Written warning given but no disciplinary meeting

[barclay]

Hi I need some advice please.

 

My husband is a PSV driver and was called in for an informal chat last October. He duly attended and was told that a complaint had been made by a clients (special needs) parent. The complaint was over some banter which had offended her. He agree to tone it down and apologise, which he did. On the 20th June 2013 he was called in by his employers for an informal chat. Again he attended and was told that the clients father had complained again about something he had said. She told her parents that he had said that she was full of **** and from his recollection he said that what she said was sometimes full of ****.The client at the time was bantering other clients and my husband. At the time he was nursing a cracked rib and not slept properly for 3 nights. His employers were aware of this. He said that he would apologise to the father and agreed that he should not have said it. He phoned her father and apologise, which he accepted. The father said that he has warned his daughter that her banter would get out of hand.My husband was called in again on the 26th for another informal chat only to be told tha the had a written warning following a verbal warning last October (he was not aware ogf this), plus they were moving him of his run. They have now produced a new contract reducing his hours and pay by £1700 pa. At no point have they followed the ACAS guidelines. First he was not sent a letter inviting him or have they given him any witness statements. He was not invited to take a companion. No notes were taken.They have not given him an outcome letter with an explanation or the timeline for improvement, only a copy of the written warning. Nor have they told him his right to appeal.To top it all when he was paid last week they have taken out in one lump sum the the 2 weeks salary paid in advance so they could go from weekly pay to monthly pay. He has a letter from them stating that this would be deducted at source on a monthly basis for 12 months unless there was a resignation which there is not. Can anyone advise please. He knows he has done wrong, but is aware that this girl has got other drivers in trouble for the self same thing With another company he worked for). Many thanks in advanced.

[Emmzzi]

1. driving when tired is not great

2. after a warning for banter, he kept making banter - that's just a bit thick! ESPECIALLY when he knows the girls track record!

3. if the client doesn't want him on that run, is it fair he still gets paid for it when it's his own fault he doesn't have the work an more?

 

Now, to be more helpful, what is the exac wording about hours and pay on his contract?

[Trurider]

Due to a change in the law, not following the ACAS procedure is no longer an automatic fail in the Tribunal BUT the fact they didn't do it will not help their defense were he to take them to tribunal. Have you checked whether your House Insurance policy has Legal Cover. They could also advise him on the potential of a case if you do. Better than a lot of uniformed advice here.

[Emmzzi]

Better than a lot of uniformed advice here.

 

I don't wear a uniform. AND I'm insulted.

 

Depending on the nature of the contract getting a solicitor involved may be a waste of times; let's hear what it says first.

[barclay]

His contract states "Your normal hours of work are based on an annualised hours term time only contract and hours are worked flexibly including split shifts to meet the needs of the business. You may be required to work additional hours including private hire jobs on occasions". They do not state the number of hours but do say that is salary is a certain amount per annum.This has now be reduced by £1700 pa. He works 4 hours a day, 5 days a week for 48 weeks a year. They have now stated that he is to work 38 weeks a year for the same hours per day 5 days a week. They also state that instead of 4 weeks holiday it will increase to 10 weeks. He has been working there since 2006 on the same terms but the business was sold in 2011 and he was issue with a new contract last December with the above wording. It also states that he will be required to work from the business location to locations as directed.

[barclay]

Sorry just re read this and the holiday quoted isnt clear. The 10 weeks is on top of the 4 weeks. To clarify he will be on holiday 14 weeks a year.

[Emmzzi]

so he was on a 20 hour a week basis

 

and now.. 16? or that it is less weeks per year?

 

I can see their argument for cutting his hours to remove this one person from his workload - but that doesn't seem to be what has happened here, is that correct?

 

I think I would be submitting a formal grievance regarding the warning and the unrelated drop in hours (it does look unrelated?) at this stage, and see what happened.

[barclay]

Hi he will still be working 20 hours a week but for only 38 weeks a year with 14 weeks holiday and not the 48 weeks plus 4 weeks hols he has been doing for the last 6 years. They have made him swap the school run with another employee. Thanks for your help Emmzzi. He is going to appeal the so called disciplinary meeting that he was told was an informal meeting for a chat (sent by text). It wasnt till he got there that they told him about the complaint that he was having a written warning and was going to be moved on to another run. It wasnt til he received the written warning that he found out about the previous verbal warning.

