lowell joined 3 debts [2 mobile, 1 credit card]made me BK, now want my house!!

[Mike_hawk]

Its the date of the statutory demand and your finances at that time the court will need evidence of.

 

Were any endowments held in trust for you, could they have been realised (cashed) within 3 weeks of demand? Could /would your ex witness any funds held in his account at that time were for your benefit

 

I think you need to focus on the demanded sum rather than proof of debt, the court will not look behind the bankruptcy order if the lower court assumed the debts were proven. Certainly argue them later if your app for relief to appeal out of time results in annulment

[wendyboats]

Its the date of the statutory demand and your finances at that time the court will need evidence of.

 

Were any endowments held in trust for you, could they have been realised (cashed) within 3 weeks of demand? Could /would your ex witness any funds held in his account at that time were for your benefit

 

I think you need to focus on the demanded sum rather than proof of debt, the court will not look behind the bankruptcy order if the lower court assumed the debts were proven. Certainly argue them later if your app for relief to appeal out of time results in annulment

 

 

Ok Mike I understand your point here, yes my ex-husband could and would prove he could pay and no I had used all my money to buy half of house and other things , I thought all my debts were paid up in the divorce, not that I had many and the Capone card I completely forgot to pay up at time, but continued DD payment even though I thought it was being in part paid by PPI ! WBX

[Mike_hawk]

I suppose the next question is, does your ex have a bank statement for the period in question and would he be inclined to witness that ample funds to discharge the demand were held for you... I'd guess he'd also need to show why he was holding his ex wifes cash assets as I'm sure the question would be asked.

[Ganymede]

Its the date of the statutory demand and your finances at that time the court will need evidence of.

 

Were any endowments held in trust for you, could they have been realised (cashed) within 3 weeks of demand? Could /would your ex witness any funds held in his account at that time were for your benefit

 

I think you need to focus on the demanded sum rather than proof of debt, the court will not look behind the bankruptcy order if the lower court assumed the debts were proven. Certainly argue them later if your app for relief to appeal out of time results in annulment

 

 

 

I think Wendy needs to "appeal" the Court refusing her relief from sanction under CPR 3.9 and give some very good and extraordinary circumstances as to why this should be allowed.

 

The Judge has already refused relief as Wendy had solicitors acting for her at the time and then once they came off record delayed it to long before applying to extend time according to the Judge.

 

The Courts are now very, very strict (often unfairly so) with complying with timeliness and the CPR since the Jackson reforms came in last April and the recent Court of Appeal cases of Mitchell and Durrant.

[Ganymede]

For a little more infor on relief from sanctions Keating Chambers have produced an intersting paper...

 

http://www.keatingchambers.co.uk/multimedia/New%20Folder/Practical%20guidance%20on%20relief%20from%20sanctions%20after%20Mitchell%20and%20Durrant.pdf

[Mike_hawk]

I think Wendy needs to "appeal" the Court refusing her relief from sanction under CPR 3.9 and give some very good and extraordinary circumstances as to why this should be allowed.

 

The Judge has already refused relief as Wendy had solicitors acting for her at the time and then once they came off record delayed it to long before applying to extend time according to the Judge.

 

The Courts are now very, very strict (often unfairly so) with complying with timeliness and the CPR since the Jackson reforms came in last April and the recent Court of Appeal cases of Mitchell and Durrant.

 

Hi Gany

 

I don't disagree, the problem is the judge reasoned there was no error in law and no grounds to extend time so Wendy will need to bring something new to the table which underpins her out of time appeal and provides her with the opportunity to be heard.

[wendyboats]

Evening all

 

 

Sorry for late post, thanks for comments above, and Gany I read link you posted thank you, Mike thank you also for your input.

 

 

I really need advise on what I need to put in letter to request appeal of sanction and Oral hearing request. Their is so much I think has been mist in my case, I think in light of volume of my posts I should re; post important points, as I see them.

 

 

1. I lived away from address for a solid 6 months caring for Daughter and Grandson during period of service, I can prove.

 

 

2. After return with Grandson a phone call from Trustee alerted me to Bankruptcy Order, and the demand for £14,000 but good will gesture would accept £10,000, she even spoke to ex husband and told us both to lend it off our elderly parent's.

