Under investigation for housing benefit fraud - help required

[helpmeplease1]

Hi,

 

I am in a very awkward situation, I informed the housing benefit that I no longer required benefit as I was leaving my current address. I assumed this would be all they needed. However they are now investigating. Basically this is what happened:

 

I was made redundant in Jan earning approx £20k. My rent was £470 pcm inc bills in a "shared" house where the only sharing was a kitchen, we effectively had our own bed sits.

I claimed Job seekers and housing benefit. I received the full housing beneift of £470 for 13 weeks then they lowered it to £50 p/w as they claimed i was in shared accomodation.

I commenced full time employment on £20k March 5th, whilst claiming housing benefit. I was also still claiming Job seekers for 2 months whilst working.

I stopped claiming job seekers around May and continued to claim housing benefit til August.

 

How do I now proceed as I fear it will all come out and I will be sent to jail. The irony is my life is now in a very good position relative to years ago and I am prepared to pay the money back over time if I can avoid jail. The reason I claimed and continued to do so was that whilst redundant i built up various debts with loan sharks and have been struggling to pay them back.

 

Will they take this into account?

 

Any help gratefully appreciated.

 

As an aside I have a past criminal conviction for fraud (obtaining loans by deception 2 x 1 years imprisonment and armed robber 4 years all convicted at the same time) does this make matters worse?

[45002]

Hi,

 

I am in a very awkward situation, I informed the housing benefit that I no longer required benefit as I was leaving my current address. I assumed this would be all they needed. However they are now investigating. Basically this is what happened:

 

I was made redundant in Jan earning approx £20k. My rent was £470 pcm inc bills in a "shared" house where the only sharing was a kitchen, we effectively had our own bed sits.

I claimed Job seekers and housing benefit. I received the full housing benefit of £470 for 13 weeks then they lowered it to £50 p/w as they claimed i was in shared accommodation.

I commenced full time employment on £20k March 5th, whilst claiming housing benefit. I was also still claiming Job seekers for 2 months whilst working.

 

I stopped claiming job seekers around May and continued to claim housing benefit till August.

How do I now proceed as I fear it will all come out and I will be sent to jail. The irony is my life is now in a very good position relative to years ago and I am prepared to pay the money back over time if I can avoid jail. The reason I claimed and continued to do so was that whilst redundant i built up various debts with loan sharks and have been struggling to pay them back.

 

Will they take this into account?

 

Any help gratefully appreciated.

 

As an aside I have a past criminal conviction for fraud (obtaining loans by deception 2 x 1 years imprisonment and armed robber 4 years all convicted at the same time) does this make matters worse?

 

Have i got this right,you where claiming JSA for 2 months and HB for 5 months approximately while working in a 20k Job ?

 

Because you where in debt is No excuse to carry on claiming HB and JSA while working in a 20k Job !

 

Your been investigated

 

You need Advice from a Solicitor specialising in Criminal law.

Edited September 19, 2012 by 45002

[id6052]

i understand that you were experiencing financial difficulty and as a result you continued to claim benefit

 

although understandable, it is still benefit fraud

 

has the Council or DWP asked you to attend an interview? this could be either a basic interview or an Interview under Caution.

 

if they invite you to an Interview under Caution, then this normally means they think there is a possibility of prosecuting. in such a situation and in light of your previous record, you would be best to get professional legal advice. how long ago were your other offences?

[helpmeplease1]

Hi,

 

The offences were committed in 2004, I served custodial sentences from 2005-2007 and the sentence expiry dates were feb 2011. Can you/anyone advise as to where I can get "free" legal advice as although people are suggesting £20k is a lot to be earning I can assure you it is not.

 

I have decided the best course of action is to email back the investigator detailing the all the events and reasons for them admitting the frauds and offering to repay as well as being prepared for a fine/community order.

 

Is there anyway to avoid a custodial sentence if I explain the fact I am in full time work and the impact it would have on my life as opposed to repaying the money over time.

 

Also when I cancelled the benefit I subsequently moved to a different address with my girlfriend, will they create any problems for her given that she immediately declared it to the council tax to remove her single person allowance.

 

I am quite prepared for the consequences of my actions but need to ensure that she isn't affected, e.g when I am prosecuted in court will they list her address in the paper? and will it affect her mortgage/other issues if so I would prefer to put down I am living at my parents address as it shouldn't matter should it?

 

Thank you for any help, I just want to be sure I am taking the best course of action before I send the email to the investigator and start the chain of events leading to prosecution.

 

regards

[id6052]

There are 3 possible penalties that the Local Authority or DWP can apply.

 

These are:

 

1. a caution (an official warning) - you need to admit offence to be considered
   
2. an adminsistrative penalty (a fine or surcharge of an additional 30% of the overpayment) - you do not need to admit the offence to be considered
   
3. prosecution (court action) - you do not need to admit offence to be considered
   

A lot will depend on the amount of the overpayment.

 

The DWP will normally consider prosecution for overpayments greater than £2k, a lot of Local Authorities use same level as DWP (however some use other levels). Most Local Authorityies publish their prosecution/sanction policies. So I would suggest looking on their website for it.

 

If an overpayment is less than the level and you admit the offence, they may offer a Caution, if so, take the offer. If you deny the offence, they might offer an Administrative Penalty. In either instance, you will not appear in papers.

