Builder has ruined our lives.

[Desperate Daniella]

And did he specifically ask to be paid in cash?

[Straycat_67]

Daniella & Steampowered:

 

Unfortunately the fixed price quote outlining the price, works to be undertaken, specification and time frame were all written all COMPANY NAME letter headed paper. Inclusive of company address, VAT reg, company reg and his signature. But not with the word Director.

 

The builder did negotiate from an original price requested of £212,000 after we said it was too high and he eventually came back and said £193,000 if we could make it CASH.

 

I have been working with a Mod over on WhatConsumer who is a builder dispute fixer, party walls etc.. as well in final year of Law. He and I put together a formal letter outlining in fact everything that had unfolded and the negligence of the builder, he terminating the contract via email, walking off site etc.... This was sent recorded to his home and business (Accountant) address yesterday. Part of the letter contained information about various defects found by the Appointed Building Control Surveyor and today the builder contacted the Surveyor, so he deffinately got this letter today! Believe his feather's may be ruffled but time will tell to what extent. As mentioned in my opening post we are having him for Repudiation and had agreed to his own termination of contract, this apparently hold's up well in case we do want to sue his company. But as said, unless I can get to HIM there's not a great deal of point other than exposing HIM through various media outlets, this we will save for down the line when he least expects it. Especially if and when he get's his Children's Play Centre up and running.

 

Today we had various meetings with our SE and the Surveyor and it seems the Architects have also been negligent and we will now be pressing them on a few points. Main point, the approved Planning drawings (PL) do not match those of the Technical/Tender (T) drawings, so many elevation variations you would not believe! This was all brought to light when the Enforcement Officer stamped a breach on the build and he came waving his colourful PL drawings in front of us. Then it was noted that the drawings most builders would work from, the T drawings show a numbers of discrepencies which would always leave the build open to Breach! I am trying to get a meeting with the Architect but he has conveniently avoided this over the course of today. The Architect has also denied the builder was a recommend which is utter bollocks and we have an Architect's addressed email from last October to us offering the builder's details as a potential.

 

More to follow!

[steampowered]

I want to challenge your assumption that you need to go against the builder personally rather than the company. You stated that the company is worthless, but I cannot find anything in the information you have provided which supports this. After all, the company has just been paid a huge wad of cash.

 

If the company does not pay a court judgment awarded against it, you could have the company placed into liquidation. An insolvency practitioner would be appointed (paid out of the assets of the company) whose role it is to collect the company's assets and distribute to creditors. You may not get the full amount but it is very likely that the company does have assets. If the company has no money because the director has stripped out the assets (e.g. paid the money into his personal bank account) the liquidator would be under a duty to pursue him. Such payments are likely to be treated as an unlawful dividend as it is illegal to distribute money to shareholders where the company is unable to pay its creditors (i.e. you), which means that the money could be recovered from the director (even if he had nothing to do with the contract). There would also be a fair chance that he gets banned from being a director of any company for a period of time.

 

I accept it is possible that your money was used to pay other legitimate creditors of the company. If this is the case then the insolvency route will not get you much. However, unless the builder has already moved to liquidate the company it is unlikely that the company no longer has any assets. f the company was already in genuine financial trouble, then it would have been easier for the builder to simply let it go to the wall rather than contracting with you.

 

My personal impression is that might have been spooked by the idea of limited liability status and decided not to go down the court without really thinking about it. You have suffered a serious breach of contract, which is what the courts are there for. Court proceedings are the only way you are going to get any sort of redress here. It takes time, effort and money but it gives you a very powerful weapon which is worth using.

 

I do not think you have a great deal to lose here - if there is no money in the company and the builder thinks he can get away with it, the company is unlikely to properly defend the litigation. You would get a default judgment and be able to have the company liquidated quite cheaply. Alternatively, the company may have assets in which case the builder might defend the claim. Ultimately this is your decision but I strongly feel you should go and see a litigation solicitor about this, it has got to be worth the initial consultation even if you end up deciding not to proceed.

Edited May 15, 2013 by steampowered

[Desperate Daniella]

The builder asked for cash and said this would save you £19,000. He may have put some money through the books, but I don't think it was his intention to put all the payments through the books because the company would be responsible for the VAT for that £19,000. Certainly at some stage you can report him to HMCR for likely tax and VAT evasion.

 

The company bank accounts may have no money, but I agree with steampowered: He's probably just paid himself dividends and taken all the money out and therefore if you follow steampowered's advice, take the limited company to court, get judgment and then go for liquidation, the liquidator can indeed pursue the builder personally.

 

Why is the company worthless? It may have no tangible assets but with large amounts of cash going through its accounts, it can't be worthless.

 

You really do need to consult a lawyer here; not just a high street general practice firm, but a specialist litigation lawyer who deals with matters like this. It won't cost you thousands to do that, but it may well help you to recover your money.

[Straycat_67]

Thanks you two!!!! Your advice is certainly well taken and we will sit down further and discuss. Just wish we knew of a decent not too expensive Lawyer/Barrister to sit down with. My only doubt is the fact to date £85,000 in CASH was handed over and presumed that could just get easily "lost", or are you suggesting that because we have a signed sheet with payments made to the builder "his name" this could be enough to implicate the company via his signatures confirming he was in receipt of monies?