 

 

3. It took me 2 months to find out from insolvency man by e mail what the alleged debts were for after Trustee refused to tell me.

 

 

4. My ex husband agreed to pay for a solicitor recommended by Law line to set aside and appeal order, it took £2,500 and a year for him to get all relevant paper work, most important of which came 24 hours before case in court, never did set aside Trustees Debts mounted.(Appeal Case heard June 2013) nearly 1 year to day of bankruptcy order, Due to Lowlife taking so long to disclose and my solicitor letting them.

 

 

5. 1 week before case Solicitor informs me he can not attend but will instruct a barrister at a cost of £300 for 40 min, approx.

 

 

6. Barrister was a pupil with a stutter ( nice lad ) who only mentioned service of SD and my absence from property, Judge cared less and awarded costs to other side who asked for £7,000 but Judge pulled them on having 3 grade A,s 2 grade B,s and 3 grade C,s and knocked it down to £2,400 .

 

 

7. Barrister informs me no chance of appeal as dose Solicitor, who refuses to entertain it.

 

 

8. Joined CAG August 2013 desperate for advice and advice given "THANK YOU ALL" and I sent emails to Solicitors in a 60 mile radius and was contacted by one who bragged about her ability's to WIN LOWLIFE and would go Pro- Bono and even put my story on her web site banana and I sent bundle to her in early September.

 

 

9. She phoned my previous Solicitor to tell him he should not advertise as a bankruptcy specialist and we were suing him (I did not know this for a few months after)

 

 

10. October 2013 Trustee gives us 7 days to pay or would put in for a forced sale and Pro- Bono Solicitor pulls out.

 

 

11. Spoke to original Solicitor for advise, the informed of phone call from Pro-Bono threats to sue, so can not help me.

 

 

12. November with help on CAG I applied to court to appeal.

 

 

The rest I hope you know !! WB aka Watson still on the case xxxx

[wendyboats]

Sorry forgot most important points

 

 

3 Alleged debts 2 Mobile phones under £500 and Capone credit card limit £500 debt £850.32P .

 

 

2 mobs never proven.

 

 

Capone card taken out either September or October 2006 Two CCA sent with to different dates and signatures. Agreed limit £500.

 

 

I pay by DD for 18 months, no notice given of default during this time ( I defaulted first month)

 

 

No attempt by phone or e mails or letters, during year of 2007 I have £87,000 in the bank DD is taken from.

 

 

DD stop due to unlawful bank charges and I close account in April 2008. September 2008 Capone put me in default. no letters nothing !

 

 

No statements ever sent except one, and in their evidence given of statements high interest rates PPI and nothing adds up ?

 

 

So to recap.................. £500 credit card I pay 18 months by DD a total of nearly £800 but its never enough so increases to £850.32p due to PPI not requested or known about and high reclaimable interest rates.

 

 

On a £850.32 alleged debt the trustee now wants my equity of £38.000 give or take.............So please help me Wendy xx

[unclebulgaria67]

Wendy

 

I am no expert here, but my reading of this is that you cannot as your main argument go over old ground by stating exactly the same in a different way. The Judge has decided that because you have had two Solicitors and a court look at your circumstances, that they have seen nothing new in which to annul the bankruptcy.

 

From what I have seen online, where people have sought to annul a bankruptcy using s.282 of the insolvency act, they have done so using exceptional circumstances that the lower court Judge would not have been aware at the time of the original petition and any subsequent appeal. There was a case where a bankrupt was proven to not have the required level of mental capacity to deal with the bankruptcy and a high court Judge agreed to annul.

 

You may have to explain to the high court Judge exactly what you were having to deal with at the time with your Daughter and Grandson. For you to do this, you may need letters from Social Services, Healthcare professionals and others who were involved, letting the Judge know of the exceptional circumstances and why you were not around to deal with any bankruptcy. If you were seeing your GP at the time about any personal health issues, you should also include this information and get a letter from your GP as well.

 

This will be your main reason for appeal and then you can add more details about the issues you have mentioned before.

 

You will see that high court Judges are very reluctant to annul, because of the trustees in bankruptcies expenses and how these are dealt with after annulment. There are a number of articles about this online, which I am sure the Judges have in their minds when looking at appeals.

