Northern Rock - unsecured loan

[flooz]

I had a thread on General, but believe this is the correct place for posting, so I shall do just that.

 

Sent CCA letter to northern Rock, who actually managed to send a signed agreement back to me. I just need someone who understand this stuff to explain to me, whether it's properly executed or not. I suspect it is.

 

But thanks for looking for me, and hopefully I shall be successful in posting the details. I shall post the T&C's on a separate post....

Edited January 18, 2010 by flooz

[flooz]

T&C's received - hope they're legible

Edited January 18, 2010 by flooz

[flooz]

Please, can anyone help me on this? I know there's a thread somewhere about 'Is your agreement drawn up correctly' but to be truthful, I just don't understand it all.

 

The main reason I'm trying to deal with all this (and this may affect any advice given) is our business is fast becoming insolvent (it's a leasehold pub) which may result in one or both of us becoming bankrupt. My (partial) reasoning is if I can sort out loans/CC's etc we may be able to avoid total bankruptcy. Does that make sense at all?

 

If anyone can advise me, I'd be immensely grateful.

[Jan4a]

Hi Flooz

 

sorry can't really help - I'm just subscribing as interested as I've just won a PPI claim against Northern Rock. They supplied my signed agreement from 2004 without any problems. They do seem to keep them unlike some banks.

 

good luck.

 

Jan

[flooz]

thanks for looking though Jan.

[flooz]

Anybody? Please?

[cerberusalert]

Check this out, it doesn't have cancellation rights;

Edited November 5, 2009 by cerberusalert
removed link

[IdaInFife]

can you remember wher you signed these at home or at a NR branch?

[flooz]

Thanks Ida, it's my husband's loan, and it was applied for on-line, I believe the forms were sent through the post. does that help at all?

[flooz]

As they were signed at home, is there a major difference in the structure of the T&C's? Or should there be?

 

Many thanks

[no_dosh]

Hi flooz, i am currently being taken to court by n/rock via Wallers solicitors. my agreement was done in 2004. I have no cancellation rights on my agreement either. i have been trying to find info on whether this would make it unenforceable (can someone please cofirm ?) also on the agreement it states the apr rate and not the interst rate (the two are different) can i use this too ?. my agreement was arranged over the phone and the agreement was sent via a courior for me to sign and receive the cheque there and then. note - i do not remember getting a seperate cancellation notice. help please anyone !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[flooz]

Hi No dosh. Afraid i can't answer your questions; i have the same question really. I'm sure there is something significant that will prevail if the agreement isn't drawn up properly (like ours appear to be) but I don't know what it is. All we can do I'm afraid is be patient and hope someone on here know the answers to help us.

[Jan4a]

Sorry can't help. will give you a bump though!

[Winged Piglet]

Hi,

Just looking throught this thread as have recently had claim against me via Wallers. Similar agreement but from 2005. Wallers were useless and kept making mistakes and discontinued proceedings:) before I entered my witness statement.

However one of the points I made in my defence is that there were no cancellation rights. Wallers insisted that they would make reference to Distance Marketing Regulations as agreement was made via phone.Obviously as it is an agreement regulated by the CCA 1974 I don't know why they wanted to do this other than to give an excuse for the lack of them. NR are also known not to keep the whole agreement i.e. will give you a copy of t&c's in force at the time and not the orginal which is another point of arguement. My knowledge is that the amendments to the Consumer Credit Act making the Right To Cancel included in the body of the agreement came into force in 31st May 2005 which would apply to your agreements. I also challenged them on the calculation of interest rate/Apr as did not seem to add up properly when using an online calculation system from OFT.

Also another thing to consider for your defence is that NR are awful about their Defaut Notices often issuing several together with Final Demands which are a termination. Check the dates on any DN's to see if they are effective and valid i.e they give not less than 14 days from date of service as they often get his wrong. My arguement was that they were relying on a DN served after an earlier final demand and DN which had already effectively ended the agreement. I am not sure why they discontinued, I think to save their face as so many mistakes made. In my case they had also included unfair penalties and charges which can be demonstrated by their statements and had included this in the claim another no no! Hope any of this helps - good luck!

[Jan4a]

NR are also known not to keep the whole agreement i.e. will give you a copy of t&c's in force at the time and not the orginal which is another point of arguement.

 

I didn't find this. They supplied my original signed agreement from 2004 within 2 weeks. They did know I wanted it to work out PPI claim though - I wonder if they're more difficult if they think you're looking at unenforceable CCA?