[barclay]

Can anyone advise me on how TUPE works. For 6 years my husband contract was 4 hrs a day, 5 days a week for 48 weeks a year with 4 weeks holiday. He does a school run and was employed to cover a particular school. The business was sold in March 2011 and he carried on working under the same conditions. In December 2012 all the employees(the rest work for 38 weeks a year) were given new contracts stating their pay pa but did not state the number of hours. Nobody's pay etc changed but the contracts say they are term time contracts. Since the new contract my husband has still been going to the same school. Can the employer just change your contract that is detriment to the employer?l.He was informed that they were changing the school which is only open 38 weeks a year. He was presented with a new contract last Wednesday reducing the number of weeks accordingly and as a result affects his pay by £1700 pa. Can they do this if it part of a so called disciplinary procedure along with a written warning? He has not been given an end date either.

[Emmzzi]

back up a bit

 

I am not clear if the drop in hours is because he has had to be moved i.e. it would still be as it was before, if he were still working with this girl

 

Is the drop in hours related to that, or unrelated?

 

They can change anything with reasonable notice. I'm not clear on the reason behind this change though. Is someone else now getting more hours?

[Atlas01]

Tricky one, on one hand they have breached his contract by way of the substantial reduction in pay (which normally must be expressly stated as a valid part of a disciplinary process)

 

On the other they can argue that as their client wanted him off their round and it was not reasonable to change the pickup to another driver, instead of dismissing him as there is no other like work (pay wise) they have given him the other round. Forget tupe this is more a dismissal and re-engagement and he could write and work under protest of the new terms (otherwise he must leave and lodge a claim) or if he continues to work under the new terms he will be deemed to have accepted them.

 

There is case law that people can be dismissed/made redundant if someone doesn't want them when they paid for company A to provide a service to them, there is also plenty of breach of contract for failing to undertake a fair dismissal.

 

Bottom line, can't say yes or no, this is one of those i would need to have both the employers side and the employees to form a real opinion on the validity of any claim

 

sorry

[barclay]

Hi, Sorry if I am confusing you.

 

1 The drop in pay is related. because they have moved him, he has had to take a drop in pay. If they had requested the council (the Client as the work is contracted out) to put her on another bus as there was possibly a clash of personalities/another complain,t his hours would have stayed at 48. He has never had any other complaints lodged against him only by the same girl (which is 2 in the last 8 months)

2 The parents have never asked for him to be moved. Her father accepted my husbands apology.

3 Another driver has swapped with my husband and has had his hours increased from the 38 week to the 48 week

4 The reduction in pay is not expressly stated as part of the disciplinary process in the staff handbook or on his contract.

5 it was purely a business decision.

 

Thanks for your input. It is greatly appreciated.

[Sidewinder]

Better than a lot of uniformed advice here.

 

That was a little uncalled for!

[borisbeaver]

Better than a lot of uniformed advice here.

Should that be "uninformed"?

[barclay]

HI all

My husband put in a request in writing t for an appeal hearing 2 weeks ago and at the same time a request for a SAR under the Data Protection Act. He heard nothing so emailed them again this week and they have now acknowledged the requests by email and are "doing something about them. Yesterday they issued a variation of contract to the other employee who is now doing my husbands old job and back dated it to the 1st July. Can anyone give any advice on the following

 

1 Since an appeal hearing hasnt taken place we feel that they have already prejudged the outcome by issuing the other employee a back dated contract.

2 If we wait another week and havent heard anything regarding the appeal, Would a grievance be the next step

3 My husband has not signed his new contract as he is waiting for his appeal hearing and outcome of the appeal. If the employers pay him the reduced rate under the new contract, have they unilaterally changed it/breach his previous contract. Should this been put on hold knowing they were asked for an appeal hearing.

4 They have not given him any private hire work since 20 June and even asked another driver to break Tachometers driving hours. Is this Victimisation/punitive punishment.

 

Many thanks for any input... greatly appreciated