remove what they'd said they'd remove on the statement!

 

Can you explain the difference between a CCA and MCOB please? And how this would affect me. Especially as it changed in march 2016. Last loan was 2008

[dx100uk]

but the have cancelled the repo?

 

 

dx

[cruzhughes]

I don't understand what your saying

 

. I know the repo was cancelled as the solictors wrote to me last week. I posted that on here too!

[cruzhughes]

At last an answer from the FSCS about the questions I raised since jan. What's your verdict?

 

RE: Your complaint

 

Thank you for contacting us in relation to your enquiry.

 

We’re sorry that you’re unhappy with the handling of your claim. I’ve looked into your complaint, taking into account the points you raised.

 

My understanding of your complaint is that you have sent several emails requesting further information that have not been replied to or acknowledged.

 

You have also raised several questions and points I have listed these below and I will answer these in turn.

 

• What loan does this compensation relate to

• Who is the insurer?

• Who will the compensation go to Welcome Finance or Alpha Credit

• How much is your existing balance with Welcome

• You also want your Medicare, Life care, Homecare and personal accident policies to be assessed under this claim.

• You want your Legal Charge removed

 

Your claim was found to be eligible under our rules and policies and, having established that you suffered a financial loss, compensation was calculated under our rules.

 

As you’re aware, we assessed your total compensation in respect of the mis-sold insurance at £7,888.39 and we deducted this from your outstanding loan, with Welcome. This compensation was based on a total PPI premium of £10,723.67 that was for loan agreements: 2320257, 2444303, 2629661, and 3236984. These are all of the loans you had with Welcome Finance that had PPI attached.

 

After reviewing your file I am unable to specifically confirm who the Insurer was. The reason for this is because we have an arrangement with Welcome where they provide policy specific information and documents relevant to the claim. All of the insurance information that we required to assess your claim was provided by Welcome. You will need to contact them directly and they can provide you with the name of the Insurer and your policy number.

 

In terms of who will receive your compensation this will be sent to Welcome Finance and this process can take approximately three months from the date the compensation was awarded.

 

The information that Welcome provided to us shows that your outstanding balance with them on the date the information was sent was £26,152.32. However this figure may have changed so you will need to confirm the exact amount with Welcome.

 

In your Communications to us you have mentioned other policies that you feel were mis-sold and I have listed these above and you have indicated that you expected these to be included within this review. We look at each claim on an individual basis and as these were for different products they would need to be assessed under different criteria by product specific specialists. If you would like to make further claims you would need to complete an individual application form and send in the required evidence for each one and these will be assessed if they fall within our remit. If you require assistance or need further information on which financial products are covered under the scheme you can contact our helpline on 0800 678 1100 or by visiting our website at http://www.fscs.org.uk

 

You have mentioned in your correspondence that you are requesting for Welcome to remove the legal charge. FSCS can only investigate claims for compensation regarding activities regulated by the Financial Conduct Authority (“FCA”). Secured loans and personal loans are unregulated products, and are not protected by FSCS. Claims regarding removing legal charges on loans fall outside of our remit which means we’re unable to investigate such issues on your behalf.

 

We can’t pay compensation for all claims brought against a firm. A claim brought to us must be in relation to what is considered a ‘protected claim’ as defined in chapter five of the COMP rules.

 

COMP 5.2.1 R confirms a protected claim is:

 

(1) a claim for a protected deposit or a protected dormant account (see COMP 5.3)

(2) a claim under a protected contract of insurance (see COMP 5.4); or

(3) a claim in connection with protected investment business (see COMP 5.5); or

(4) a claim in connection with protected home finance mediation5 (see COMP 5.6); or

(5) a claim in connection with protected non-investment insurance mediation (see COMP 5.7).

 

Your loan doesn’t fall within the criteria for a protected claim, and so is not within our remit to consider. As explained above, we must follow the rules we’re governed by at all times.

 

As your loan is not protected business, I’m sorry, but we can’t help you further with this issue. FSCS can only consider claims relating to the mis-sale of regulated products. The sale of a PPI policy added to a loan would fall in this category however, the sale or issues surrounding a loan doesn’t. You may wish to speak to your local branch of the Citizens Advice Bureau for further advice on matters relating to your loan.

 

Finally I would like to apologise that your questions and enquiries were left unanswered and for the lack of communication from us. I am sorry if you feel the service you have received up to now has not been satisfactory. Your feedback is appreciated as we are constantly trying to improve the experience for our customers. I hope this letter has answered your questions and explains in part what we can and can’t investigate.

 

Any questions?

 

If you have any further questions, please contact me using the details below.

 

Yours sincerely

[cruzhughes]

Do I need to send this prime a SAR now or sit tight? I have not received anything from court saying hearing is cancelled

[cruzhughes]

unless you hear otherwise from the COURT

you go.

it could be a very important nail it their coffin.

if it goes ahead

they don't turn up

and you do.

 

 

dx

 

Still nothing from the court the hearing is the 24th may. What do I need to be getting together and saying to the judge?

[Ell-enn]

Have you rung the court to check ?

[cruzhughes]

Not yet. I will do that first thing. Nothing on PCOL saying it's been adjourned.

[cruzhughes]

Just come off phone to court. It hasn't been adjourned yet.

 

I still have to attend and the judge would only adjourn on the day that's only if he accepts the letter that alpha have already sent into the court and that would be looked at by him on the day of the hearing.

 

What do I need to get together.?

 

How do I go about telling the judge all the welcome saga of the irresponsible lending and what has happened since alpha have purchased the debt?

