Urgent advice - need to respond today - cpr 31.14 - no default notice received

[robcag]

Regarding the DN above, what date was it issued and what was the date given to rectify?

[n377y]

Thanks Andy

 

Any thoughts on Robs query re Notice of Assigment?

 

Also just in case you missed this I have posted the Default Notice.

 

Netty

[n377y]

Hi Andy

 

DN Issued on 13 May 2008. In the DN it says You must pay us £83.00 by 10th June 2008.

[robcag]

DN Issued on 13 May 2008. In the DN it says You must pay us £83.00 by 10th June 2008.

 

Unfortunately it looks like they played safe with those dates as they've given you more than the requisite 14 clear days.

 

I can't comment on the wording so I'll leave it to someone else to pick any possible holes in that.

 

Cheers

Rob

[n377y]

Rob

 

What happens if they cannot supply me with a copy of the documents requested in the CPR31.14?

 

Netty

[robcag]

Rob

 

What happens if they cannot supply me with a copy of the documents requested in the CPR31.14?

 

Netty

 

If they don't provide the documents by the time you have specified or by the time you need to submit your defence you have various options open to you such as agreeing more time with the enemy or submitting an 'Embarassed Defence'. There are different views on submitting an 'ED' and pt2537 wrote a thread which is stickied above, see; http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?283443-Embarrassed-Defences-and-the-problems-with-them

 

I haven't read it for a long time but AFAIR it details your options.

 

Cheers

Rob

[n377y]

Rob

 

Thanks for your response Rob. I can only see what happens. Would you advise me to send the CPR 31.14 with your amendments or wait for further comments. Im concious of time and was planning on posting this today. Would it hinder me to wait another day.

 

Netty

[robcag]

Rob

 

What happens if they cannot supply me with a copy of the documents requested in the CPR31.14?

 

Netty

 

Various things may happen in the meantime. It may well be that they will reply with their own suggestion that more time is agreed to enable them to obtain documentation. They may even reply to say they don't have an agreement (unlikely but possible!).

 

Cheers

Rob

[robcag]

Rob

 

Thanks for your response Rob. I can only see what happens. Would you advise me to send the CPR 31.14 with your amendments or wait for further comments. Im concious of time and was planning on posting this today. Would it hinder me to wait another day.

 

Netty

 

It won't do any harm to ask for both the NoA and the DoA. It's usually a bit of a struggle to get a DoA from a claimant and even when you do they're heavily redacted (stuff blacked out).

 

It would be nice if someone with a more authoritive view would comment but I guess it's best not to let this delay your sending of the request.

 

Cheers

Rob

[n377y]

Are there any charges on this account?

 

I think I would be defending all, sending the SAR request TODAY to both Lloyds and Hillsden to see what charges have been added to the account over the years and CPR requests for Agreement/default notice/NOA etc to Hills!

 

Jogs

 

 

Im wondering about this and would appreciate some feedback please.

 

Is the SAR Request to explore the charges on this account?

Will they give me details right back to 1999?

Should I do this now, does this not contradict any defence I might have in the future?

 

Netty

[andydd]

Hi.

 

SARs could throw up all sorts of details, but yes can be used to see what charges are on there.

 

I did this for Lloyds some years back (before the supreme court case) and got back about £2000 of bank charges

 

I believe you can go back 6 years. (Although I have seen talk of using S32 of limitation act to go back further). Ive used this in court to get refunds of overpaids amounts of rent going back about 14 years plus interest, it soon added up

 

Andy

[n377y]

Hi Andy

 

I have statements dating back to February 2006. No details prior to this. I do know that there were likely to be charges applied to this account back in 2002/3 because that is when my financial problems first started. I know I offered them a FF&S in 2003 and also requested they froze the interest but they refused both so I maintained the minimum from this point up until 2008. There are no significant charges on the account during the last 6 years, but there may have been in earlier years. Im not sure whether I was sold PPI initially either but that would be back in 1999.

 

 

 

Netty

[foxyflugel]

Hi n377y

 

The default notice that you have posted on your thread is not compliant - mine was from 2010!!

 

This is an extract from a conversation between the very knowledgable pt and and I

 

pt Does it say words to the effect of

 

"This notice should include a copy of the current Office of Fair Trading information sheet on default. This contains

important information about your rights and where to go for support and advice. If it is not included, you should contact

us to get one.".]

 

AND WHAT WAS THE DATE ON THE NOTICE

 

 

 

Pt - then your notice does not contain the statutory wording required by para 10a of schedule 2 of Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices)Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1561)

 

 

here's a link to my thread - hope it helps you.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?295124-Lloyds-TSB-Lloyds-taking-me-to-court-***-Discontinued-***/page2

 

Good luck.

 

Foxy

[n377y]

I received a response dated 22 May 2012 from the claimant. Here is what they have said, Im not sure what I need to do next, so advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

"We have been passed a copy of your letter dated 18 May 2012 by our Solicitors.

 

We acknowledge receipt of your reqest for information filed in accordance with Part 31.14 of the Civil Procedure Rules.

 

We are still awaiting copy documentation from the original lender and will forward it to you in due course. We confirm that your account will remain on hold until we have done so.

 

Should you require an extension of time to file your Defence pursuant to Part 15 of the Practice Directions, we will consent to an extension of 28 days.

 

Yours sincerely

 

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx"

[n377y]

Foxy

 

Thanks for the link, I will look into this now.

 

Netty

[n377y]

Please can anyone advise on what my next step should be.

