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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Another Idiot


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Guest Payday Survivor

Hello :)

 

Another payday loan victim joining the ranks!

 

This place has been very useful to me in the past and i thought i would join to try and help out others, using my own personal experiences with various payday loan companies.

 

At the height of my payday loan mess i had eleven of them, most defaulted and a total debt of so many thousands just over a year ago.

 

Thankfully, after months of battling them over the extra interest/charges and a **** load of overtime i managed to pay ten of them off :)

 

Can't wait to get rid of the last one and be completely free!

 

Anyways, i'll help in any way i can :)

 

Jamie.

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Welcome!

 

We have 10 of them totalling almost £4000 with interest and charges. We are going to be skins for all of this year but should be debt free by the end of the year!

 

It's definitely a battle. Which companies did you owe?

 

We owe

 

Wonga

Mini Credit

Payday UK

Payday Express

Piggy Bank

Txt Loan

Lending Stream

Easy Finance

Spped Credit

Wage day advance

 

Only managed to negotiate payment plans with three of the ten so far and know I won't get anywhere with three of them but hope to sort the other four some point this month.

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I am another payday idiot and after months of worrying myself sick I need to take action. I can't sleep at night and I never stop thinking about it. I owe 3 at the moment Wonga, Quickquid and Payday Express. The Wonga is the largest and if I could sort out a payment plan with them I would be able to get the others paid off no problem. From what I have read on here Wonga seem the easiest to deal with so I am going to default on my next Payday and hopefully get a plan set up with them. Any words of advice would be greatly appreciated. I feel like I have ruined my life I just can't stop worrying, I earn a good wage bit I am always skint because I was stupid enough to take out these loans!

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Why would you think you have ruined your life? PDL's are some of the lowest priority debts you can have.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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Why would you think you have ruined your life? PDL's are some of the lowest priority debts you can have.

 

I just feel like worrying about them has taken over my life. Hopefully I can get back on track and sort out a payment plan

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Trust me when i say, there are PLENTY of people in worse situations than you. WE have a few people here that were in debt for more than 14,000 solely with PDL's. After a good few months, theyre pretty much out of debt, due to negotiations/settlement offers and challenging unlawful charges.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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Maybe not the right way to do it,but when i lost my job i wrote to them all. Some were good and one even offered a 50% discount over three months, i paid less than i borrowed. The rest the louder they shout the louder i shout back. I have not made a payment in over a year and frankly i do not intend to while they harass me. I use all the legal tools. Remember as well that if they sell your debt in an absolute assignment it takes more than an email to tell you.

Discredit have been told in no to uncertain terms that should they peruse i will counter claim for damages due to their lies unlawful charges and harassment. Not heard from them for 6 months.

I have no income or assets so what can they do.

Any opinion I give is from personal experience .

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Guest Payday Survivor
Welcome!

 

We have 10 of them totalling almost £4000 with interest and charges. We are going to be skins for all of this year but should be debt free by the end of the year!

 

It's definitely a battle. Which companies did you owe?

 

We owe

 

Wonga

Mini Credit

Payday UK

Payday Express

Piggy Bank

Txt Loan

Lending Stream

Easy Finance

Spped Credit

Wage day advance

 

Only managed to negotiate payment plans with three of the ten so far and know I won't get anywhere with three of them but hope to sort the other four some point this month.

 

I had loans with 24/7 MoneyBox, One Month Loan, Payday UK, Payday Express, Money Shop, Cheque Centre, Mini Credit, Wageday Advance, Txtloan, Cash Converters and the one i have left is QuickQuid.

 

Most of them were fairly easy to deal with but Payday Express, Money Shop and 24/7 Moneybox were a pain in the butt!

 

Good luck with it.

 

Jamie :)

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Guest Payday Survivor
I just feel like worrying about them has taken over my life. Hopefully I can get back on track and sort out a payment plan

 

Just don't take out anymore!

 

Jamie :)

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Maybe not the right way to do it,but when i lost my job i wrote to them all. Some were good and one even offered a 50% discount over three months, i paid less than i borrowed. The rest the louder they shout the louder i shout back. I have not made a payment in over a year and frankly i do not intend to while they harass me. I use all the legal tools. Remember as well that if they sell your debt in an absolute assignment it takes more than an email to tell you.

