Link Financial have done a mass mailing of Default Notices re: assigned accounts.

[di.harry]

I don't know if you can remember my story in this thread about Link and an MBNA A/C. I've posted a number of times here regarding this but here is a quick summary of the situation and the latest update:

 

LINK used a number of nasty approaches to get to me regarding an MBNA A/C that I could not recognise (I had been already repaying another 2 MBNA A/C through LINK for a long time, so this was a new thing). When asked to produce a CCA they sent me one belonging to someone else. I wrote back a number of times but they still continued to pursue this account that did not belong to me. Eventually they managed to produce what appeared to be a valid CCA signed by me, but this time for another account which I could recognise as "my missing MBNA-WESCOT" account - I'll explain in a minute (they apologised for having mixed up the account numbers with that other person's account for so long, but told me it was MBNA's fault).

 

However, I did not agree with the outstanding balance figure they quoted. Let me explain: this was an account that had been passed around from MBNA, to NCO, back to MBNA, and then to WESCOT. I had a letter from MBNA telling me in May 2005 that my account is passed to WESCOT and that I should continue my repayments to them, so I started paying my monthly repayment cheques to WESCOT (including cover letter with my details and the fact that MBNA had notified me that the account has been passed to them). Only when it was time to revaluate my situation in July 2007, WESCOT replied to my revaluation letter saying that my details could not be found on their system and they could not recognise me! After a couple of letters giving them any possible information that could help them identify me, they still could not (!), so I stopped all payments. I did not ask what happened with my 27 repayment cheques that they were happily cashing each and every month, as the amount overdue was still a lot and I preferred the account was lost forever due to their computer error, rather than arguing about the cheques.

 

Well, it turned out that this MBNA A/C that Link had been chasing me for was that lost WESCOT account. Since I disagreed with the Balance of the account I sent them a CCA request for a SOA. They took their time and eventually sent me one, but AGAIN this time it was for the WRONG account (belonging to that same other person!!). I wrote a formal complaint and after 4 months and a couple of "we're working on it" reply from them, they finally sent me a SOA regarding my account but:

 

- the SOA printouts they have provided are full of code words and it is not very clear what the hell is going on, so if there is a thread in these forums on how to understand those, please let me know;

- however, what is totally clear from this SOA is that none of my 27 cheques that WESCOT had cashed for this account show up!!!! i.e. the payments I was sending to MBNA before WESCOT can be seen, but them it shows that my payments to this account stop around the date it was transferred to WESCOT-no repayments since!

 

So how the heck did MBNA pass an account to WESCOT who had it for 27 months, and then they lost it, and MBNA then passed it to LINK, without having seen any of my WESCOT repayments? Who’s screwed it up here: MBNA or WESCOT?

 

So now I am really ****ed off. I've got a complete set of records and I can find all the details of those lost cheques and prove (from statements) that they were cashed by WESCOT, but it will take me a number of hours to compile all the evidence.

 

I think the only way to get to the bottom of this is to ask for a SAR. But who do I ask this from? LINK? MBNA? Presumably, I can't ask WESCOT as they already have lost my details!! Can I ask from both? I’ve never done a SAR request before, but I guess I can find details in the forums.

 

Meanwhile, LINK is now waiting for my repayment proposals they said (and as compensation for all the fuss they've deducted 50 quid from the balance which is nice of them) but I can't accept the balance of the account. So, until I find out exactly what happened with my WESCOT payments, I do not want them to take any action yet.

 

Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

Cheers.

[A+]

Hi diharry. I note your comment on how kind link was to knock off £50, this is a tactic to draw you closer and maybe feel more obligation to pay. It is not kindness, they don't do kindness, in fact from my experience and many others on here, they don't even do LEGAL when it comes to practicing debt collection strategies.

Considering if they bought the debt they only paid 10-20% of the balance for the debt in the first place, i would have thought 50% deduction would have been a more kind gesture in the circumstances!

No CCA, NO PAY

[di.harry]

Hi A+ and thanks for your quick reply!

 

I agree with your comments about the £50 "discount"... I've lost more in time and money sending all those International Registered Post letters to LINK (since I no longer live in the UK) than 50 quid.