 

I received a response dated 22 May 2012 from the claimant. Here is what they have said, Im not sure what I need to do next, so advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

"We have been passed a copy of your letter dated 18 May 2012 by our Solicitors.

 

We acknowledge receipt of your reqest for information filed in accordance with Part 31.14 of the Civil Procedure Rules.

 

We are still awaiting copy documentation from the original lender and will forward it to you in due course. We confirm that your account will remain on hold until we have done so.

 

Should you require an extension of time to file your Defence pursuant to Part 15 of the Practice Directions, we will consent to an extension of 28 days.

 

Yours sincerely

 

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx"

[AndyOrch]

Should you require an extension of time to file your Defence pursuant to Part 15 of the Practice Directions, we will consent to an extension of 28 days.

 

Copy the above and bold that sentence and then attach to a cover letter and request an extension to submit your defence by XXth XXXXX 2012 (56 days) as agreed with the claimant pursuant to CPR 15.5.

Then post fax or email to Northampton.

[n377y]

Andy

 

Please excuse my ignorance, why 56 days when they have only offered 28 days. Also is that 56 days from when I send the letter or from when they responded.

 

n377y

[AndyOrch]

Their extension of 28 you add to your initial 28 ,so work out when your original defence date was and then add 28,(=56) that is the new date for your defence.(Dont forget to allow for the Bank Holiday this weekend.)

 

Andy

[n377y]

Thanks Andy - I will have to look at this later when I get home from work. Many thanks for prompt reply.

 

Kind Regards

 

n377y

[n377y]

Hi Andy

 

Would you be able to give me some further advice please.

 

I have received a response and only some of the documentation I asked for.

 

I have received a copy of the Agreement

I have received a "template copy" of The Notice of Assigment but not a copy of the original

I have been sent "Key pages of the Account Sale Agreement" they have stated that full document will not be sent due to commercially sensitive information

I have been sent copies of Credit Card Statements for a period of 2.5 years.

 

I have not received copy of the Default Notice, copy of the original Notice of Assignment and Im not sure whether the Account Sale Agreement is the Termination Notice.

 

They have advised me that they intend to instruct their solicitors to proceed with the claim in the next fourteen days.

 

In view of the fact that I have not received all the documentation, please could you advise where I stand with this.

 

Netty

 

 

 

 

 

 

(

Thanks for your speedy responses

 

AOS completed - Do I post Registered or Recorded Delivery - Cannot do it online.

 

Also I have done the CRP31.14 Request does it go to the Claimant or the Solicitor or both?

18 May 2012

Name and address

Dear Sirs,

 

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

CPR CPR 31.14 Request

 

On 12 May 2012 I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you on 9thMay, 2012 out of the Northampton (CCBC) County Court.

I confirm having returned myacknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention tocontest all of your claim.

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for thedisclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of each of the followingdocuments mentioned in your Particulars of Claim and submitted to me by Friday25th May, 2012 i.e. within 7 days:

You will appreciate that in anordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where aclaim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documentsconstituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particularsof claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, thatany general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

1 the agreement

2 the assignment

 

3 the default notice

 

4 the termination notice

 

Although your claim is for a sum which is not more than £5,000.00 and willin all likelihood be allocated to the small claims track for determination uponmy delivering a defence, at this moment in time I have not delivered my defenceand the case has not been allocated to a track. In consequence the provisionsof CPR 27(2) are of no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance withyour CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise.

 

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that thedocuments I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days ofreceiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable andproportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, thebetter for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provideme with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document,the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will havea right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case.You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose ofthis case.

 

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more thanone version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration orother marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you mustprovide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making areasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligationto recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of athird party.

 

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for yourreasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tellme in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with thisrequest has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me whatsteps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this requestand also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In additionyour statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extensionof the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not lessthan 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my requestand you must state the new date for filing my defence.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you willnever be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail torequest more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of mydefence, I will make an application to the court for an order that theproceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costsorder.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you by 25th May 2012.

 

Yours faithfully

[n377y]

I received a County Court Claim on 9th May for a debt that had been sold to a collection company.

After advice I filed a defence and made a CPR 31.14 request for:

 

1. Copy of the Agreement

2. Notice of Assignment

3. Default Notice

4. Termination Notice

 

The collection company responded and gave me a further 28 day extention which expired on 4 July.

 

They wrote to me on 5th July and sent me

 

1. Copy of the Agreement

2. A template copy of the Notice of Assignment with line data used

3. Key pages of the Account Sale Agreement (they have not sent the full document as they say it is commercially sensitive.).

 

I am not sure what the Account Sale Agreement is in relation to the information I have requested and also whether they should submit the full document to me.

 

In addition they have not sent a copy of the Default Notice. Am I right in thinking that a debt cannot be sold without the issuing of a Default Notice.

 

At the end of the letter they have invited me to discuss settlement terms and that they intend instructing their Solicitors to proceed with the Claim in the next 14 days. - That will be tomorrow so

I guess I need to take action today.

 

Im not sure what my next step should be.

 

Please can some advise.

 

Kind Regards

 

N377y

 

 

P.S I have asked for advice on my previous thread too "Settling Out of Court" - sorry I dont know how to link this. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?350242-Settling-Out-of-Court&p=3912376#post3912376 hope this works.

[rebel11]

Thread has been moved to the correct forum.

 

The guys will be happy to advise as soon as they are available.

[n377y]

Many thanks.

 

N377y

[n377y]

Hello

 

Im desperate for advice today. Need to get a letter out by close of day.

 

Netty