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    • He was one of four former top executives from Sam Bankman-Fried's firms to plead guilty to charges.View the full article
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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Capone/cabot v OH (disputed Acc)


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received the very same cca 'application'.... sent SAR and got statements basically with some manual notes BUT they sent me somebody else's personal and financial detais.. bout 50 pages!! Mine missing. Wrote to Capital One and no reply whatsoever. Have written again and still not one reply to my formal complaint regarding the breach of Data Protection Act... have also informed third party who is aking complaint.. also to ICO

 

My main complaint in 2007 to the FOS was peanlty charges and phone calls. Capital One offered the penalty charges back but made no mention at all sbout my complaint about phone calls. I refused their offer as a result. More than 6 months later I get an FOS ajudicator who has asked for my latest documentation. i really am not very hopeful at all about the FOS supporting my claim to investigate and reprimand Capital One for making all these calls based on what other people have stated the FOS has said in the past... ie they can call us once a week... and this means try and try and try as much as they want until they get trhough..... I called it blackmail to be honest as Capital One have stated they will only stop calling if I a. pay or b. pay basically!!

 

Will keep you informed of outcome. Be aware that it is very true that Capital one hardly ever reply to letters ...........

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I was about to post mine up here and notied this thread. Mine too is the exact same. Why exactly is this unenforceable? Do the presribed terms have to be on the same sheet as the signature? Has anyone here been to Court and argued about this type of agreement where the terms are on another page?

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What prescribed terms?

Nationwide-A&L-Halifax 1-Student Loans Company-NatWest-Virgin Media-Link-Capital One ALL WON!

Thames Credit -statute barred sent 13/11/08

BCW- prove debt letter- 14/08/08

Apex- CCA 14/08/08

Redcats UK- SAR 14/04/09

Call Serve- CCA 14/08/08

Littlewoods- no CCA letter 03/09/08- Lowells now

Wescot- CCA 19/9/08

Capital One/Debitas- now with Lowells

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All information has been obtained from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

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The first sheet (with the signature) states the following "I have read the terms and conditions setting out the agreement with Capital One and, if my application is accepted, I agree to be bound by these terms and conditions".

 

s189 of the CCA1974 states that

"a document embodies a provision if the provision is set out either in the document itself or in another document refered to in it".

 

It follows that if the prescribed terms are within some other document referred to in the signed document (in this case, the terms and conditions) then it is enforceable.

 

I'd love some comments on this as Im a bit of a novice. I have the exact same "agreement" as the original poster, as do a lot of people on here.

 

Why exactly do any of you believe this to be unenforceable?

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What I would add here however, is that to properly fulfill a CCA request the creditor must supply a full copy of any other document refered to as part of the signed agreement. In this case, a full copy of the T&C at the time.

 

Cap1 have clearly not done this in this case (or mine). The 2nd sheet is not a full copy of the T&C (no mention of late charges for example). IMO they have not fulfilled the CCA request and Ill be putting them on notice of default (but perhaps not spell it out to them exactly why they have not properly complied hehehehe)!!!!!

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Hi John- do you have your own thread where we could link to, specifically about your situation?

 

Look at this thread to see about what makes an agreement enforceable.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/105315-my-agreement-enforceable-useful.html

Nationwide-A&L-Halifax 1-Student Loans Company-NatWest-Virgin Media-Link-Capital One ALL WON!

Thames Credit -statute barred sent 13/11/08

BCW- prove debt letter- 14/08/08

Apex- CCA 14/08/08

Redcats UK- SAR 14/04/09

Call Serve- CCA 14/08/08

Littlewoods- no CCA letter 03/09/08- Lowells now

Wescot- CCA 19/9/08

Capital One/Debitas- now with Lowells

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All information has been obtained from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

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I didnt want to start a new thread for this as its the exact same documents that are posted here at the start of the thread. No point goin over the same stuff in different threads if it can be avoided.

 

I have checked the link thanks emma. There doesnt seem to be a definitive answer out there for this which is strange as a lot of people seem to get this exact response from Cap1.

