ESPORTA £20 penalty and 15 weeks notice?

[Its WAR]

My son missed his monthly payment beginning of January and Esporta have levied a £20 penalty (just like the banks). My son decided to cancel his membership , but they have said he has to pay up to 30 April, because he has to give 3 full months notice. It sems odd that a monthly account doesnt have a monthly notice. 3 months plus, seems a bit unfair to me. If they refuse to allow one month, and my son still hasnt paid his January amount, I am guessing they wont let him use the club in Feb, Mar or April. Al;so, is there a risk of a default on his credit file?

[artmo]

Esporta does require 3 month's notice as per their contract. If he doesn't pay and they pass it to a debt collection firm then he could get a black mark on his credit rating.

[buzby]

Whether he gets a black mark is NOT up to the debt collector.

 

He has to have given permission for Esporta to report his financial dealings to a CRA. If the contract did not specifically state this, he has nothing to worry about. However, if they DO - then they may already be showing him as being in default of his agreement, so it may be best to check.

[artmo]

I didn't say the debt collection firm could put an entry on his file. If he is in default on his payments then Esporta can do this. Their contracts clearly state 3 months written notice - if you read them.

[buzby]

Better punctuation would have avoided the ambiguity!

[boliston]

I think that normal consumer contracts don't get monthly reporting via experian & equifax, as this is really aimed at reporting on CREDIT related payments on loans, cards & mortgages. With subscription type contracts these will only show up on experian/equifax if it goes to court and a CCJ is issued. I doubt a health club would bother to go to court as they just generally send out threatening letters dressed up to look like solicitors letters rather than an actual court summons, which would cost them money.

[IdaInFife]

I have moved this to the gym forum - have a read around there as well

[buzby]

I think that normal consumer contracts don't get monthly reporting via experian & equifax, as this is really aimed at reporting on CREDIT related payments on loans, cards & mortgages.

 

WRONG.. And how!

 

Ask amyone who has a mobile phone contract - perhaps the most prevelant (mis) use of reporting 'credit'. It originally started to record credit dealings, then was extended to include Electroal Registers, County Court Judgements, and in fact ANYTHING the consumer has actually agreed to disclosure. I would warrant there are more non-credit (CRA compliant) records stored on the systems of the 3 CRA's than only the 'credit' ones you believe they are interested in.

[artmo]

One thing in all this that hasn't been mentioned is the stupidity of individuals to sign contracts without reading them. Most of the anguish expressed on these threads could have been easily avoided by applying a little common sense at the beginning.

[buzby]

Or indeed NOT signing a contract at all! The number of times I'm asked for my DoB, and they get so upset when I tell them it's none of their business!

[boliston]

WRONG.. And how!

 

Ask amyone who has a mobile phone contract - perhaps the most prevelant (mis) use of reporting 'credit'. It originally started to record credit dealings, then was extended to include Electroal Registers, County Court Judgements, and in fact ANYTHING the consumer has actually agreed to disclosure. I would warrant there are more non-credit (CRA compliant) records stored on the systems of the 3 CRA's than only the 'credit' ones you believe they are interested in.

 

Mobile phone contracts are however "credit" based as they don't ask you to pay for your calls "up front" like you do with PAYG, so this is different from a Gym contract where you generally have to pay each month's rental "in advance" so there is no element of credit involved. Also with a mobile contract you often get the handset often worth £400+ "for free" when you agree to a contract, the the monthly payments are in effect payments for that expensive hardware, so again very different from a Gym contract where no actual goods are involved, apart from perhaps a "free sports towel" when you sign up!

[artmo]

Assuming you want to join the club there isn't any way you can do so without signing a contract. Most clubs limit guest visits. They would be very suspicious of anyone not willing to sign.

[buzby]

'Credit' is an often misunderstood term, however in maaters like these there is no room for them to be misconstrued. Mobile phone companies exend 'credit' in much the same way as taxi drivers do. They do not ask for you to pay for your journey in advance of making it. Similarly, you are required to pay your mobile bill in full every month, no credit is extended, and neither is there any interest added to cover the period of idebtedness.

 

No phones are provided 'for free' they are an inducement to agree to the contract, in much the same way certain sport clubs will bundle additional services (for which there is usually an additional charge) for one or two months for your agreed contract period. This can often be for a minimum of 12 months, followed by 3 month notice period - but only a fool would think that anything is 'free'.

[Its WAR]

You would think that customer recruitment and retention would be a prime focus to sports clubs. I dont get why they would them push £20 penalties. Havent they learnt anything from the banks.

 

So the moral of the story is DONT JOIN ESPORTA.

 

If you work for Esporta, read it again. DONT JOIN ESPORTA.

[artmo]

I don't work for Esporta but I am a member. I know what I've signed up to and am very happy with my membership.

