@lidluk Civil Parking Charge Notice From Athena - Advice Sought **CANCELLED**

[misread]

I’ve noticed that some kind folks on this site have provided advice to people who have been sent extortionate parking charge notices.

I have received such a notice,

and will be very grateful for any advice on whether I am likely to be able to avoid the charge,

and how to go about doing so.

The specifics relating to my case are:

The car park attached to our local Lidl store used to allow one hour’s free parking

(I believe ostensibly for customers, but actually used by non-customers also);

this allowance has evidently been changed without my noticing it as I have received from Athena ANPR Ltd.

a “Civil Parking Charge Notice” demanding £90,

subject to a discount of £45 if paid within 14 days.

I parked in the car park on 16th September (but did not purchase anything in Lidl),

and received the notice today, 20th September.

I returned to the car park today to check signage (picture attached);

the period of free parking for non-customers is now 10 minutes,

which period I exceeded by 21 minutes.

While I accept I was daft to miss the new signs,

and am quite happy to pay reasonable parking charges,

I believe that this kind of charge is completely unacceptable.

My question for anyone knowledgeable on this subject is whether I have a good case to fight this charge

as a non-customer of Lidl, and if so, how best to go about it.

Many thanks in advance to anyone prepared to help.

[lenny100]

how do they tell none customers from customers? do you have some sort of reg entering machine at the tills?

[misread]

Apparently, customers now register on the parking system when they go into the store

[dx100uk]

so this was an anpr capture then?

 

 

dx

[armadillo71]

I’ve noticed that some kind folks on this site have provided advice to people who have been sent extortionate parking charge notices.

I have received such a notice,

and will be very grateful for any advice on whether I am likely to be able to avoid the charge,

and how to go about doing so.

The specifics relating to my case are:

The car park attached to our local Lidl store used to allow one hour’s free parking

(I believe ostensibly for customers, but actually used by non-customers also);

this allowance has evidently been changed without my noticing it as I have received from Athena ANPR Ltd.

a “Civil Parking Charge Notice” demanding £90,

subject to a discount of £45 if paid within 14 days.

I parked in the car park on 16th September (but did not purchase anything in Lidl),

and received the notice today, 20th September.

I returned to the car park today to check signage (picture attached);

the period of free parking for non-customers is now 10 minutes,

which period I exceeded by 21 minutes.

While I accept I was daft to miss the new signs,

and am quite happy to pay reasonable parking charges,

I believe that this kind of charge is completely unacceptable.

My question for anyone knowledgeable on this subject is whether I have a good case to fight this charge

as a non-customer of Lidl, and if so, how best to go about it.

Many thanks in advance to anyone prepared to help.

 

 

This charge is a penalty disguised (badly) as a contractual charge.

 

 

As a non customer of Lidl, you can park in the car park for £45. That is what the sign states. But how do you pay the sum after reading the sign?

 

 

A simple appeal to Athena should be sent.

 

 

' As registered keeper of vehicle reg. XXX XXX, I am appealing parking charge notice no. XXXXXXX.

 

 

I believe this charge to be an illegal penalty charge and consequently I am not liable to pay this sum.

 

 

Please cancel this charge forthwith , or alternatively issue me with a validation code for the independent appeals service POPLA.

 

 

This appeal has been sent with proof of postage. '

 

 

Come back with Athena's response.

 

 

You will not have to pay any money to anybody regarding this invoice....

[misread]

so this was an anpr capture then?

 

 

dx

 

Yes, notice included entry & exit photos of car

[misread]

This charge is a penalty disguised (badly) as a contractual charge.

 

 

As a non customer of Lidl, you can park in the car park for £45. That is what the sign states. But how do you pay the sum after reading the sign?

 

 

A simple appeal to Athena should be sent.

 

 

' As registered keeper of vehicle reg. XXX XXX, I am appealing parking charge notice no. XXXXXXX.

