Exhaust damage while at Authorized dealer

[KOGE19]

Hello All,

 

I have a Honda which I gave to an authorized dealer for sevice.The car is about 10+ years old.the car drives and runs fine.Yesterday I gave it to an authorized dealer in west London to flush the CVT transmission oil to solve a clutch judder problem, which is a known issue on this car.I thought I can get the service done as well. All in the grand total was 500£.

 

In between the service they called me up and tried getting extra work done quoting the discs and pads need replacing.I politely declined since the car passed it's MOT 4 months ago without any advisories.

 

After that phone call I get another call saying the exhaust needs replacing which I politely decline.However they say it's on the verge of breaking.I said since its not broken yet I can get it fixed.

 

Long story short the exhaust was fine when we gave it for service.It was roaring like an F1 car when they delivered it back.the Payment was taken by phone.

I think they damaged it when they got it onto the ramp and hence the emergency phone call to replace the exhaust and the extra caveats that it can blow "anytime".

 

When I called them they said it was coincidence that the car had blown the exhaust after service.

 

I know damage was done whilst in their possession. If I were them I would make sure that the undercarriage was in good shape before I mounted it on the ramp.

 

Do I have any legal recourse ? My wife needs the car and I can't make it wait for weeks and will need to get it fixed soon or rent a car. Would fixing the car change my legal position?

Thanks,George

Edited April 23, 2016 by KOGE19

[Hammy1962]

Crawl under car and take a picture of the noisy bit of the exhaust.

 

Link to it and we can diagnose from the picture.

 

You should always check your undercarriage before mounting!

 

H

[heliosuk]

When I called them they said it was coincidence that the car had blown the exhaust after service.

 

I know damage was done whilst in their possession. If I were them I would make sure that the undercarriage was in good shape before I mounted it on the ramp.

Do I have any legal recourse ?

Thanks,George

 

 

Probably not. There is a duty of care whilst in their position but you'd have to prove that they abused it so causing the failure. Where you state they called for extra work, this is routine practice and is based on the dealership following manufactures recommendations/specifications. This is not the same as an MOT by any means.

A similar thing happened to me many years ago when I worked for a Bavarian Motor Works and you had to check the timing and advance at some ridiculous RPM and the torque convertor and gear box let go. Customer went to court

 

 

 

 

and lost!!! Costs were awarded against the claimant as well.

[king12345]

If the exhaust was already faulty it will be evident: Rust and corrosion at blowing point, mounting brackets rusted and broken, connectors welding cracked.

A fresh damage would also be evident.

If they've deliberately undone some bolts to make the exhaust blow it will show wd40 on the bolts and wrench marks.

A hammer blow is also evident.

Get under the car and take some pictures of the blowing point

[Old Cogger]

fresh damage would be evident so take pictures if so!

[KOGE19]

Hello All.

 

Thanks for all the responses. Sorry for the delay in replying. I got the car fixed at the local garage for 86£ today. Honda offered to fix the issue provided I paid for the part , quoting 240£ (inc VAT)., they said they could waive the labor. However, even before I escalated the issue they were quoting 240£ (though I am not sure if they meant labor would be charged separate).

 

I don't think they purposely broke it, they were probably careless a bit. I think the middle piece of the exhaust was on its way out and them putting the car on the ramp broke it - in short they made me spend 86£ which I could have spend 6 months later,today.

 

In my opinion, they should have done an inspection of the under carriage before getting it onto the ramp - since its a visually inspect-able item. Of course, if they escalated the issue to me and told me there is a possibility of the exhaust getting damaged , I would have most probably told them to not do the service and just do the CVT flush - this of course is lost revenue for them - but I guess in my mind the Honda dealer would have gold rating.

 

In this case what the dealer did was be cheeky and try to hard sell the exhaust to me after breaking it(due to carelessness and age of the part).

 

However, I have to say that I always doubt main dealers - somehow I always land up with a 500£+ yearly bill when servicing my Prius , Avensis and Jazz at the main dealer. Good example is the Jazz itself , I was told that the front discs and pads needed replacing immediately. The local garage did a road-rolling test today( I think its used to test brakes during the MOT) and recommended not to change anything on the front. This is inline with the MOT test not having any advisories 4 months ago. Safety is utmost consideration to me, but , pulling on the emotional line to get me change more than required is too much.

 

Honda still won at the end of the day - they took 500£ directly for a car worth 1650£.

 

Thanks for all the advice. I decided it was better to move on and not hold it against them and have a working(and silent) car.

[Hammy1962]

So, no pictures then, that's a shame because now we'll never know who was right.

 

Exhaust's don't get damaged on ramps.............. at either a main dealer or an independent.

 

H

[KOGE19]

Sorry , could not get any pictures. The independent dealer felt it was related to age as well. The rear end of the exhaust will also need replacing at some point - This is what I have been told by him.

 

About the damage, when my wife parked the car at the dealership, it was not blowing. When the technician drove it into the workshop for work,it was not blowing - they would have informed me it needed replacing when they called me to ask about the disc brakes and pads. It broke some time after the first call they made - what they did and how it got to that state they probably know. The car is driven on a lot of road bumps etc so if it were that weak it would have blown long time ago.

[heliosuk]

You need to be careful in how you interpret the mot test and what the manufacture deems to be the minimum specified. For example with brake discs, you might and can come across a situation where the mot states they meet the required standard in terms of brake force but this is a low speed test and doesn't really reflect real world operating conditions at high speed. If the thickness is below the minimum specified it will pass the mot as they don't measure it but at high speed it will or could potentially cause problems.

So far from dealers trying to rip people off its more likely they are actually doing you a favour!

[KOGE19]

Thanks Heliosuk,

 

I agree with what you are saying. The specific difficulty I have is that some garages recommend changing the discs and some dont. Honda and Halfords have recommended to change them. Kwik Fit and the independent garage today recommended it was not required. Safety comes first for sure , but , also I hope not to do away with the discs before they have reached the end of their safe usable life.

 

Is there a calliper or measurement tool I could use to measure the thickness myself?

 

Thanks,

George.

[heliosuk]

Well the first thing to do is to check what the minimum thickness is stamped on the disc. If Kiki con or a dealer says they need changing ask what the minimum thickness is specified. As an engineer in the industry and specialising in chassis systems I can tell you that below thickness should be an automatic change but on the limit another pad set is acceptable as at the next pad change they will be under. And thus require changing. You can measure the thickness with a micrometer but sometimes it's difficult to get it in because of the back plate if fitted and so requires the removal but not disconnect of the calliper. You need to take readings every 120 degrees and take the average, more if possible. If under the minimum spec then change, if on the limit another set of pads is allowable.

Whilst I write, another common falsify is pull drift issues frequently seen posted here on this forum and answers from people who think they know but actually don't and this is often reflected in dealerships but is rife in fast fit stores.

Front end tracking has absolutely zero effect on pulling issues. Rear end and tyre conicity are the major players in this but once ruled out then one should be looking at castor and camber values to adjust which is not as easy as it seems.

 

So hopefully now your better informed. Sorry about the exhaust but things like this do happen and it's so easy to point a finger at someone or an organisation who has done nothing wrong. As in a previous post it's happened to me.