 

If you are offered a caution/administrative penalty and refuse it or if your overpayment is above the level, they will normally consider prosecution. As this is a court process, details may appear in local newspapers.

 

It should not affect your girlfriend's Council Tax. I can't think of any affect it would have on her existing mortgage.

than the Local Authority will usually prosecute.

If it is less than level

[terra]

Im not often a forum poster but on this occassion reciprocation is a must as I found this resource useful when I was the terrified individual in reciept of IUC invitation re fraudulent allegations for HB.

 

I got letter in oct 2012 on Sat morning, no doubt a tool used by council to reduce telephone traffic when benefit claimant sees red or goes into a state of shock horror like me. This gave me chest pains as the weekend obstructing anywhere to turn.

 

In no way do i suggest or advise to bury ur head in the sand. There r strict guidelines followed by investigators, u can view this kind of document on a search, fraud is serious and investigators r clever to counteract the deliberate fraudster attempts by pros who need to b clever to fiddle money rightfully not their own.

 

u know what its about and why so think & write it down, there r no ifs,maybes, excuses. Its black or white however far uve crossed a line, 1mm or 1 mile, its suspicious as fraud, Read what youve written and compare it to the 'meaning of' fraud in your dictionary/thesauras/wikki. No point kidding yourself.

 

I swatted up by hours of research debunking the pure crap and exploiting the constructive advice/opinion/experience. Acknowlegdge ur invitation (1) by email, i chose to decline and request a postponed date to find legal advice which took 3/4 weeks to get a direct conversation with a (legalaid ) willing solictor.

 

From here, depends on what youve done, its person centred. I knew mine was failing to report a change in circumstances 5 months previous when i stuck my fingers up to JSA and walked away. While suspicious!!!!! how the hell are you surviving, how are you buying food!!!!?????????? youve dug yourself a hole also by breaching policy. I substituted JSA by disposing of my personals and declared it outright in writing (post+email) to fraud dept and benefit dept. HB was suspended and had to avoid lengthy awkward confrontations with landlady who had no concrete solid proof to back me up, anyone can write a letter/ headerfooter etc she said!!!!!! I began prep to organise bankstatements etc that openly showed credits from online money services but way under weekly allowance that would be from JSA.

 

I acknowleged/ declined 2nd interview as still looking for legal aid. I stated I would not attend without someone by my side to represent me. A friend or relative was not good enough. I pointed out relevance with JSA but concerned about possible allegations. THEY WILL NOT DISCLOSE ANYTHING EVEN TO A LEGAL PERSON, they exploit loop holes too! I dont trust people in general at all even when i knew my case wouldnt go very far, i called the bluff in a way and sent pre IUC statement. This clearly contained careful wording which i recycled from fraud team type documents found on web. Dont lie unless your clever enough to play that game and if you intend on playing it then your somebody the fraud squad is after for prosecution.. Caution means that you are not under arrest but anything you do say maybe used in evidence, careful of joking about/ banter/ loose statements and being too generous with what you say - IUC is tape recorded. Investigatores are clever, cunning and have goldawards in gift of the gab. Greeting you in reception pretending to be nice is all part of it ,hoping for an easy admmission or implication - beware of 'rebuttal' statements.

these were my reasons for declining interview. 3rd interview invite never arrived. I emailed benefits weekly and fraud side weekly ( if 3rd invite does come still acknowledge it but decline attendance based on failure to appoint legal help)

 

I emailed benefits weekly and fraud side weekly. My very last email to both depts quoted/ sampled rights and law submitting them amicably in writing. I am not academic at all btw. I knew why this whole thing materialised and argued as fraud is obtaining money which you shouldnt have. Signing Off JSA does not benefit me interms of being financially better off as only increased/ newly commenced income would change this. HB remained the same (i knew this) and so no evidence of any kind to suggest plans, premeditated intentions to get money not eligible for. I declared sale of my own property to fund living costs. On IVA which currently suspended until ive found work supports me because you can only have one bank/b.society account on IVA DMP Bankruptcy.

 

Statements showed small scale injections of cash. I decided to finalise 'call my bluff' by not attending any further invites as my mouth would runaway and would get myself hung. I was not going to be a statistic or endure such crap on foriegn territory for a smacked bottom! Remember you face to results at the end of all this. One result is decision by fraud squad, the other result is a decision by council. This is what mortified me.

 

I clearly stated my circumstances and questioned the current policiy of suspension. This is a loop hole and council technically shouldnt suspend payments unless there is sufficient evidence for a good case for prosecution. Well they did with me without sufficient evidence and have now got it backdated. Must of been 6 diff emails to both departments all stating same thing with 'statement' or 'declaration' to clarify suspicion.

 

All that stress for not claiming JSA and saving govt £65 and sacrificing my NI and having to pay for prescription. But I still see why there was suspicion. If it is obvious or result of carelessness, just admit it, no reasons, no excuses, its black or white remember! Fraud is Fraud 10 pence or £1000. Nip it in the bud early.

 

Ironically, finally a legal aid solicitor called me for a consultation. The day after (on a saturday) I got council letter confirming revised claim successful and backdated money. Changes in circumstances is not exhaustive but i was exhausted.