 

Ignore POST 32 from me as I found answers in another thread. It appears that the enforceability of this is whether or not Cap1 can produce an original 2-sided document with the 2nd sheet (terms) on the back. In any event, they are currently in breach of the CCA request by not supplying the full T&C. I'll keep them at bay on this point until someone can (hopefully) come up with an strong argument (or case law) regarding the enforceability issue.

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Who's hijacking my thread then?

 

Tried ringing TS yesterday, follow up to my letter) their phone was ringing & ringing & ringing etc etc - CP1 now standing at 136 calls/34 days.

 

Re: cca unenforceability, for starters there is no credit limit/APR or charges stated. In addition they are about to run out of time with my SAR request.

 

The screw has turned, as I drive approx 300 miles at night I have been forced to take time off due to lack of sleep ( my employer has quoted health & safety). Managed now to block their calls but cannot do anything about their off shore call centre.

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"Re: cca unenforceability, for starters there is no credit limit/APR or charges stated".

 

If you look at the 2nd document there is APR and breakdown shown in a table. Charges are not a prescribed term according to CCA1974 so its fine to have them detailed in a separate T&C booklet.

 

I would agree that there is no credit limit shown, simply a statement that says it will be notified and is subject to change (section 2 of the 2nd document). IMO, if MBNA show up to Court with a double sided document with those terms on the back, your only possible defence is that there is no credit limit shown. It seems weak to me but at the end of the day the CCA regs are absolute, credit limit is a prescribed term according to the info from Emma's thread above and if its not specified in the "4 corners of the agreement document" then a Court should rule it unenforceable.

 

Anyone else have any thoughts or experience in relation to this? Arguing unenforceability solely because no credit limit is specified within the agreement?

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Hello John, Thank you for your comments, my remark was a lighthearted comment in reply to you using my CCA docs as an example to your own cca after Emma suggested that you start your own thread detailing your own situation.

 

I have my own issues with Cap.One and I wouldn't like your situation with them to get confused with mine.

 

Emma has been an absolute gem since I started posting and to be honest brought me back from the brink of total despair.

 

Jim

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HI beachcomber60;

 

The only real sure way to stop these calls is to make a complaint to bt or whoever your phone line is with and get a special protected number due to harrasment that stopped them dead in the water immediately worked for me also changed mobil no one has phoned from those dca idiots in 18mths:D

 

good luck

 

ooc

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Hi Beachcomber60- I think Capital One are officially taking the **** with these phone calls. And now, thanks to your boss, I think you have a clear cut case for harassment.

 

I've PMed you with an idea.

Nationwide-A&L-Halifax 1-Student Loans Company-NatWest-Virgin Media-Link-Capital One ALL WON!

Thames Credit -statute barred sent 13/11/08

BCW- prove debt letter- 14/08/08

Apex- CCA 14/08/08

Redcats UK- SAR 14/04/09

Call Serve- CCA 14/08/08

Littlewoods- no CCA letter 03/09/08- Lowells now

Wescot- CCA 19/9/08

Capital One/Debitas- now with Lowells

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All information has been obtained from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

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Im going to start my own thread to discuss the legality and enforceability of this type of agreement. I'm really interested in any opinions about my post #37.

 

How do I upload scans like the original post here? Do I need to upload to an imagehost site? I've uploaded some scans to here as attachments but cannot find the option to put them into a post. Thanks all and goodluck Jim. I'll post back here if I get any further solid info re: enforceability.

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Capital One Interrogation Unit contact numbers - Kommandant E. Renshaw

 

If you have caller display these are the numbers CP1 will use to harrass you :- 08004220280, 08004220294, 08004220295, 08004220293, 08004220292, +8004220292, 08004220278, 01158431401, 01158431415, 01158431411, 01159938310, 01159938302, 01158431407, 01159938301, 01159938311, 01159938304, 01159938303, 01158431413, 01159938308, 01158431403, 01159938306, 01158783300, 01158431405, 01159938309, 01159938305, 01158783301, 01159938307, +1159938303, +1158431407, 01158431409, +1159938308, +1159938309, +1159938302, also use number withheld & unavailable out of area. (All logged day, date & time).

