C L Finance - Awaiting Court Action. **WON**

[GhostDebt]

Good evening everyone,

I hope you are all safe and well considering the weather at the moment.

 

This is my first thread here and will not be the last I am sure of that.

 

In September 2005 my wife started a B&Q Store Card account (operated by GE Capital).

In 2006 we started experiencing problems and started token payment arrangements, then in Jan 2008 we began a Debt Management Plan with the CCCS. The DMP was only going to run for 12 months and has now finished.

C L Finance have now began a Court Claim in the Northampton County Court Bulk Centre (CCBC) because last year we had further problems and the DMP was not maintained very well by us.

We have sent CL Finance the s.77/78 request and also an additional letter

as follows:

 

Dear Sir,

REQUEST FOR INFORMATION

I have received a recent court claim from your organisation. In order to file a defence and counter claim I require some information. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below.

The information must be furnished within fourteen days of the receipt of this letter. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this letter will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.

1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened.

2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:

a. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company, or by any previous creditor

b. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account formerly held with GE Money.

c. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

d. Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).

e. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

f. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

g. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

h. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

i. Copies of statements for the entire duration of the credit agreement.

3. Any other documents you seek to rely on in court.

 

I will require this information within the next fourteen days. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, it will be reported to the Court that you are trying to frustrate proceedings and denying me the opportunity to file a defence and counter claim.

Yours sincerely,

(This letter was taken from a post/template on this site)

 

The only information we received was a copy of the credit agreement which arrived on the day the defence was due, which I had sent the day before as an embarressed defence basically. We had a positive response from the court, but I guess at the moment we will have to wait and see if we get the allocation questionnaires (AQ's).

 

I have two main questions at this time.

 

1. If we do not receive the AQ's within 28 days of the defence submission date, can we apply to the court to have the claim struck out?

 

2. Please could somebody comment on the attached pdf file, which is the copy of the credit agreement to let me know if it is enforceable. If it is not, could you explain why.

 

Many thanks for your help with this matter. Any further information you require I will be happy to help.

 

Best regards.

CLFinance Agreement.pdf

[volvo]

Cannot advise personally, but this reply will bump it up the list for attention by more knowledgable persons.

 

VOVO

[twofoot]

If you can read that you have bionic vision. For that reason alone it's unenforcable and there are no prescribed terms.

[GhostDebt]

Thank you for your replies so far.

'bump'

[GhostDebt]

Please also note:

The copy we have is slightly better than the scanned copy posted.

 

It also states, 'If you use your card for a Retail Purchase of your credit limit and then repay it in 12 equal monthly installments the total charge for credit would be interest of £134.60. We can vary the interest rates and any charges we make now or in the future under condition 13.'

 

(Is this what is meant by prescribed term?)

 

It does not however list anywhere this particular condition or any of the other conditions referred to.

 

Many thanks for your help

[cerberusalert]

If you can read that you have bionic vision. For that reason alone it's unenforcable and there are no prescribed terms.

 

The prescribed terms are there; top left hand corner under 'Key Financial Information' & 'Other Financial Information'. Also the 'Right To Cancel' is there above the signaure box.

 

I'm sorry to say, it seems to be enforcable.

 

BTW, you can enlarge it by using the + button in the adobe reader toolbar.

[GhostDebt]

Hello cerberusalert.

thank you for your prompt reply.

 

I cannot see the 'Right to Cancel' information. I have seen the following:

 

'This agreement is not cancellable under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, the timeshare act 1992 or the Financial Services (Distance Marketing) Regulations 2004'

 

Is this what you were referring to?

 

Many thanks.

[GhostDebt]

'bump'

[cerberusalert]

Above the signature it says "IMPORTANT READ CAREFULLY 1) You can settle this agreement at anytime by giving notice in writing etc., etc.,)

[GhostDebt]

'bump'

[GhostDebt]

Further update - Important.

 

The following correspondance has been received so far and we are somewhat confused about it.

 

22.01.2009

The court wrote to us stating:

I acknowledge receipt of your defence. A copy is being served on the claimant (or the claimant's solicitor). The claimant may contact you direct to attempt to resolve any dispute. If the dispute cannot be reolved informally, the claimant will inform the court that he wishes to proceed. The court will then inform you of what will happen.

Where he wishes to proceed, the claimant must contact the court within 28 days after receiving the a copy of your defence. After that period has elapsed, the claim will be stayed. The only action the claimant can then take will be to apply to a judge for an order lifting the stay.

 

No further correspondance has been received from the court at this time, but the following was received from Howard Cohen & Co.

05.02.2009 (arrived 10.02.2009)

As you are aware Judgement has been entered against you.

Payment, in accordance with the terms of the judgement must be made direct to The Lewis Group, who will manage and monitor payments in respect of the above action on behalf of CL Finance Ltd and ourselves. The judgement order states you must pay £ every month commencing 17th February 2009.

Enclosed please find payment slips for your use.

We of course retain control of the court action and should any payment be missed we shall not hesitate to proceed further through the court.

Should you have any queries please do not hesitate to contact us.