 

You say "No CCA, NO PAY" and I totally agree. However, even though they provided the wrong CCA a couple of times, they've now sent me the correct CCA and SOA. So I don't mind making an affordable repayment arrangement with them but not until they correct the outstanding balance of the account, i.e. take into account the 27 cheques that I had sent when WESCOT was dealing with this account and which have already been cashed by them.

 

I think a SAR is the only way to get to the bottom of this, but I do not know if that must be sent to LINK, or MBNA, or both.

 

Cheers.

 

ps. will follow all your links in your signature - looked at a couple of them - some interesting stuff.

[angry cat]

Right, little steps.

 

Fiirstly, once you are in receipt of SAR information, the provider is obliged to also give you an information sheet on how you can understand the codes/abbreviations that they use on notes/log coms etc.

Different companies use different codes;

if you were not provided with this information sheet, then you would be unable to fully comprehend the information,

 

Secondly, if I were you, I would make fresh SAR requests and to ALL parties concerned.

 

Undoubtedly, your/the alleged account is in dispute. Because, the data that you have been supplied with, is insufficient for a general consumer to understand.

 

Therefore, head up your SAR requests;

ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE.

 

Lastly, make a complaint to the ICO, you can download a complaint form form the ICO website.

 

Hopefully, the above is helpful.

 

AC

[di.harry]

Thanks angry_cat.

 

Just to clarify that I've not yet sent them a SAR. The codes I cannot understand are from a Statement-Of-Account (SOA)... which doesn't look like a statement at all but looks like many lines of codes and similar rubbish, also including payments received. Sometimes the total amount balance is shown in the right column (next to a payment), but on other pages or lines it is omitted (even though they are still payments)!

 

Glad to hear that at least an SAR should also give a translation of the codes!

 

OK, I think what I'll do is send SAR's to both LINK and MBNA... I don't think it will work with WESCOT as they will tell me I'm not in their files, as they've done in the past. But, hopefully, if I get SAR stuff from LINK and especially MBNA I can find some more info on what happened between MBNA and WESCOT with my account.

 

I've followed your advice before, heading all my letters regarding this "ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE", so thanks again.

[angry cat]

No problem di.harry!

 

Wescot must hold data on the account though, they just don't want to release it!

 

Caution! re: your SAR payments, mark your postal order(s) SAR fee ONLY, copy/scan the PO's and keep as evidence

Also make it clear on the request(s) that the £10 is for a SAR, the funds are not to be used for any other purpose other than, the SAR statutory fee.

Link Financial are notorious for taking SAR/CCA fee's and crediting such to accounts.

 

One really has to spell it out to Link, otherwise they will take liberties with consumers naivety.

 

Good Luck:)

keep us all posted.

 

AC

[di.harry]

Thanks for the advice angry_cat. Will spell it out to them!

[GamekeeperToPoacher]

di.harry,

 

Surely you paid it off completely to Wescot - in fact you made a £10k overpayment - Well you could have done!

 

Now Wescot owe the OC. No longer your worry.

 

GK

[A+]

Angrycat is right, they will probably swipe the stat fee payable and place that fee onto your account payments list. Do EXACTLY what angrycat said.

 

As for the lost records of payments, i am not sure how many civil rules they have broken here, (malpractice, record keeping errors etc), but the words "Obtaining Money by Deception" comes to mind, and although you would have to prove a dishonest INTENT on their part (which you probably couldn't) but again, the JUDGE is the one to decide, and given their experience and weight in the industry, many judges would favour your side of the argument given the expectation upon them to do things properly. I would consider a visit to a lawyer about that, because its a DISGRACE. Not saying you should, but i would be tempted to mention this in a letter to them myself, might kick them to sort it out, but you need to get your statements in order first and produce a list of payments cashed to show them a copy of.

[di.harry]

Thanks to all for the replies and good advice. That's what I'll be doing: getting all the letters, statements with the cheques cashed, and basically all the proof I have about the 27 payments that have not been credited to the account, ready to take them to court if needed.

 

Problem again is I'm not sure who would I need to take to court: LINK, WESCOT or MBNA, or all of them?!!! If MBNA has sold the account to LINK does that mean that they have inherited legal responsibility?

 

Meanwhile I'm sending off SAR's to all of them to find out more about what could have gone wrong. For example, when MBNA passed my account over to WESCOT and they cashed my 27 cheque repayments for 27 months... what did they say to MBNA? "We're giving you this account back to you as this guy hasn't paid us for 27 months?" And why didn't MBNA pursue the account if WESCOT wasn't reporting any money being credited into the account?