 

Are there any other things I would have to bring up with the judge?

[Ell-enn]

You use the statement you sent in with the N244

[cruzhughes]

I haven't filled in any N244 wasn't it a N11?

[Ell-enn]

Sorry - it's the N11 then

[cruzhughes]

Would I need to speak to the judge about the other stuff too? Would he ask me for background on the debt?

 

What questions am I likely to be asked so I can prepare myself?

[cruzhughes]

Got everything ready. How long will I be in there the time of hearing is 15.50.

 

How do I prepare for this? What is the judge going to ask me?

[cruzhughes]

2 days left before I go to court. The nerves are kicking right in now.

[Ell-enn]

Do you know if there are any duty legal advisors in attendance on the day of your hearing?

[cruzhughes]

when I took everything to the court last month there was no legal advisor there and told to go CAB or shelter Cymru for advice.

They also said they couldn't say if one would be there on the day

[cruzhughes]

Well the day has finally arrived.

 

I've made a pile of notes in case the judge asks me anything. Figures of what has been paid to date. What they say they are owed and the 197 months left of £231.49 which comes to another £45,603.53

 

Would be a grand total of over 70 grand paid back for a £27000 rewrite in 2008 . That started at 5 grand 7 years earlier with hardly any money changing hands in all them 9 rewrites. Unbelievable! I feel sick. A debt of that amount an very little financial gain to the person who took them out. This time last year I really thought 27 grand had been borrowed now I know it hadn't.

 

At worse The cheapest and shortest way to get rid of this loan would be a remortgage for the outstanding balance if it comes to that. Which is possible.

 

Safe to say I am bricking it guys!

 

Ps Fscs are looking into a further reclaim on the other insurances that they didn't include last time homecare, life care, accident plans.

 

They do not cover the MIF though

[dx100uk]

from my notes:

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?318323-Old-Welcome-Debt&highlight=postggj

.

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?304631-Welcome-Finance-PPI-and-Mr-Z&highlight=reclaim+MIF

.

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?251405-Welcome-Secured-Loan-agreement.

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?304631-Welcome-Finance-PPI-and-Mr-Z&highlight=reclaim+MIF.

.

As per the post above the MIF is not for insurance. Welcome have admited on more than a few occassions that it is not insurance....Never has been, never will be.

.

The real question is where does the money go? They will tell you its a fee in relation to being a higher risk, and that by charging this fee, and the interest it attracts, it helps to cover them in the event of a shortfall. They will also tell you that whilst many lenders do use the fee to purchase insurance, they never have.

.

This is not only stated in the Griffith v Welcome case, but I also have it in writing directly from them.

"The MIF is a fee that can be charged by lenders when the value of loans secured on a property is at a level similar to the value of the property.

.

It is an additional form of protection for the lender in the event that they are required to repossess the property and are unable to recover all of the monies are outstanding under an agreement (i.e. there is a shortfall).

.

In such circumstances, the lender is entitled to pursue the borrower for the shortfall.

.

As can be seen by the terms and conditions of your agreement, you were charged a MIF, which meant that should the situation described above arise you would not be pursued for any shortfall.

.

This was not an insurance policy although some lenders do take out insurance policies for this purpose.

.

It was what could be described as a 'waiver fee'. It was decided in Griffiths -v- Welcome Financial Services (2006) EWHC 3769 (QB) that the charging of the fee by a lender but not actually taking out an insurance policy was entirely reasonable."

.............

collected from some thread on here .

.

dx

.

The MIF has not been tested in court as far as I know, I certainly will be testing it though, its a big part of my claim against them.

..

 

Last edited by MrZ; 16th August 2011 at 19:35.

.

I too am uncertain of the legalities regarding the MIF.

.

I have seen and read the threads I can find about it.

.

I started a separate thread, which is now merged with this one specifically asking about the MIF.

.

This is what I have been able to gather so far pertaining to the MIF.

.

1. Its been said that it should only be applied to mortagages or secured loans of 25,000.00 or more.

(I have not seen and regulation yet that states this)

.

2. Its been said that it should be 75% loan to value (I have not seen any regulation that states this)

.

3. mortgage Indeminty Fee is a fee to be used to purchase insurance.

(This is not a regulation per se, but rather an industry norm.

mortgage lenders will charge this fee and then use the fee to purchase insurance to protect against a shortfall)

.

4. In the case of Welcome, they are not using this fee to purchase insurance.

(I have yet to see any explanation from Welcome as to why they charge the fee)

.

5. Welcome are treating this fee as a Charge for Credit and it attracts interest at the same daily rate or AIR.

.

So having gathered the above information from this forum and other resources,

it is my intention to write Welcome regarding only the MIF.

.

I will not include it as part of any other complaint or claim,

as I want to ensure it doesnt get "muddled over" or lost amongst other issues.

.

I dont want to give them room to wriggle out of an explanation.

.

I am drafting the letter today and will definitely update this thread once I have a reply.

.

MIF is a fee the debtor pays incase there is a shortfall on the loan

.

this fee is an insurance policy/product

.

you paid for it so ask welcome for the insurance policy.

i can tell you now there will be none

.

it goes into welcomes own pot under WELCOME ELITE BROKERS

.

YOU NEED TO BE ASKING WELCOME WHO THIS MONEY WAS PAID TO AND DEMAND PROOF VIA ANPOLICY NUMBER AND DATE AND WHO THIS FEE WAS PAID TO

.

ILL LAY EVEN MONEY NORWICH UNION/AVIVA

.

[cruzhughes]

I'm here. No duty solicitors here dobt have them in county court apparently