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    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
    • Thanks for all the suggestions so far I will amend original WS and send again for review.  While looking at my post at very beginning when I submitted photos of signs around the car park I noticed that it says 5 hours maximum stay while the signage sent by solicitor shows 4 hours maximum stay but mine is related to electric bay abuse not sure if this can be of any use in WS.
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Godebt/advice needed.


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Mainly are you on the mortgage papers, are you a joint buyer with your g/f. That's the first important point.

 

Next why are you bing chased, have you just defaulted, paid half and handed the car back etc; then we can see if their is a debt and if it can be chased.

 

The first court papers, did they come from a court?

Check these papers that have been thrown at you, do they have a court seal on them and a case number?

The court sends you a summons, not some tart with black hair.

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G/f says i am named on the mortgage..the mortgage totals £80,000

But the deposit was paid by my g/f from the sale of her property..

as we are not marreid when the mortgage was taken out

we have signed a form saying we are not tennats in common

my g/f has a greater financial interest than i do

and g/f says there was no seal on the papers..

and g/f phoned the number which was hollis briggs solicitors

and spoke to mr paul evens and he told her what the debt was for

and when it was from and the amount which she says is £6,000

as said before i was not here we were on a break.

g/f has a copy of a letter she sent to him (recorded) re the conversation

 

gary

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Also the one i got now was handed to me by some bloke

he said he was told to deliver it to me...

he also unfolded it in front of me and read it...

it has a black seal on it...faded with the court name on it

and a case number

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Yes it is to do with ycc...

the original date of signing the agreement was 22/3/2004

cant remember ccj date

i gave the car back after numourous problems with it and they said that is the end of it

i never got any paper work to my knowledge saying they sold the car and what was left to pay

no final settlement figure

i have heard nothing untill last year from go debt....

and i have not been hiding so they could of found me and resolved this matter. But nothing. go debt in less than a year have a charging order on my house.....

and now after doing that have asked me to go to county court to ask me questions on my finances to see if it can be inforced by the court

i am currently unemployed and when i telephoned go debt regarding this he was not helpful..

and said the charging order will stay on my house

so i think im screwed to be honest

gary

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CLICK ON THIS LINK

Debt Collection Industry - The Consumer Forums

 

SCROLL DOWN TO THE BOTTOM OF THE PAGE TO WHERE IT STATES

 

NEW THREAD

 

CLICK ON THIS

 

YOU WILL HAVE A PAGE COME UP STATING TITLE

 

IN THERE WRITE GO DEBT AND CHARGING ORDED

IN THE MAIN BOX WRITE WHATS THE SITUATION

 

WHEN YOU HAVE FINISHED, SCROLL TO THE BOTTOM OF THE PAGE TO WHERE IT STATES SUBMIT NEW THREAD

CLICK AND THERE YOU HAVE IT

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I am a bit unsure of what to do now I have had no reply of godebt with reference me asking them for all the original paperwork i still dont have an address living in b and bs at the moment as im working away and havent sorted the move out (still).

Will they be sending stuff to my old address if so how does that affect me as i cant get there.

i dont want to just forget about it till they contact me again

also i have a care of address with my bank will they be able to get that address i dont want any hassle going to that address as they are doing me a favour.

what should i do now

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Go debt have now issued me with a photograph of where I live and are threatening bankrupcy. Interesting as I do not own my house.

How do I go about becoming a test case?

 

If they take a photo of you inside your house or in your front door (opened it to see who it is) Then that is ilegal

But they can take pictures in a public place

report the to oft in london a.s.a.p

re:yes car charging order...

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i am currently having problems with go debt. they are refusing to let me pay my £11 000 debt by instalments and say that unless i can settle it they are going to send the bailiffs in. how do i get to the templates so i can send them a letter asking for the origianal credit agreement out to me so i can check if it's legal?

Yes you can and give them 12+ 2 days (on thread there is templates) to respond if they dont

get the form account in dispute

BUT MAKE SURE YOU SEND THEM 1ST CLASS RECORDED AND KEEP COPYS OF THE LETTERS

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OK

Just post a question and people will help

i was at my wits end with go-debt/go/hollis briggs whatever they call themselves

put a chap on here is helping me

i have sent letter asking for full signed credit agreement

just trying to find a link

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi yes i am going through problems with go debt at the moment they are taking me to bankruptcy i have a court date and everything but i have a sneaky suspision that they are starting to panic because i have started to get letters in the last 2 weeks saying that they can stop if the action if i arange a discounted payment to them supprisingly enough the letters are coming from hollis briggs which is basically go debt. I intend to let this run to the end which is 18 march 2010 and screw them by the way they have been told by there local police force to stop harrasing me so if you keep getting harrased from them threaten them with contacting the cardiff police about them and just mention that you have been talking to mr atkinson and that you are waiting for the outcome of my bankruptcy hearing i will keep you informed as to what has happened

:D

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Hi yes i am going through problems with go debt at the moment they are taking me to bankruptcy i have a court date and everything but i have a sneaky suspision that they are starting to panic because i have started to get letters in the last 2 weeks saying that they can stop if the action if i arange a discounted payment to them supprisingly enough the letters are coming from hollis briggs which is basically go debt. I intend to let this run to the end which is 18 march 2010 and screw them by the way they have been told by there local police force to stop harrasing me so if you keep getting harrased from them threaten them with contacting the cardiff police about them and just mention that you have been talking to mr atkinson and that you are waiting for the outcome of my bankruptcy hearing i will keep you informed as to what has happened

:D

 

Hollis Briggs is no longer going so who is singing the letter dont know????give me the name of the person.....what they are trying to do is get you to offer a payment....we see if you get to court or not ......Godebt and hollis briggs are all part of Edwards geldards Solicitors in Cardiff

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Hi its go debt i think that their bottle is going they taking me to bankruptcy i have a court date and reference and i have checked it out but i have a sneaky suspicion that they will pull out at last minute we will see i am very interested to see what happens i have taunted them relentlasley for months and months they have even contacted the police to stop me from harrasing them i love it they deserve everything that they get if everybody who has problems with them does the same they wont have a chance and be out of buisiness in no time i will keep every body posted to what is happening

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Hi its go debt i think that their bottle is going they taking me to bankruptcy i have a court date and reference and i have checked it out but i have a sneaky suspicion that they will pull out at last minute we will see i am very interested to see what happens i have taunted them relentlasley for months and months they have even contacted the police to stop me from harrasing them i love it they deserve everything that they get if everybody who has problems with them does the same they wont have a chance and be out of buisiness in no time i will keep every body posted to what is happening

 

ignore that crap they do that to everyone even me but it got dismissed

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