NRAM - Interim Charging Order- Advice needed please

[Luxxinterior]

Hi,

Long story which started with the following threads regarding mine and my wifes loans with Northern Rock

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?198906-Court-Case-2-Northern-Rock

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?201020-Court-Case-3-Northern-Rock-(-Eversheds-)

 

The main crux of these cases was to do with PPI being added, and to cut a long story short we ended up settling the day before court and a Tomlin Order was issued for both myself and my wife.

 

As this was before it became widely known of the PPI [problem], we incurred a lot of costs due to the track decided by the judge, and for risk of having more costs, we settled...naively!

 

We made payments up until April last year when I was made redundant for 4 months, and to be hones...I think both they and we forget about it for 8 months before they came looking again.

 

We are 4 months in arrears with the mortgage due to the redundancy,have never caught up unfortunately, so these debts were not a high priority despite the Tomlin.

 

Now however, they have gone straight for an interim charging order.

I found this out from a 3rd party lowlife company offering to help.. I had no idea and the court papers didnt arrive until nearly 2 weeks later.

 

I dont know what to do next to be honest.

The irony is that the PPI we are now claiming back may well cover the debt owed.. andI am wondering if this is justification for obtaining a set-aside...or having the proceedings stopped?

 

Any help would be gratefully received and appreciated. I have uploaded all the documentation I have received recently, including one from the land registry.

 

The mortgage is in both names, so I believe they cannot obtain a full charging order? They have also written to my wife to say her ineterests wont be affected (not sure what means..or how they work that out?)

 

The hearing is on the 10th July, so any advice or pointers would be great

Solictiors letter to Mrs.pdf

Interim Charging Order.pdf

Application for Charging Order.pdf

Solictiors letter to Mr.pdf

[Luxxinterior]

Good Afternoon,

I never received any kind of documentation regarding a CCJ... should I have before the interim charging order was obtained?

Is the Tomlin Order a way of them automatically obtaining a CCJ?? How do I find out if I even have one???

 

Confused!

[AndyOrch]

Hi Lux

 

You would know if you had signed a Tomlin Order, if you have defaulted on the TO then the schedule would allow entry of a Judgment.Which then enables the ICO.

 

Andy

[Luxxinterior]

Hi Andy,

Sorry that was badly worded. I know I signed a Tomlin Order, I meant how do I know if I have a CCJ?

 

I am unsure on how to fight this, the PPI reclaim may well cover the cost of the debt!

[Ganymede]

Hi Andy,

Sorry that was badly worded. I know I signed a Tomlin Order, I meant how do I know if I have a CCJ?

 

I am unsure on how to fight this, the PPI reclaim may well cover the cost of the debt!

 

 

You can check you credit file or call the Court and ask.

 

It is very, very unlikely that an ICO would have been granted without a CCJ and should really be impossible.

 

I assume that you defaulted on the Tomlin Order? If you did, and based on what you have told us, it is 99% likely you now have a CCJ.

[Luxxinterior]

Thanks..

Do you think it is worth fighting on the basis that the PPI claim may cover the debt?

[AndyOrch]

You have to check the CCJ first,what date which court and request a copy of the Judgment.Did you keep a copy of the Tomlin Order?

 

Andy

[Luxxinterior]

You have to check the CCJ first,what date which court and request a copy of the Judgment.Did you keep a copy of the Tomlin Order?

 

Andy

 

Tomlin Order is attached in the first post Andy

[AndyOrch]

No Tomlin Order in post#1 Lux, there is a letter from the Sols 28.5.12 that states they have sent you a sealed copy.Its the schedule I need to see.

I notice judgment was granted 29th July 2010 on the Application for Charging Order.

 

Andy

[Luxxinterior]

No Tomlin Order in post#1 Lux, there is a letter from the Sols 28.5.12 that states they have sent you a sealed copy.Its the schedule I need to see.

I notice judgment was granted 29th July 2010 on the Application for Charging Order.

 

Andy

 

That's the date of the Tomlin order, I will upload it soon... Thought I did already..apologies

Tomlin Order.pdf

Edited June 21, 2012 by Luxxinterior
Adding Attachment

[Luxxinterior]

Tomlin order attached above.. My wife also received the same order but for a different amount

 

Thanks

[AndyOrch]

Hi Lux

 

Ok the Tomlin Order is dated the 29th July 2010, set out the schedule of the terms herein.Do you know that they applied for the CCJ on the same date you signed this before you missed a payment?

In effect you have had a CCJ since that date irrespective of payments made?

 

Regards

 

Andy

[AndyOrch]

I have unapproved your TO Lux as this is confidential.

[Luxxinterior]

I have unapproved your TO Lux as this is confidential.