 

 

I believe this charge to be an illegal penalty charge and consequently I am not liable to pay this sum.

 

 

Please cancel this charge forthwith , or alternatively issue me with a validation code for the independent appeals service POPLA.

 

 

This appeal has been sent with proof of postage. '

 

 

Come back with Athena's response.

 

 

You will not have to pay any money to anybody regarding this invoice....

 

OK, I'll do as you say and report back.

 

Many thanks

[misread]

Update...

 

 

Appeal sent exactly as advised, with proof of posting, on 22nd September.

 

 

I've had no reply so far.

 

 

Am I right in thinking they are in breach of their Association's code of practice as they have not replied to my appeal within 14 days?

 

 

Is there any further action I need to take?

 

 

Many thanks for any advice.

[armadillo71]

Update...

 

 

Appeal sent exactly as advised, with proof of posting, on 22nd September.

 

 

I've had no reply so far.

 

 

Am I right in thinking they are in breach of their Association's code of practice as they have not replied to my appeal within 14 days?

 

 

Is there any further action I need to take?

 

 

Many thanks for any advice.

 

According to the BPA code of practice that Athena must follow, they have thirty five days to respond to the appeal ,after notifying you within fourteen days that they are addressing your appeal.

 

I suspect you will either get a reminder to pay letter from Athena, or a debt recovery letter saying you now ' owe ' considerably more money...

 

They will say they have not received an appeal( I'm guessing ), but you have proof of postage so are covered.

 

Do no more until you receive something else in the post.

[misread]

OK, thanks for that.

 

 

I'll post an update as soon as I receive anything from them.

[ericsbrother]

If they fail to follow the protocols then they cannot pursue the keeper of the vehicle, only the driver, who is unknown to them and it is their responsibility to identify who that was.

I suspect that you will get a threatogram or two from a DCA and then after a while it will go quiet.

[misread]

I've today received an "Overdue Reminder" from Athena; please see the uploaded copy with my details removed.

 

 

In it they say they have rejected my appeal, and have previously sent me a letter explaining why - no such letter was received by me.

 

 

As you will see, there is no mention in this document of a POPLA number or appeal.

 

 

Should I reply to this stating that I haven't received their previous letter, and referring to POPLA?

 

 

I will be very grateful for advice on the next step I should take.

 

 

Many thanks in advance.

[ericsbrother]

After 35 days they are timed out. let them make their errors and accept the consequences of their stupidity. Ignore this missive and when you get another one after the 35 dyas has expired tell them that they are timed out for keeper liability under the POFA and to stop harassing you.

[misread]

OK, I'll do as you say and ignore it.

 

 

When I saw the reference in this "reminder" to their having already sent me a letter rejecting my appeal, I did wonder whether they are trying to prevent me appealing to POPLA within the timescale to do so, and was tempted to contact them for a copy of said letter. I resisted the temptation to contact them - I imagine it would, in any event, be for them to prove they sent it.

 

 

I'll report back with anything further I receive from them.

 

 

Many thanks again for your advice and support.

[misread]

I've received a further notice from Athena - a "Final Demand" - please see attached copy with my details removed.

 

 

Should I respond to this, or just ignore it in the same way as the previous "Reminder"?

 

 

Many thanks in advance for advice.

Edited November 27, 2014 by misread

[ericsbrother]

no, you reply telling them that they were timed out to claim keeper responsibility under the PoFA 2012 and that any furhter communication from them will be treated as harassment and you will be entitled to seek civil remedy without further notice.

[misread]

OK, I'll do that.

 

 

Many thanks again for the advice.

[misread]

I wrote to Athena stating that they failed to acknowledge or reply to my appeal within 14 days, have not replied subsequently to my appeal, and are thus beyond the time allowed to pursue me as keeper of the vehicle. I stated that I'll consider further communication as harassment, worded as advised above.