 

In my non expert view, you are going to have to put together an exceptional compelling case about your personal circumstances at the time. I am not sure evidence of not being insolvent and general points about the debts would be enough, as the Judge will just view it that this has all been looked at before, whether or not it has been at all or properly.

[wendyboats]

Thank you for above Gany

 

 

I am still confused as to this, do I send off request to appeal first and then write my reasons or write my reasons with the request ?

 

 

Advise needed please

[Mike_hawk]

Wendy

 

Everything within the same single correspondence, the judge wants to know if there is anything exceptional about the case which would merit relief to appeal.

 

Without wishing to be the bearer of bad news, I cannot see anything mentioned to date which would satisfy that request.

 

UB has noted a possible case due to mental capacity but I would imagine the court will take some inference from your instruction to counsel that you were capable of effecting some form of rebuttal.

 

The trustees fees will be granted whatever the outcome, perhaps questionable in quantum but ultimately they will fall due.

 

I believe I asked in an earlier post, what is the total fee now demanded and have you engaged with it (the trustee) to negotiate a lower figure?

[wendyboats]

Wendy

 

Everything within the same single correspondence, the judge wants to know if there is anything exceptional about the case which would merit relief to appeal.

 

Without wishing to be the bearer of bad news, I cannot see anything mentioned to date which would satisfy that request.

 

UB has noted a possible case due to mental capacity but I would imagine the court will take some inference from your instruction to counsel that you were capable of effecting some form of rebuttal.

 

The trustees fees will be granted whatever the outcome, perhaps questionable in quantum but ultimately they will fall due.

 

I believe I asked in an earlier post, what is the total fee now demanded and have you engaged with it (the trustee) to negotiate a lower figure?

 

 

 

 

Thank you for above advise, Mike and Gany,

 

 

I have sent off letter to court and do not hold much hope as your posts advised the Trustee will get money no matter what,

 

 

Regardless of end result I will continue to fight this Bankruptcy law as its flawed with deceit and is purely set out for gain and is not in the interest of justice in any shape or form, I am sure I am not the first or the last, but what I do know is I shall bring this law to the attention of the media, because "IT COULD HAPPEN TO ANYONE " !

 

 

I am not content to sit back and go through this for no reason, If or when I loose I shall shout from the roof tops and kick up a stink, because this stinks to high heaven, and the truth will prevail and with truth comes justice, and the truth shall save us all !

 

 

Thank you all for the honest advise, But for now Wendyboats aka Watson is still very much on the case ! xx

[unclebulgaria67]

Wendy

 

There is a government minister responsible for involvency ( Jenny Willott ), but she won't get involved in a current court case. The government are currently looking into the fees charged by Trustees in bankruptcy. Perhaps you should contact TV stations about this. BBC Panorama [email protected]

[wendyboats]

Wendy

 

There is a government minister responsible for involvency ( Jenny Willott ), but she won't get involved in a current court case. The government are currently looking into the fees charged by Trustees in bankruptcy. Perhaps you should contact TV stations about this. BBC Panorama [email protected]

 

 

 

Thanks for this link Uncle b, as I said above I am not going through this nightmare for nothing and this case and the journey I have taken needs to be told.........

 

 

"My Story" In its entirety, Needs to be told,

 

 

Their is a lot more than this issue going on in my life a long side this case, That by anyone's imagination should have sent me into "mental shut down", but you guys on CAG and others in my life have given me the tools to cope, Its hopefully going to be a good read!

 

 

For this forum I am truly grateful Wendyboats aka Watson on the case xxxx

[Mike_hawk]

Thank you for above advise, Mike and Gany,

 

 

I have sent off letter to court and do not hold much hope as your posts advised the Trustee will get money no matter what,

 

 

Regardless of end result I will continue to fight this Bankruptcy law as its flawed with deceit and is purely set out for gain and is not in the interest of justice in any shape or form, I am sure I am not the first or the last, but what I do know is I shall bring this law to the attention of the media, because "IT COULD HAPPEN TO ANYONE " !

 

 

I am not content to sit back and go through this for no reason, If or when I loose I shall shout from the roof tops and kick up a stink, because this stinks to high heaven, and the truth will prevail and with truth comes justice, and the truth shall save us all !