 

Meeting with an independant Planning Consulatant this afternoon to help assess how we best deal with the Enforcement breaches currently held over the build and discuss what we also believe to be incorrectly drawn plans by the Architect.

[steampowered]

No worries, good luck with the planning consultant.

 

Civil courts operate on a "balance of probabilities;. There is no need to prove things beyond doubt. If you have a signed sheets showing what cash the builder received that should be more than adequate. You will also have circumstantial evidence (such as bank account statements, purchase of materials and so on) to support this.

 

Someone is going to be liable here - either the builder or the company. The exercise that the courts will undertake will not be excessively technical - they will look at whether a reasonable person in your position would have thought he was contracting with the company (through its director) or with the builder personally. As you received a quote on headed paper I imagine that your contract was with the company.

 

There is a search function on the Law Society website if you need to find a local law firm that practices litigation to assist you. Many solicitors will do free initial consultations, and possibly even no win no fee type arrangements if your case is strong enough.

[Desperate Daniella]

Make sure you find someone who is experienced in this type of litigation. Also, go for a firm of heavy-hitters so the builder knows you mean business.

[Straycat_67]

Thanks guys.

 

Met with the Planning Consultants today, lovely old school couple in fact. Husband is an Architectural Technician/ex Planning Consultant and the wife keeps the business together and has a bulldog attitude.

I have given them ALL 47 drawings (plannning & technicals) from the original Architect and they are going away to assess them and hopefully report back tomorrow to whether or not there has been an negligence against the original Architect.

Talk about small world! These Planning Consultant we met today asked who was the "builder", i mentioned "xxxxx" and low and behold they potentially know of him having had a bad dealing with him themselves a few years back! But they are going to double check their paperwork etc.....

They are also going to speak with the LPA Enforcement Officer to help establish how we can move forward, fortunately he knows the Officer as he's an Ex Planner himself.

 

Appreciate your comments about pursuing the builder/company. When we sort the actual build out to progress forward I will 100% speak with the necessary legal's.

 

The "rogue builder" must have gotten the registered letter that was sent to him yesterday as it part stated issues the Building Surveyor had with his building work at the site. The Building Surveyor received a call from the buildr out of the blue questioning what was wrong, but would not say and directed him to us if he wanted to know the contents of the report. Why would the builder care if he terminated the contract himself.. something tell's me he wasnt expecting this letter and he's now shoing early sign's of concern. Wish I could reveal the letter but unfortunately for obvious reasons I have to be very careful in not mentioning any names etc....

 

I have also tried contacting the original Architect twice over the past 48 hours with no reply, starting to feel like they are totally washing their hands of any involvement. So if it's deemed/proven that they have failed to produce correct drawings from the outset I will be reporting them to the ARB. On three points 1) Negligence (drawings) 2) Duty of Care 3) Conflict of Interest (architect recommended a builder at tender stage who we have since found out is his brother in law) 4) The denial that the Architects firm did not recommend the "rogue builder" (I have an email from the architect work email giving me his name/company and contact details of this builder) 5) Conflict of Interest (builder, builders wife, the electrician, the architect and the Accountant for whom they all use.. all tied into this proposed Children's Play Centre as documented in a "supporting statement" document attached to the planning application.

 

Oh to top it off, we had a guy call me out of the blue today asking if we wanted to sell as apparently he wanted to buy the original house of where the building works were/are taking place! This is legit as he know's/knew of the full details that no one else would have known other than the original selling Estate Agent. Meeting him on site tomorrow to see what he has to say, shall let him do all the talking!

 

One thing for sure, life is not dull at the moment! More to follow.....

[Straycat_67]

Update:

 

Small world, the planning consultants we had over have now 100% confirmed they had bad dealings themselves with the builder, so we now have a case from 2000, 2006 and ours 2012/13! Unfortunately the bulder in each of the cases used a diffrent limited company name.

 

To top it off we have now found a number of malpractices/negligence from the Architect which is noted in another thread at http://www.diynot.com/forums/building-regs-planning/has-my-architect-been-negligent.365325/#2772663

[citizenB]

This thread is now in "General Legal Issues"

 

It is purely an administrative move.

[Mrsshe]

your story breaks my heart as I have just freshly found myself in a little similar situation.

With the exception that the builder has stopped working for 8 days, locked up the house nad won't allow us in due to insurance legality!.

 

Several requests to get in have been turned down.

 

We have finally managed to get the builder, QS and building controlller who seem to be in the same gang to have a meeting in 2 days time.

 

I need to hand in a document to formally end the contract but do not know what it is. What is it called? would it make them hand over the house back or would I be kicked out of my house until the court resolves this?

 

Can uou please let me know how you formally ended the contract with them please?

 

Please please advise as soon as you get this . many hx Good luck to you, if I find useful info, I shall also let you know or you could read it in my own thread

Edited March 27, 2017 by Mrsshe
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