 

Please comment as I am sure that the next stage would be allocation questionnaires and possibly a hearing prior to any judgement actually being made.

We will contact the court tomorrow (11.02.09) to ask them if they have received any contact from the claimant and also the status of the claim, but can Howard Cohen legally state that a judgement has been entered if it hasn't and can we complain or prosecute them for making that statement.

 

Many thanks for your help/comments

[PGH7447]

I would phone the court to see what is happening, if you filed a defence then without being taken to court I cant see how a judgement could have been made

 

does the info from cohens add up, ie is it your account them=y mention, these monkeys are pushing through so many they might have screwed up and sent you someone elses.

 

If a judgement was awarded then you can get it looked at (dont know the correct term for this but someone on here will

[GhostDebt]

Further update:

Contacted the court today regarding the questions mentioned who stated:

The claimant had tried to force the judgement through on 2 seperate occasions but it was refused due to being defended, lack of information.

They said ignore the solicitors letter and not to contact them and wait for any further response from the court.

 

Many thanks for your help, lets see what happens.

[Goldlady]

Wow I can't believe what I have just read. They abused the court process with my three claims but this is amazing. I wonder if they just assumed that no-one would defend their claims and sent this letter out at the appropriate time after default judgement would have been obtained.

 

I am sure the court will take this approach seriously as well. I can't think of a word to describe them that won't get me Cagbotted;). Consider me subscribed and ready for action:D

[Goldlady]

BTW my agreement was the same, but we still defeated them in court mostly because they had not followed court procedure. We got the court claim before the notice of assignment, no letter before action, and the notice of assignment was from CL Finance not from GE Money. For those reasons we defended the claim - on abuse of the Civil Procedure Rules - and never really got into the enforceability or otherwise of the agreement. They withdrew the claim.

 

You really need to take them to task for that letter.

[cerberusalert]

One thing's for certain, Howard Cohen & Co won't be able to use the British Gas defence Customer set to sue British Gas - Which? News

 

IT error

 

Lord Justice Jacob also had little time for British Gas’s claim that the letters were sent out as a result of an IT error and that Ms Ferguson should not have treated the letters as seriously as if they had come from a person.

 

‘In Ms Ferguson's words they should “not simply blame information technology. They should instead start taking responsibility for the running of their company in a competent, honest and ethical manner,"' he said.

 

‘Real people are responsible for programming and entering material into the computer.

 

‘Moreover, the threats and demands were to be read by a real person, not by a computer. A real person is likely to suffer real anxiety and distress if threatened in the way which Ms Ferguson was.’

[master woody]

morale support:

 

They has a vaild CCA and still failed to get a judgment in my case...i got it stuck out on the fact they did'nt comply with the judges orders

 

thier stupidity works for you...

[ncf355]

Folks,

 

as a CL "victim" myself , I wonder if it might be worth sharing claim numbers that have been dealt with inappropriately by HC/CL and make a move towards the courts for vexatious litigation?

 

This issue with them claiming judgment has been made when it clearly has not appears to be a common thread and I think the number of times it has happened may bring in to question their claim it is merely a mistake?

[Goldlady]

I'm up for the vexatious litigant action. Now that definitely is uncharted waters for me. Not sure how we could collect the information as it would have to be behind the scenes, but well worth a thought.

 

Read another thread last night where LTSB had done the same to someone - is it the latest dirty trick in the debt collectors handbook I wonder?

[creditcardmug]

Carter does something similar...sends out bogus notices of discontinuance to try to get you to fail to file your AQ:mad:

[Goldlady]

How low will these people stoop? So what on earth would a court say if you were appealing a default judgement and you produced the letter of discontinuance?

[ncf355]

I'm up for the vexatious litigant action. Now that definitely is uncharted waters for me. Not sure how we could collect the information as it would have to be behind the scenes, but well worth a thought.

 

Read another thread last night where LTSB had done the same to someone - is it the latest dirty trick in the debt collectors handbook I wonder?

 

Via PM?

 

Just needs a list like we have for the various banks discontinued claims?

[ncf355]

How low will these people stoop? So what on earth would a court say if you were appealing a default judgement and you produced the letter of discontinuance?

 

Wouldnt this fal under the administration of justice act?

 

Falsely claiming to be in an official capacity?

[creditcardmug]

Wouldnt this fal under the administration of justice act?

 

Falsely claiming to be in an official capacity?

 

Problem is its normal accepted practice for the claimants solicitor to serve the NOD without a court stamp...then when you ask at the court for a copy with a stamp, they refuse, saying you have to make do with the one you have.

So it can look genuine...the only way to check is to phone the court to make sure he has filed it..before binning your AQ

[GhostDebt]

At present we will wait the prescribed 28 days as advised by the court and see if the case becomes 'stayed'. (Is it 28 working days?)

Once the case has become 'stayed' what happens then?

Can we apply to the court to have it thrown out or do we just leave it alone?

Because they sent a copy of the credit agreement, is there anyway we can get it removed from our Credit File or to say account settled?

Will keep you all posted, thanks for the comments so far.

Regards