 

 

Thank you all for the honest advise, But for now Wendyboats aka Watson is still very much on the case ! xx

 

Hi Wendy

 

I wish you the very best of luck, you can but persevere and hope the judge will grant you the opportunity to have your case heard.

[The Mould]

http://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/technicalmanual/Ch1-12/Chapter6A/Part2/Part2.htm

 

Dear Watson,

 

See the brief material in the above link.

 

I seem to recall that some many months ago, a fellow Cag member suggested/advised that you ought to send the two mobile phone companies a request for all personal information held by them in respect of your personal data under s.7 of the Data Protection Act 1998 (known as a “SAR”), relating to these questioned mobile phone debts. Have you undertaken this Watson?

 

If not, I would also strongly suggest that you send the two mobile phone Co your SAR – the fee is £10 I believe and they must provide you with a copy of all material that they hold on record of you that is in an easily accessible and readily locatable filing system (manual or electronic – as per Durant case) within 40 days of your SAR. This will or should provide you with sufficient evidence to prove to the Court that the two said mobile phone debts are not yours and therefore provide you with valid grounds to apply to the Court and request a decree to show that the bankruptcy order ought not to have been made.

 

Further, as regards the credit agreement debt, please remind me if the creditor who enforced such against you ever served upon you a valid default notice pursuant to s.87(1) of the CCA 1974 (as amended).

 

I sincerely hope that all of the foregoing is of some help to you old boy (I know you are a woman Watson).

 

Godzilla & Kind regards

 

Your eternal friend

 

The Mould

 

PS. I shall respond as soon as I can Watson, hang on in there old boy, don’t give up on this case or me………………just yet. You are fully aware that prayers are indeed answered, so hang on Watson.

 

By the way, to whom it may concern, I don’t care what any Judge in any lower Court or High Court has to say on this matter, or indeed any mater. Judges at no matter what level, solicitors of however many years’ experience and barristers of no matter what their year of call - get it wrong!! Being human means we are prone to making mistakes, these mistakes that we make are a natural inbuilt education system designed for one purpose, that is, to help us learn.

[The Mould]

I am sorry about this Watson if you have previously posted the answer to the matters below.

 

Please confirm if the initial action (the original Court claim that resulted in the CCJ being awarded against you relating to all three debts) was brought by just one creditor/Claimant.

 

If your answer to the above is yes, please confirm, in respect of the questioned mobile phone debts, if you were ever served a Notice of Assignment pursuant to s.136(1) of the Law of Property Act 1925 by either of the mobile phone companies or indeed if you received any correspondence from the same prior to the date of service of the claim or the date that judgment was awarded thereon.

 

Kind regards

 

The Mould

 

Who is still on the case, although really not very well Watson……but, you know me old boy, don’t you. Fill the pipe up and continue smoking. Godzilla

[The Mould]

Watson,

 

 

See the lyrics below which are from a song by Alison Moyet called – “ Love Resurrection (divine intervention)”. Listen to the song Watson and the words that maketh it, you are one of many that deserve divine intervention and I believe that this is happening in your case/thread/life story; God and his son and all the helpers in his Kingdom do not cause your suffering nor the suffering of any of his children. I am not religious and this must not be construed as any form of religious statement, for, in my opinion, God and religion are two entirely different entities, religion being made by man and, no man ever made the Heart.

 

 

 

"Love Resurrection

 

 

What can I do to make light of this dull dull day

What switch can I pull to illuminate the way

Show me one direction

I will not question again

For a warm injection

Is all I need to calm the pain

 

 

We all need a love resurrection

(just a little divine intervention)

We all need a love resurrection

(just a little divine intervention)

 

 

What seed must I sow to replenish this barren land

Teach me to harvest, I want you to grow in my hand

Let's be optimistic, let's say that we won't toil in vain

If we pull together we'll never fall apart again

 

 

We all need a love resurrection

(just a little divine intervention)

We all need a love resurrection

(just a little divine intervention)

 

 

Show me one direction

I will not question again

For a warm injection

Is all I need to calm the pain”

 

 

 

Godzilla Watson, Daniella and Mike H and all posters to this important case/thread/real life story.