 

i got my loan over the phone - they then sent agreement for signature and then put money in my bank when I returned that.

[flooz]

So what are the consequences of not having a cancellation clause in the T&C's?

[Winged Piglet]

Hi - the cancellation rights or Right To Cancel came into force on 31st May 2005 from the Amendments to the CCA 2004. As the shown agreement is 2006, they should be included, the same as a separate signature box for ppi.

 

Have you got the DN as no doubt it is not valid.

 

Although I've have had claim against me discontinued, NR unbelievably think they can serve me with another DN to try and get it right this time even though it has been terminated by a formal demand x 2. They can sling their hook if they want to start the process again - it will be thrown out. 'You issued a dodgy DN and then terminated the agreement (twice)?'..yes your honour..'so you want the defendant to look the other way whilst you try and get it right again' (they haven't) yes your honour.....

 

All of this does not include the unenforceable agreement I have too!

 

Were you sent a formal demand by any chance?

[flooz]

Sorry, didn't realise there had been new replies on this thread, and only just thought to check it.

 

WP - haven't had any default notices as payments are up to date; to be honest and brief, am in financial difficulties which, at the moment, there is no light at the end of tunnel, so am looking at ways to reduce debts (my morals have gone out of the window I'm afraid).

 

I was looking to see if this LA was correctedly executed and enforceable, before any possible next step.

[flooz]

I've been reading the thread about CCA's and enforceability. Would I be correct in saying that as there is no Cancellation Clause/Right to Cancel, it could be deemed that this agreement is not enforceable?

 

If I'm correct (which will make a change, lol) is there a correct route to follow to get NR to agree that is the case, and look at taking a full and final?

 

Thanks for everyone's continuing help.

[flooz]

Bumping up, as the more I fight with another institution, I'm gaining more confidence in dealing with this one.

[1miller]

Hi I too have an unsecured loan with Northern Rock with the same form of contract I got the loan over the internet. I contacted them about this and got a letter from Wallers Solicitors.

 

They said that the cancellation rights don't have to be on the contract and that they gave me the necessary information before in a welcome pack. I don't remember receiving this.

 

Can anyone offer some more advice as to whether this is in fact the case? Many thanks

Edited June 21, 2010 by 1miller

[chrconsumer]

Hiya,

1.What you need to do is check the agreement; search for 'check my agreement. ' It is a company that will list Breaches of Regulations and that is a starting point. At the first instance do not pay the £20 asked and do not agree to see one of their solicitors.

2. Up north there are solicitors that will do no win no fee, none in the south. But you would be giving a solicitor up to £20,000 and get nothing for yourself.

3. LiP litigant in person, you can fight this will help, do not be afraid.

4. You need to check the APR % amount is correct, difficult to see on copy. You do this by Using a company called aprcalc.co.uk, who use software that is approved by OFT to check your APR%. If it is different, get back to me.

5. As far as I can see the agreement is ' not properly executed' because the interest is not listed separately from the credit amount each month.

6. Back page is incorrect, should have an item about the 1974 cca, and does not, also look at item 2, which is hidden in small print and should be on the front page.

7. When you have done the research, get back to me with your findings.

[chrconsumer]

To add to my comments below generally, Northern Rock plc consumers need to check their statements -

1. Have you received a annual statement' in prescribed form'?

2. Check CCA 1974, 2006, 2010 s77A, s97

3. If you have not, Northern Rock plc commit a criminal offence and are

liable for a Level 4 fine, Justice Act, ie £2500, each time...

4. Have you had your agreement for a while? Was the interest 'front loaded' - request a spreadsheet of interest to see what rebate you can receive - and ask for a rebate figure to be sent to you - has to within 7 days in writing, not verbally over the telephone, if not see 3 above.

5. Check your speadsheet of interest APR % is it the same as you were charged in the Agreement?

6. If not, get back to me.

7. The point of this enquiry? If you discover the spreadsheet and Agreement and the amount you checked on aprcalc.co.uk are different, the Agreement is "irreedemably unenforceble" = nr cannot enforce it.

[chrconsumer]

Hiya,

Would any northern rock plc customers who took out a £15,000 10 year unsecured loan in December 2003 contact me please. Thanks.

[1miller]

Thank you I will do this and get back to you. Yes I did wonder about that also I have never had any statements from them since they got a charge against my property.

 

They also got the charge for the loan and full amount of interest even though the loan was only one year old.