Thought it may be Andy!

 

I had no idea about the CCJ!! That would apply to my wife too as hers is the same!

 

Is there anything I can do to stop the charging order given the circumstances surrounding PPI?

 

Regards

[AndyOrch]

Did you agree to the TO on the understanding that the claim would be stayed, providing you met the payment schedule and not default?

[Luxxinterior]

Did you agree to the TO on the understanding that the claim would be stayed, providing you met the payment schedule and not default?

 

I assumed that to be the case... To be honest, it was literally at the final hour, and due to the costs involved with the track the cases were assigned, we thought it best to just settle.

Without legal advice I guess we just walked into it eyes wide shut!! But I had no idea it meant an instant CCJ!

[AndyOrch]

Ok lets cut the chase then the TO has been drafted in a very unorthodox style, purpose of the TO is to avoid the CCJ otherwise why sign it?

 

You will notice that within the Order it states:-

 

2. The proceedings are stayed on the settlement terms except for the purpose of carrying those terms into effect for which the parties have permission to apply to the Court

 

3.If the Defendant fails to comply with the Settlement Terms is capable of enforcement (without a further Order) as if they amounted to a Judgment of the Court.

 

 

Now to default means to miss a payment and break the terms of the settlement but to " enforce it " means having something already to enforce therefore you have agreed to the Judgment by signing the schedule, irrespective of a missed payment or not.

 

" Without Further Order " means that the judgment will be passed and the ICO will have a green light.

 

So that's where we are now, they already had judgment the day you signed, your default enabled the execution of the CCJ.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Luxxinterior]

Ok lets cut the chase then the TO has been drafted in a very unorthodox style, purpose of the TO is to avoid the CCJ otherwise why sign it?

 

You will notice that within the Order it states:-

 

2. The proceedings are stayed on the settlement terms except for the purpose of carrying those terms into effect for which the parties have permission to apply to the Court

 

3.If the Defendant fails to comply with the Settlement Terms is capable of enforcement (without a further Order) as if they amounted to a Judgment of the Court.

 

 

Now to default means to miss a payment and break the terms of the settlement but to " enforce it " means having something already to enforce therefore you have agreed to the Judgment by signing the schedule, irrespective of a missed payment or not.

 

" Without Further Order " means that the judgment will be passed and the ICO will have a green light.

 

So that's where we are now, they already had judgment the day you signed, your default enabled the execution of the CCJ.

 

Regards

 

Andy

 

Thanks Andy,

They already have the ICO, but can we stop the full charging order at the hearing on the 10th July?

 

Incidentally, my wife received a letter from the court today, so it looks like they are going down the same route with her.

 

Regards

[AndyOrch]

Anyone can have a ICO if there is a CCJ in place and the judgment allows it.To stop it being made full you will have to raise objections 7 days before the hearing.The only objection I can see worthwhile would be the TO not being clear on default and that you was not aware the Judgment would be entered on the same day as signing the order but only if you defaulted.You was not aware or you would not of agreed.

 

The CO is not always a bad thing in resolving theses matters, its puts the matter to an end.If the CO is made final and your objections fail then ask for conditions to be attached. IE no Order for sale unless a default by you in payment.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Luxxinterior]

Thanks Andy

[Luxxinterior]

I am worried sick about this now!! I have to respond to the Land Registry by tomorrow with my objection... I have no idea what to say.

 

How likely is it that they could force a sale on my home, which is in joint names??

 

Do I just attend at the hearing on the 10th?

 

Do I have to pay if I want to attend??

 

So confused by all this!

[Luxxinterior]

Just had a brainwave... I think.

 

Could I not argue that the amount owing at the time the tomlin order was signed, is now inaccurate due to the mis selling of PPI? Until we are refunded the PPI, we cannot say how much is owed, and nor can they??

 

Any advice?

[AndyOrch]

I am worried sick about this now!! I have to respond to the Land Registry by tomorrow with my objection... I have no idea what to say.

Irrespective of any objection Lux I cannot see the FCO being denied, even if you had not signed the TO the DJ may assume the judgment would have been attained.

How likely is it that they could force a sale on my home, which is in joint names?? Rare as chickens teeth

 

Do I just attend at the hearing on the 10th? Yes but do attend to present your side of the claim

 

Do I have to pay if I want to attend?? No

 

So confused by all this!

Just request a condition of no forced sale

 

Regards

 

Andy

[AndyOrch]

http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/debt_e/debt_action_your_creditor_can_take_e/charging_orders.htm#can_you_stop_a_final_charging_order_being_made.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Luxxinterior]

Court hearing today... Took about 30 seconds. Adjourned for 56 days due to complaint and mis-selling of PPI!!

Interim order remains!