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    • In that case, it's crazy to me that part of their defence includes the following: 2.52. ‘The amount of Full Cover which you have taken out for a Parcel, if at all, will be the extent of our liability to you for any Loss or Damage to your Parcel.’ 2.53. ‘Full Cover’ is defined as ‘optional enhanced compensation that you may,for a fee, take out when you submit an order.’ 2.54. 26. Accordingly, the Contract terms limits the Defendant’s liability for loss or damage to a parcel (in contract and/or negligence) to a particular value (as determined by clause 5), for the loss or damage to goods. That  compensation value is the lesser of £20 or the value of the damaged/lost goods plus postage. 2.55. 27. The Claimant did not opt to increase the level of compensation for The Parcel and therefore pursuant to the terms of the Contract the Claimant is entitled to maximum compensation in the sum of £23.44. -> If they know they can't do this, why include it in their defence.  THe second part I'm worried about is this section: 2.24. 20. The twenty first paragraph of the Particulars of Claim is noted. It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to £169.00 in respect of the Parcel. It is the Defendant’s primary position that the Claimant is entitled to £23.44 in respect of the Parcel under the terms of the Contract. Without prejudice to the Defendant’s primary position, the Claimant valued the Parcel at £150.00 when ordering the Defendant’s delivery services. The Defendant requests evidence from the Claimant as to the reasoning for the difference in valuations from the Claimant. -> like I said, I have proof of receipt of the actual price of the jacket, I had email correspondence with the brand asking if they have received my jacket and included the EVRI tracking number. The parcel is also clearly labelled to return back to the store.  I've also shared all of this, and even provided the receipt in my claim lost parcel to EVRI It's a shame I put the estimated value of the item when posting back, rather than the exact. I was in a rush and just put a rough figure I had from memory (again, lesson learned)
    • Thanks for letting us know. It always helps to get feedback. I'm surprised at the addition of the surcharge. Yes, it must be imposed by law but the usual way to get round it is to make the fine £72 and the surcharge £28. You could argue that if they accepted that you did comply with the conditions of the offer you should not be disadvantaged at all and there is adequate mechanism for that. Their Legal Advisor (the person sitting in front of them) should have advised them accordingly. All in all a decent - if slightly incorrect - outcome and appealing against the sentence is probably not worth the hassle. As you say, "lessons learned" (but of course you won't be caught speeding again, will you?  😀
    • Good morning,  I am back here as I have my court hearing on the 16/1/24 and wanted to prepare myself. I have started to read through the cases here where people in similar situations have gone to court and the recently added court transcript. I will continue to read about third party rights. Is there anything else you feel would help.  Many thanks
    • Okay. Thanks for this. If you redact documents in future, please could you be a bit more delicate about it so that we have a more careful idea about what is missing and we don't get the impression that may be something important is covered up. You will get your money back – but it's important that you realise now that you are in control. Read the stories. Read the advice that we give in the pinned treads at the top of the sub- forum. Ask us questions. The mediation process really doesn't involve much law. It really is just about stating your position and that making it clear that you won't back down and you were prepared to go to court. There is no reason why you should give up a single penny. I can appreciate that it is heartbreaking. There will be thousands of people this Christmas season who have parcels disappearing either through carelessness by EVRi or by theft committed by their own staff and people will be heartbroken. Despite that, EVRi will continue to try and defy people's legitimate claims. They run an insurance system which is unenforceable under section 57 of the consumer rights act. This is not a real insurance in that there is not a commercial insurance where it is simply just money in their pockets. My estimate is that EVRi themselves are earning several billions of pounds per year of unearned and undeserved money and the parcel delivery industry as a whole is probably earning £10 billion per year in exactly the same way. This is why they are so greedy about it and this is why they are so enthusiastic about not giving up a single inch. And of course it is the consumer who pays the bill. And this is billions of pounds every year which is removed from the UK economy.
    • Thank you so much, the first line just contained my home address, hence why I redacted that section in the second page. The claim form starts from point 3.15, I've posted everything honestly, it's my first time dealing with matters like this (and I hope to never do this again in the future) and I've stumbled - so I suppose I just felt really overwhelmed and treated unjustly about the situation after seeing their defence statement.  I had saved up so much money to buy this jacket for autumn, and was so excited to own it, it wasn't the right size so I wanted to return it, get my refund and purchase it again in the right size, and it's just led to this whole mess by EVRI.  I didn't even receive the £23 compensation, I checked my bank account again yesterday and still don't see it, so they are wrong in that matter.  I'm going to draft up my mediation open statement and post it here, it's booked for the 11th 
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.