 

Outside the box is cool and perfectly alright. It really does not matter what everyone else is doing, what matters is that you should not be everyone else.

 

 

 

 

Kind regards

 

The Mould

[Desperate Daniella]

Hi The Mould,

 

I know Wendy is not around for a while this afternoon but I know she will be so delighted to know that you are still here for her.

 

Unless I am muddled, there wasn't a CCJ before the Statutory Demand; they just went for the Statutory Demand and as Wendy didn't defend, because she didn't know about it, they got the judgment.

 

Hope you are having a better day today.

 

DDxx

[Desperate Daniella]

As you know, Lowells are very keen on the SD route because they know that the early Capital One agreements aren't enforceable and therefore they attempt to use an SD to enforce the debt without having to prove it was actually enforceable.

[The Mould]

“They produced two first 1.17/8/2008..NOTICE OF DEFAULT SEC.87(1) MY OVER DUE AMOUNT £299.70 PAY IN FULL NO ACTION WILL BE TAKEN.

 

They go on to state about issue of stat demand if i fail to pay in full and costs will be added and the different places i can go if i can not pay (CAB) etc .

 

The second dated 19/9/2008.....STATEMENT OF DEFAULT....WE HAVE TERMINATED YOUR ACCOUNT BALANCE £850.35. OVERDUE AMOUNT £140.89. We may sell your account or bring proceedings.

 

I never ever received these two letters. x”

As regards service of a valid statutory default notice pursuant to s.87(1) CCA 1974 (as amended) by a creditor BEFORE he can become entitled to enforce the credit agreement upon which he relies - your above post #107 appears to confirm that said statutory default notice is indeed invalid - £300 pounds on the first of August 2008 claimed as due and owing under the credit agreement and………. - 18 days later the creditor claims that the amount you now owe under the same credit agreement has increased by a staggering £550.05p (such significant increase must be established and justified by creditor to reflect the actual sums in damage he suffered as a consequence of the breach of contract he relies upon and alleges you caused)

If this is the case, then original SD is invalid and the subsequent bankruptcy Order obtained thereon, which includes the two genuinely questioned and disputed (unproven) mobile phone debts, is indeed and without doubt invalid and ought not to have made and should, therefore, be declared as annulled.

In light of the above, if it is true and correct, I do not believe that your case is an ‘Appeal’ case, rather I believe that your case is one that requires an application to the High Court (pursuant to CPR Pt 23 & subsequent Practice Direction 23) - seeking an annulment Order under s.282(1) of the Insolvency Act 1986 on the grounds that; a) at the time that the bankruptcy Order was made on the application made by the creditor dated (put date here), the mobile phone companies in question and relating to the alleged debts set out in the bankruptcy petition dated (put date here) had not served any valid statutory notice upon you pursuant to s.136(1) of the Law of Property Act 1925; and b) at the time of the bankruptcy Order being made, the Claimant creditor had not served any valid statutory default notice on you pursuant to s.87(1) of the CCA 1974 (as amended) in order to establish his claimed rights to the Court as regards the debt to which the bankruptcy Order was made, therefore, two of the alleged debts stated in the bankruptcy petition, those being the mobile phone debts are not yours and no evidence was ever presented to the Court to the contrary and, in respect of the debt claimed under the credit agreement mentioned in the bankruptcy petition, it would be the case that - it is averred that the creditor to such has never served upon you any valid statutory default notice pursuant to s.87(1) of the CCA 1974 (as amended) and therefore, he was never entitled under English statute law nor English common law to proceed to enforce the contract upon which he relied in those proceedings.

It is, in my considered opinion Watson, the case that your previously “IS” (instructed solicitors) have failed you and wrongfully advised you in this matter and I believe that you ought to question them and their advice as to how they represented you and seek some compensation from them on the grounds (which I believe are true) that they mis-advised you, failed to recognise your case and key relevant and important points of statute law relating to the same and that their advice was negligent in respect of the factual circumstances of your case and the statute and case law relating to the same.

Godzilla Watson

Kind regards

The Mould

[The Mould]

Hi The Mould,

 

I know Wendy is not around for a while this afternoon but I know she will be so delighted to know that you are still here for her.