Discredit have been told in no to uncertain terms that should they peruse i will counter claim for damages due to their lies unlawful charges and harassment. Not heard from them for 6 months.

I have no income or assets so what can they do.

 

Deffantley not the right way to do things,

 

CAG do not condone debt avoidance

Please contact a member of the site team if you are offered help off the forum for a a paid or no win no fee service.

 

Please consider making a small donation to help keep this site running

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There is a difference though. If i had a job i would pay as i was doing when i was working. Now however i can't pay.

 

What you call debt avoidance others would call exercising their legal rights.

Any opinion I give is from personal experience .

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I'm not paying anything to easyfinance, speed credit or minicredit. I'm putting what I have offered into my ISA each week and when they see sense I will pay them what I owe. I am now earning interest on that money, nota lot but its something! i have offered every PDL we owe £5 a week which is affordable to us until. Leaves no money for luxuries but we can eat, pay our bills and manage to run the car. Most have been more than ok with this, and as I pay off each PDL I am increasing my payments to the rest, only by 50p each time I pay off a loan but every penny helps to clear the debts!!! I have worked out we can be PDL free by christmas and we owed over £6k at the height of our debt.

 

I've reported a few to the OFT and threatened to report a few others. They soon back down! I found Wonga, TxtLOan and PiggyBank were the easiest to deal with and every week piggybank email me confirmation of my payment and my new balance. They froze my account at the loan plus one month interest without even asking!

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I would always suggest contacting the PDL company's before you default. I did this with Wonga and it was all straightfoward and quite easy to setup actually. I've gone from owing them just over £1200, to paying back £173 p/m for the next 7 months. I can now sleep at night and my whole months wage is not used straight away to pay back a PDL.

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I found,admittedly a while ago that no one would talk to me until i missed a payment.

 

I have to ask but are the amounts you are paying back reasonable or the amount that they are demanding.

 

For example minicredit went from owing £200 to over 1200. And they accused me of fraud because i said i was single then contacted them saying sorry but my wife has just died. Both true statements.

 

I hate minicredit with a passion and as the saying goes wouldn't. p*** on them if they were on fire.

Any opinion I give is from personal experience .

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I offered them £170 p/m and they came back with £173. So I accepted. They will ask for non-priority debts, which they won't really take into account. It's more about your essential expenditure.

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I was meaning the total amount not the monthly installment. In my example if minicredit came back saying i owed them a reasonable amount i would talk to them. They know that and until they do they can whistle

Any opinion I give is from personal experience .

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I've spoken to citizens advice who said we should offer then £15 per month but we have offered £5 per week. Any more than that and our kids will suffer and why should they go without for our stupidity ? Obviously they aren't spoilt but they need clothes, food, school trips etc. at the end of that day the PDL will get what we can afford and not a penny more. I have more important things and I am still paying them off. And will clear what I owe within 12 months!

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Of they refuse your fiver a week you can then say well on advice from cab we have revised it to them£15 per month. Just make sure once you have paid off what is the right amount you stop and refuse to pay more

Any opinion I give is from personal experience .

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I offered them £170 p/m and they came back with £173. So I accepted. They will ask for non-priority debts, which they won't really take into account. It's more about your essential expenditure.

 

I dont understand - why will they not take non priority debts into account ?

 

Your I & E should identify all your priority debts - you can anonymise your non priority debts, but they should be dealt with in order of priority of amount and date opened. A percentage of your disposable income should then be allocated. No creditor can insist that their debt takes priority over another.

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Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Citizen B I didn't really understand that bit. However from experience,particularly with PDL s they do not care about other non priority debts. In two cases they both wanted a sum that if i had paid to all creditors would have left me with negative money each month.

Any opinion I give is from personal experience .

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I thought it was pretty straightforward - I responded to a statement of bbfc

 

"They will ask for non priority debts, then simply ignore them by not taking them into account"

 

I pointed out that the pDL company have no right at all to prioritise their own debt as all creditors should be treated to the correct percentage of disposable income.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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:thumb:

 

This is why so many people end up paying ridiculously large sums to small and insignificant debts. The louder, more obnoxious, threatening the creditor the more money they get through intiimidation.

 

It is in every "debtor's" interest to immediately sort out a budget sheet and work out their disposable income. Then each creditor gets a percentage according to value of balance. This is the way in which Debt Counselling charities and the courts work.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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