      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Bad service in post offices

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I keep getting bad service from post offices. Some are completely fine, but in particular, the one around the corner to me where I work is terrible.


I sell an item in particular on eBay which is 50g, and comes under the 'Large Letter' size.


I either post them 1st class, or 1st class signed for, depending on which version is sold.


This is the dialog that happened last time, but usually have to deal with it every time, no matter how many times I say 1st class signed for. Some times they don't tell me they have decided to send it using a special service and bill me for it anyway.


Another time my girlfriend went for me, and they actually wouldn't let her send it using signed for, they pushed her to send it using the next day by 9AM service costing something like £9!


Me: "Hello, could I send this one 1st class signed for please?"


Them: "Yes, when do you want it to arrive by?"


Me: "Tomorrow."


Them: "That will be £7.68"


Me: "1st class signed for is usually £2.34"


Them: "Yes I know that sir [sarcastically], but next day is £7.68".


Me: "I said I wanted it 1st class signed for."


Them: "That is not next day."


Me: "I just want it 1st class signed for."


Them: "Ok fine, that is £2.34"


Me: "Thanks, how long does 1st class take then?"


Them: "It's between 3 and 4 working days."


I have never had a single parcel sent first class arrive more than 2 working days after posting.


Are these idiots trained into pushing people to pay the higher prices??

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I think they are correct in that first class is no longer expected the next day. At least 1st class things take on average 3 days to get to me in my area (outskirts London/Essex)

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I've never had one take that long (Essex also), also the hundreds I have sent, I advertise as next day delivery, never had a complaint yet.


Still, I have to tell them several times I want first class signed for. The ones in London really need English speaking people working there.

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We could give stats an figures but so they actually mean anything ? Can make stats say what you want them too :)


I just know from personal experience. Lots of lost letters and parcels. Letters taking an age to get here.

In fact. I got a pair of ice skates from the United States quicker than I got a letter from Birmingham lol ... Go figure.

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16th May 2014


Royal Mail reported today that the company is exceeding its first and second class mail quality of service targets. Out of 118 postcode areas, 114 met or surpassed their annual targets.

The results, published today, come the week before Royal Mail is set to publish its prelimary financial results for the year.



Royal Mail's first class mail target of 93 per cent was beaten with 93.2 per cent of mail being delivered the next working day. Its second class mail target of 98.5 per cent was also exceeded, with 98.9 per cent of mail being delivered within three working days.

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Full set of Quality of Service reports here: http://www.royalmailgroup.com/customers/quality-service/quality-service-reports


Each report gives the headline figures as well as a breakdown of how each area performed.


Boot note: Whilst second class mail is typically a three to five day service, I have had stuff delivered the next working day on more than one occasion.





No... you can't eat my brain just yet. I need it a little while longer.

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Well they do a good enough job for me.


I've always found them better than most :)

Any advice I give is honest and in good faith.:)

If in doubt, you should seek the opinion of a Qualified Professional.

If you can, please donate to this site.

Help keep it up and active, helping people like you.

If you no longer require help, please do what you can to help others

RIP: Rooster-UK - MARTIN3030 - cerberusalert

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Post Offices in the past simply used to provide a service, you would go in and say you want to send this, fine the service was provided, these days you go in wanting the same service, they offer 'X' number of differences, they sell like there's no tomorrow.


The best bit is the thickness of the letter you want to send. When they try and push it through the plastic template it won't go through, when you push it through it goes through easily.

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I use a few different post offices in London, one of them near liverpool street kept telling me my parcel was not large letter sized, I put it through and it fit fine, they then argued that it wasn't a "letter" as it was in a padded envelope and was clearly a small parcel.


Another one I'm about to head to now is one of those with self checkouts. But you still have to wait there for someone to come past, check everything you done was correct and then they have to scan their pass to print out the labels and stick them on themselves.... Complete waste of time!


Slowly deciding to scrap using signed for all together.

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People often forget Royal Mail and the Post Office are separate companies with independent Boards.

Royal Mail is the company that delivers parcels and letters, the provider of the universal postal service.

The Post Office is the nationwide network of branches offering a range of postal, Government and financial services.


Royal Mail and the Post Office are natural partners and the Chief Executive of Royal Mail has said it would be unthinkable" that there would not always be a strong commercial relationship between the two companies. A long term commercial agreement between the Post Office and Royal Mail for the continued supply of services was signed in 2012.


Any advice I give is honest and in good faith.:)

If in doubt, you should seek the opinion of a Qualified Professional.

If you can, please donate to this site.

Help keep it up and active, helping people like you.

If you no longer require help, please do what you can to help others

RIP: Rooster-UK - MARTIN3030 - cerberusalert

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