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Yep- I'm getting the Unavailable number at the moment. I just haven't managed to be in to berate them about it yet! I still can't believe what they are doing to you, Beachcomber.

 

Are you still answering- what is your method with them at the moment? And how are you holding up?

Nationwide-A&L-Halifax 1-Student Loans Company-NatWest-Virgin Media-Link-Capital One ALL WON!

Thames Credit -statute barred sent 13/11/08

BCW- prove debt letter- 14/08/08

Apex- CCA 14/08/08

Redcats UK- SAR 14/04/09

Call Serve- CCA 14/08/08

Littlewoods- no CCA letter 03/09/08- Lowells now

Wescot- CCA 19/9/08

Capital One/Debitas- now with Lowells

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All information has been obtained from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

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Here's one missed from the list above:

 

08005610415

 

They hit 720 Logged calls with me Today! That does not include the Calls before I started logging all of this.

 

Once I S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) them, that's assuming they will be dumb enough to provide the past Call Data, I think I could top 1,000 Calls from them.

 

One day, soon, I will ram this up a CapitalOne banker...very firmly. Police are aware, and I am steadily working on getting a name for the low life f-wit at CapitalOne who has authorised all of this.

 

I'm sure he/she/it thinks this is all jolly clever.

 

Cheers,

BRW

Edited by banker_rhymes_with
Can't Spell!
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Mornin' Only five 'unavailable - Out of Area' (probably India) calls today, I did answer the first call and when asked for security checks I told him to bog off - if they cant display their number I aint passing over personal details - he seemed shocked and hung up.

 

Had a call from OFT in response to my TS complaint, advised to write to CEO of cap1 and point out that the level of calls are totally unacceptable following a request to comm. in writing only. What helped was the fact that following 'that letter' calls have INCREASED each day. So must point out that calls must cease forthwith, failure to do so will result in a complaint going before the FOS.

 

Have been given a reference number to report back to OFT if instructions are not met.

 

All our other creditors have accepted lower payments and froze interest thanks to NDL budget sheet & all without any of the cr*p like cap1.

 

Have received S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) and not one mention of the phone calls that they have been making, charges were disappointing so may decide to go the unenforceable route and tell em to stick it where the sun dont shine.

 

So overall a positive day - POSITIVE MENTAL ATTITUDE - after having a few days off the world aint such a bad place after all (well apart from these morons!)

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Have received S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) and not one mention of the phone calls that they have been making

 

That's interesting, and about what I am expecting back from my own S.A.R - (Subject Access Request).

 

If their clever Auto-Dialling Threat Machine is clever enough to call people several times a day, and vary the Calling Line Identity (CLI) of the number it calls from, and can vary the numbers it Calls, and can vary the CLI used to the same number called...

 

...then it's clever enough to make a Log of who it does Call.

 

However, it seems that CapitalOne think that Log is for their use only, and not something they wish to provide in a SAR.

 

If they omit that, it makes me wonder what else are they omitting from a SAR?

 

Cheers,

BRW

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Help Urgent advice requested.

 

Cap 1 have served default notice even though the account is in dispute and subject to formal complaint that hasnt been resolved.

 

I am very angry as they (for the second time) contradict themselves, in a letter provided with my CCA they state that 'we would not issue a default notice if we had received our I&E form', they have already received it twice and have acknowledged receipt. CCA seems to be unenforceable, didnt originally want to dispute the debt just want them to get their heads outa their backside and accept the pro rata payments cause there aint no more available & I aint handing over confidential documents that they are not entitled to have.

 

Dont honestly know whether to make them take me to court and defend my corner (plus hopefully prove to the Judge what absolute sh*ts this company is and produce telephone logs & letters demanding bank statements etc etc.

 

Spoke too soon yesterday about feelin the worlds a better place!

 

Help needed in which way forward.

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Hello Beachcomber60!

 

It's hard to know what they are up to, to be honest.

 

If they want to Sell the alleged Debt, then they need to Default you so they can extract themselves from their side of the alleged Agreement. They also have to Default you to take you to Court, so it's not clear yet what their real motive may be.