 

Unless I am muddled, there wasn't a CCJ before the Statutory Demand; they just went for the Statutory Demand and as Wendy didn't defend, because she didn't know about it, they got the judgment.

 

Hope you are having a better day today.

 

DDxx

 

 

Thank you DD

 

 

I am having a few 'better hours', so I thought I should post in order to help Wendy/Watson (and indeed any other who has happened upon this particular case).

 

 

 

 

Godzilla & Kind regards

 

 

The Mould

[wendyboats]

http://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/technicalmanual/Ch1-12/Chapter6A/Part2/Part2.htm

 

Dear Watson,

 

See the brief material in the above link.

 

I seem to recall that some many months ago, a fellow Cag member suggested/advised that you ought to send the two mobile phone companies a request for all personal information held by them in respect of your personal data under s.7 of the Data Protection Act 1998 (known as a “SAR”), relating to these questioned mobile phone debts. Have you undertaken this Watson?

 

 

I did request all information on the two alleged mobile phone debts I was told via a phone call from T mobile company informing me they do keep records once contacts had ended and so could not supply this.

Also The solicitor asked for signed agreements and Default notices in relation to mobiles and on 23 January 2013 they sent a letter to him stating they were unable to obtain original Agreements from their clients Lowlife, BW Legal state they had requested Default notices for all 3 accounts that day.

If not, I would also strongly suggest that you send the two mobile phone Co your SAR – the fee is £10 I believe and they must provide you with a copy of all material that they hold on record of you that is in an easily accessible and readily locatable filing system (manual or electronic – as per Durant case) within 40 days of your SAR. This will or should provide you with sufficient evidence to prove to the Court that the two said mobile phone debts are not yours and therefore provide you with valid grounds to apply to the Court and request a decree to show that the bankruptcy order ought not to have been made.

 

 

The only evidence I can find and given by BW Legal is a final run down of the debt for

t- mobile and is addressed to my old property in Feb 07, I had moved out in January 07.

 

Further, as regards the credit agreement debt, please remind me if the creditor who enforced such against you ever served upon you a valid default notice pursuant to s.87(1) of the CCA 1974 (as amended).

 

 

 

I am not sure what you mean here Mouldy ?

 

I sincerely hope that all of the foregoing is of some help to you old boy (I know you are a woman Watson).

 

Godzilla & Kind regards

 

Your eternal friend

 

The Mould

 

 

 

PS. I shall respond as soon as I can Watson, hang on in there old boy, don’t give up on this case or me………………just yet. You are fully aware that prayers are indeed answered, so hang on Watson.

 

 

 

 

By the way, to whom it may concern, I don’t care what any Judge in any lower Court or High Court has to say on this matter, or indeed any mater. Judges at no matter what level, solicitors of however many years’ experience and barristers of no matter what their year of call - get it wrong!! Being human means we are prone to making mistakes, these mistakes that we make are a natural inbuilt education system designed for one purpose, that is, to help us learn.

 

 

"Thank you my dearest Mouldy" Yes you have indeed, as always given me hope in this case, and that, together we can achieve our goal ! Watson is always so glad to hold your hand on this life changing journey. God bless dear friend xx

[wendyboats]

I am digging out my file to confirm all above correct as post 101 was a long time ago! WB x aka Watsonx

[wendyboats]

I am sorry about this Watson if you have previously posted the answer to the matters below.

 

Please confirm if the initial action (the original Court claim that resulted in the CCJ being awarded against you relating to all three debts) was brought by just one creditor/Claimant.

 

 

Yes Mouldy just one I believe it was only Lowell portfolio one who took all 3 into Bankruptcy.

 

If your answer to the above is yes, please confirm, in respect of the questioned mobile phone debts, if you were ever served a Notice of Assignment pursuant to s.136(1) of the Law of Property Act 1925 by either of the mobile phone companies or indeed if you received any correspondence from the same prior to the date of service of the claim or the date that judgment was awarded thereon.

 

 

NO I DID NOT EVER Mouldy !

 

 

Kind regards

 

The Mould

 

Who is still on the case, although really not very well Watson……but, you know me old boy, don’t you. Fill the pipe up and continue smoking. Godzilla

Thank you for your help here and please take it easy dear friend xx