[Its WAR]

Until you want to leave..... The problem with the contravt is that when it is introduced to you to sign, you want to join, so you can often be convinced by your wish to join, to gloss over the detail in the contract. I would bet no body (having noticed the 3 month notice section), would thensay to the staff member " sorry I am not joining because I dont like the notice period". They would just sign, because at that time, joining is high on the agenda, leaving is low.

[artmo]

I know a number of people who have left without a problem. They simply follow the rules they agreed when they joined. It seems some people want to cheat the system all the time.

 

Also when at my club I often hear prospective members being signed up and the 3 month clause is always mentioned to them by the sales staff.

[Its WAR]

Yes, well the OFT agree with me, they too are very concerned regarding the 3 month period. Yes you are right, some people do want to cheat some systems........Funny how its only the bad ones like Esportas.

[artmo]

Where is the detail from OFT? I'd like to read it.

[Its WAR]

So, my son missed the january payment (approx £60.00) They charged him £20. My Son cancelled and also missed the Feb payment whilst waiting for a reply ....debt now £146. But a letter just arrived from ARC stating a balance oweing is now £302. Despite Esporta ignoring the dispute and not replying to the correspondence.

 

Artmo......these are the boys you are happy to give your money to. I reckon who you give your custom to is just as important as the product you buy. Whilst sports club membership is often a good product, I maintain DONT BUY IT FROM ESPORTA. Why would anyone choose to give such firms a penny when their contract is rubbish? Their retention policy is worse and the probability of insolvency so high. I would choose a company that knows how to look after and retain their customers. In these difficult times, it will be those companies that resolve concerns, retain customers and prepare themselves to take full advantage of better trading conditions as the recovery occurs, that will prosper.

 

So, is it certain that Esporta will mark a default on a credit file or only if they win a ccj? Its my guess they will ignore a summons and just send threats, but use the default report instead of the courrt.

 

Does anyone know for sure?

[buzby]

Reporting to CRA requires everyone to give their explicit permission to do so. If they wanted to do this, it will be stated in your sons contract with Esporta - so you should look to this for guidance, rather than assume.

 

As for avoiding them - why? They are just keeping their side of the contract. What you have to ask yourself is this. Why would anyone want to sign up to a legally binding contract for something as inconsequential as this? (Same holds true for mobiles). If you want a Gym - go to one that doesn't require a contract and use it instead.

 

Just because it is 'expected' is no reason to be a lemming like everyone else. Once this becomes the issue is should be, these firms will be forced to end this cosy arrangement they've created for themselves, and earn their money directly for the services they actually provide.

[artmo]

Had the boy given 3 months notice in January he would have paid about £180 in total and had full use of the club until the end of March. Pity he didn't consider this at the time. Has he been into the club and had a face-to-face meeting with the manager?

[Its WAR]

Unfortunately, like many young people, they buy things (sign up for membership) when times are good. When times are bad, they need to stop buying things. In Esportas case, they work on the fact that most people do not read every single piece of small print. Most people just consider they want to join at that point. People generally do not consider that they actually want to leave at all. The repercussions are not explained.

 

Can you imagine Esportas staff saying that "Of course Mr xxxx, when you want to leave, you have to give a rolling 3 month notice and if you miss a payment, we will charge you £20, and if you fail to pay anything in 5 weeks it will be £300. Oh, and we will ignore your letters of complaint and just pass the matter to a debt collector" They wouldnt sell one single membership.

 

Buzby is exactly right. I reckon we should read every detail of the agreement and cross out the bits we dont like. Then get them to agree. If they wont agree, we wont buy...........Trouble is , we want to buy, what we dont want is the rubbish service if we ever want to leave.

[Its WAR]

It seems that once you have missed the payment, Esporta require the full balance of the contract. So, thats why the 2 missed payments suddenly increases to the amount of 4 months worth. Anyway, I have paid the fee up to 1st May to get the bill paid, I deducted the £50 in charges and they will let me know if its accepted.

[pa_broon74]

These gyms ignore disputes because as far as they're concerned your hooked for 12 months minimum, if your not happy and try to cancel enter ARC then someone like Trevor Munn.

 

They'll bully and threaten for a while, Trever will send a faux legal letter about county court proceedings but will do nothing. Eventually selling the debt on to another even more tawdry collection agency, it'll just rumble on and on until eventually all your son will here are automated messages left on what ever contact number they have for him.

 

In terms of credit referencing, I'm not an expert but I do have a terrible credit rating, to my knowledge nothing about David Lloyd though (the gym I had a tussle with.) For credit ratings I'd only worry about CCJ's and your son won't get one on account of this, any CAB officer will say the same thing. They're just playing the odds, hoping he'll he'll eventually cough up.

 

As mentioned above, you can't join a gym without agreeing to the contract terms, but defaulting rarely leads to anything more than a series of threatening letters or these weird recorded computer voices on your voice mail. I now get a fair bit of exercise from goading companies like ARC and Trevor Munn, if you can get them to lose their temper on the phone (use the record function on your mobile) it works wonders as a bargaining chip.