 

Once Defaulted, then they can Sell it, provided they Assign it correctly to the next low life down the banking food chain.

 

Likewise, it could just be a Threat aimed at getting you to call them and pull out your Debit Card (they are always keen to see that).

 

If you can, maybe Scan the Default Notice and post it here with any Private bits edited out. Then we can all take a look to see if it is valid or not.

 

Likewise, check the figures, have they stated a correct amount? If the alleged Debt is partly made up of unlawful charges, then any Total they claim is owed cannot be accurate. Likewise, even if they have stated an arrears Total, how can that be accurate if the arrears are based on a Total that is itself inaccurate.

 

IOW, if the alleged Debt Total is wrong, then the Monthly Payment needed will be inaccurate, and any missed Payments will have been overstated, so that means any arrears will also be inaccurate.

 

It has to be your call, but my temptation would be to sit back and let them make all the moves from here. Just gather the evidence against them, Log Harassment Calls, and watch for them making mistakes. Read up on CAG what has happened to others, as in many cases the same things will happen to you in about the same order.

 

Soon, you will anticipate every next move they make, and will be ahead of them.

 

If they do go to Court, the second they try, read the Thread I mentioned above, i.e.

 

Getting Them To Reveal Their Vitals. Using CPR 31.14 to Your Advantage

 

That's to let you jump in from the very outset to make them show you the Agreement they claim they have...i.e. before a Court Track has been allocated. This option is not normally available if Small Claims Track, so might be a useful tactic to fire at them if they do push this.

 

At least then you will see what they have before the Court stage.

 

I'm just trying to point you towards further study. I would not get too upset at the moment, as it's nearly impossible to stop these bankers doing whatever they feel they have to do.

 

They are never reasonable, so you just have to plan ahead and field any wobblies they throw at you as they come in.

 

I hope this helps.

 

Cheers,

BRW

Edited by banker_rhymes_with
Typo plus added Text to aid clarity.
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...should I write and tell them that have still not complied with my CCA request, and remind them that the account is still in dispute.

 

Yes, I think that would be wise. But do send it via Special Delivery, or they will deny ever having received it.

 

But that would be sensible, as it slips in the fact that they are wrong to issue a Default Notice. You would be right to hit them with this while they still have time not to go ahead with the actual Default.

 

You have to accept that if they intend to lodge the Default, that is what they will do. But, having a good toot at them between Default Notice and Default, will aid your case if/when this either goes to Court, or if/when you make a Complaint about them to the Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS), Trading Standards (TS), Information Commissioners Office (Information Commissioners Office), etc etc.

 

I regret it is a sad fact that once you question a banker's Right to make you Pay, they will not play nice or fair. They won't do reasonable either.

 

Cheers,

BRW

Edited by banker_rhymes_with
Can't spell.
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They still haven't complied with my CCA request- the keep saying they haven't received anything- and after their phone call this evening (which was the worst ever) I will be writing to them. I will be enclosing a copy of my previous request, details so they can check track and trace, and a serious complaint about the staff member I spoke to tonight.

 

I would probably advise you do the same Beachcomber, but you are doing so well with your complaints as it is, far better and more advanced than me! I still can't believe how angry they have made me. It was asking why I hadn't paid them for six months before I am disputing the account, when I had paid twice during that time and (as is in the notes on the account) they know the rest of the time I was in hospital. Of course it just made me shout down the phone "what the hell has that got to do with you?"

 

I'm just off to write angry letters complaining and asking for all my charges back. I really hate them tonight and I will never pay them anything until they provide an enforceable CCA. ANd even then they'll get £1 per month.

 

Sorry about the rant.

Nationwide-A&L-Halifax 1-Student Loans Company-NatWest-Virgin Media-Link-Capital One ALL WON!

Thames Credit -statute barred sent 13/11/08

BCW- prove debt letter- 14/08/08

Apex- CCA 14/08/08

Redcats UK- SAR 14/04/09

Call Serve- CCA 14/08/08

Littlewoods- no CCA letter 03/09/08- Lowells now

Wescot- CCA 19/9/08

Capital One/Debitas- now with Lowells

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All information has been obtained from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

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