 

Somethings smells very fishy here to me, especially WESCOT that kept getting my letters with the repayments and cashing the cheques. If they could not recognise me, why didn't they return the cheques - all my details were in the cover letters AND on the BACK SIDE OF THE CHEQUES? In which account did they credit those cheques? Why didn't MBNA say to them "what the hell have you been doing for 27 months?", etc.

 

Actually, I would love to report all of them and take them all to court. The only problem is that I live in Greece and there are extra costs to travel and find a laywer in the UK from here.

 

Anyway, let's start first with the SAR's and I'll report back here when they reply. Hopefully, the SAR's will answer some of my questions.

[A+]

In answer to who to take to court, it could be all of them depending on circumstances, but the very first one is the one you MADE THE CHEQUES PAYABLE TO, as they have received, accepted and presumably cashed them. What they did with the money after that is not your business, they have accepted the money, so its they who have done wrong if they have not taken those amounts from the balance, or tucked it away or whatever else. You may find their argument or claims as to where it went from them may bring in other companies, but keep them in mind as mainly responsible, as cheques were paid TO THEM.

[di.harry]

Thanks A+. I'll be writing to WESCOT then again as soon as I collect all the proof and see what their first reaction is. Meanwhile, I'm sending SAR's to the others to find out more info.

[AHMTHSSN]

Hi AC

 

Thats what I am going to do.

 

Thanks

 

Adam

 

 

Hi All,

 

I finally received a reply from Link a couple of days ago after requesting a CCA a couple of months ago and this is what they sent me. 1 single page with my details and the date hand written on it. It was done just after New Year 2005 and from what i can remember it was one of those leaflets that came out of the newspapers/magazines.

 

I thought they were going to send me "proper" letters with all the terms & conditions.

 

I haven't paid any money directly to Link since they took over my debt and my account is on hold till I get in touch with them.

 

Any suggestions as to what i should do??

 

Thanks

 

Adam

Edited May 3, 2009 by AHMTHSSN

[angry cat]

Can we have an enlarged scan please, cannot read the one posted.

 

Thanks

 

AC

[AHMTHSSN]

Can we have an enlarged scan please, cannot read the one posted.

 

Thanks

 

AC

 

 

Hi AC,

 

The picture is 5MB but it got resized when i uploaded it.

 

I have added it here

 

Capedited.jpg picture by adanand355 - Photobucket

 

Cap2ed.jpg picture by adanand355 - Photobucket

 

Its an application form asking for my personal and employment details and amount i wanted to transfer from other credit cards.

 

The box where the signature is has the following written:

 

CREDIT AGREEMENT REGULATED BY THE CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974

 

Please issue to me a Capital One credit card and PIN. I confirm that all the information i have given is true and complete. I understand that this information will be checked with fraud prevention agencies and if i give you false or inaccurate information and you suspect fraud you will record this. I authorise Capital One to search the files of any credit reference agency for my application and to help you manage my account.

 

The credit reference agencies will record details of Capital One's search and your application. Information held about you by the credit reference agencies may already be linked to records relating to one or more people with whom you have a financial association. For any searches Capital One makes you may treated as linked to them and you will be assessed with reference to their records. We may also add to your record with credit reference agencies details of how you conduct your Capital One account (including defaults).

 

Capital One and other organisations may use and search these records about you and those to whom you are financially linked to:

* help make decisionsa about credit and credit related services such as insurance for me or members of my household*

*trace debtors, recover debt, prevent fraud and to manage my accounts*

*check my identity to prevent money laundering, unless we are satisfied about your identity*

 

Fraud prevention agency records will also be shared with other organisations to manage insurance polocies and help make decisions on motor, household, credit, life and other insurance proposals and insurance claims for me and members of my household. The credit reference agencies and fraud prevention agencies will also use the records for statistical analysis about credit and fraud.

 

I have read the terms and conditions setting out the agreement with Capital One and, if my application is accepted, i agree to be bound by these terms and conditions as amended from time to time. I am 18 years of age and over.