 

They have now sent me a rejection of my appeal, dated 26 September (see attachment), in an envelope franked/postmarked 4 December!

 

They have also amended the due date to 26 December for the full charge, and the due date for a reduced charge to 12 December (original notice 18 September, demanding 50% payment within 14 days).

 

They have provided a POPLA code on this letter.

 

I'll be grateful for advice on whether I should write to them again reiterating that they are out of time, and pointing out the inconsistencies in their correspondence and dates, or should I simply ignore this latest letter?

 

Many thanks in advance for any advice.

Edited December 6, 2014 by misread

[armadillo71]

Check when the code was generated here;

 

 

http://www.parkingcowboys.co.uk/popla-code-checker/

 

 

Now as you know, there is no keeper liability as they are out of time. And they know as well. The letter only mentions the drivers responsibility...

As RK you could ignore it, but if the POPLA code is valid, then you could cost them money by appealing . And win easily.

It is up to you.

[misread]

Many thanks for the response.

 

 

I've checked when the code was generated - 26 September according to the website linked in your message (and also now appeal-expired according to the message displayed with the date).

 

 

Does this mean that they did raise a POPLA code on 26 September, even though they didn't reply to me at that time, or can they somehow generate or fake a back-dated number?

 

 

They are effectively admitting they didn't reply in the timescale (reply sent 4 December, changed due dates), and are now apparently supplying me with a POPLA code I may not be able to use, anyway.

 

 

If I do submit an appeal to POPLA, I will have to explain that it is time-expired due to Athena not following the rules. I wonder whether POPLA would then go ahead considering the appeal (based on the charge being an illegal penalty charge) knowing that Athena are out of time anyway.

 

 

I'll be very grateful for further advice.

[ericsbrother]

the number is genuine but some companies have a problem sending them out in time. It is suspected that this is done as they a) dont want to spend £27 on an appeal and b) they know they are likely to lose a properly constructed appeal anyway so the £27 will be doubly wasted.

A complaint to POPLA and copied to the BPA will probably get you a new appeal code if you want to go down that route but yu can choose to ignore them. the only problem with ignoring them is proving they sat on the code until it expired should they want to go down the court route so get your complaint in. I hope you have the previous correspondence and envelope for this latest dud. This will doom them so photocopy it in your complaint.

[misread]

Complaint to POPLA (including copy of envelope), and copy to BPA prepared - I'll mail them with proof of posting tomorrow.

 

 

I'll report back when/if I receive replies or further correspondence from Athena.

 

 

Many thanks for advice.

[ericsbrother]

good, you will only get a perfunctory reply but I bet you get a letter fro Athena saying that they have reconsidered and are now issuing a new POPLA code. Despite the fact they have wilfully ignored the law, their trade association wont sanction them but allow them another chance to rob you. Good isnt it?

[armadillo71]

A POPLA code can be generated at anytime, so there is no excuse for it not to be correctly dated for the newly sent correspondence.

 

You may well get a ' goodwill ' gesture of cancellation of the charge to save themselves time, ,trouble and money...

[misread]

Update/Charge cancelled

 

I received a reply from POPLA (looks like a standard reply) stating that my letter cannot be registered as an appeal and that I should contact the operator to obtain a verification code. On the face of it, this is an absurd and illogical reply as my letter to them is a complaint about being denied the ability to appeal by the operator providing an out-of-date code long after the time allowed to do so. Having said that, it ties in with the information on their website that refers only to the appeals process and complaints against the POPLA adjudicator.

 

The BPA did “investigate” and replied to me stating that the operator had sent their rejection on the 26th September, and that they “re-sent” their letter on receipt of my letter telling them they are time-expired. Yeah, right!

 

The BPA also informed me that the operator has cancelled the charge “in view of the inconvenience caused”.

 

I have duly received the confirmation of cancellation from Athena.

 

Many thanks for all the advice and support.

I will, of course, be making a donation to this excellent website.