 

Credit scoring. Capital One usea a technique known as 'credit scoring' in deciding whether to open an account in your name and if so, what credit limit you will be given. Capital One will also use this technique throughout the life of this agreement to assess your credit limit and the interest rate and other charges to be applied to your account, all of which may be varied.

 

Your information and marketing, 'important' please read ' use of information' overleaf (section 23 of the agreement) which sets out how your information will be used. By signing this application, you agree that information about you may be used (xxxx xxx xxx unreadable) of whetheror not your application is accepted. One of the ways your information will be used is to send you information or phone you about other products or services offered by Capital One or other companies. Your name, address and phone number may be give to those other companies for that purpose. If you do not wish to receive marketing information please tick box.

 

This is a Credit agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974. Sign it only if you want to be bound by its terms.

 

Thanks

 

Adam

Edited May 3, 2009 by AHMTHSSN

[citizenB]

AHMTHSSN, I am assuming that as it says "moisten here to seal" then this was a mailer application form. In which case, I would think there would be little other than a return address and advertising on the back. So it doesnt look as though there are prescribed terms on your form.

[AHMTHSSN]

AHMTHSSN, I am assuming that as it says "moisten here to seal" then this was a mailer application form. In which case, I would think there would be little other than a return address and advertising on the back. So it doesnt look as though there are prescribed terms on your form.

 

Hi CitizenB,

 

Yes, it was one of those leaflets that came out of the magazines/newspapers and i sent it off at the beginning of 2005.

 

I am not sure as to what i should do now. i'll do some more searching on this forum to see where I stand.

 

If anyone has been in a similiar situation to me, i would be very grateful for any advice.

 

Thank You

 

Adam

[Disaronno]

Basically, I had/have a debt with GE Capital who have apparently sold it on to a company called Asset Link Capital or Link Financial as they go by in other places.

 

Anyway, I agreed a monthly payment of £30 with last tuesday and gave them details to make a payment for the first month. Now on the thursday they rang back and said management wouldn't agree to this figure and would I go to £40? I agreed to this and was told they would ring back and confirm with me before taking any payments and that the £30 hadn't already been taken.

 

I bet you can see whats coming here?

 

So yesterday I checked my account and lo and behold they'd taken the £30 and £40. Now I rang this morning asking for the £30 to be returned only to be told, "I'll make a request to management to see if they will return the £30 payment"

 

Fuming is an understatement, apparently because I owe quite a substantial amount they 'may not' choose to return this payment. Anyway, I rang Barclays and cancelled my card so they couldn't take anymore random payments and lodged an unauthorised payment complaint.

 

Now the crux of all this which I realised today is that I haven't actually seen anything to prove that I owe them anything at all, for all I know they could be chancing on me paying out so where do I go from here?

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

Cheers.

 

Just thought I'd c&p that to fill you guys in on where I am.

 

Basically from that thread I was pointed over here and I've read this thread from beginning to end. A couple of things have flagged up though, I've received nothing from either Link or GE to tell me that the debt has been passed on. The first I knew of it was a phone call from Link.

 

Up until this saga I'd been quite co-operative with Link as the gentlemen who was dealing with my 'account' seemed to be quite sympathetic to my position, I'm not actually sure when the first phonecall was but it must have been sometime before Christmas and the bloke had managed to stall management on demanding some kind of payment till the last few weeks.

 

Now since the original post above on a different forum I've had the paperwork through from Barclays about the unauthorised payment, I'm now of the opinion though to claim for the £40 too since they didn't confirm they were taking either of them never mind both!

 

I've sent off a CCA request and from reading this thread I'm fully expecting the £1 to be added to my payments rather than used for its intended purpose. I'd just like to add aswell that the only mail I have had from Link is an I&E form in the 6 months or so that they've been calling me, which due to the gentleman dealing with my account has only been every 2 weeks or so.

 

So yeah, theres my story so far ladies and gentlemen.

 

Any advice?

Edited May 9, 2009 by Disaronno

[jj77]

Hope someone here can shed some light on the next steps I should take.

 

I sent a CCA request to Link in January, not a peep, apart from a please pay letter or two, letters were sent restating my position - CCA default, alleged debt, stop processing my data etc.etc.

 

This morning I received a debt, stating why they would not removed defaults etc.

 

C+P

 

"Point raised: Please note you may consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing my data in relation to this account with immediate effect"

Response: Your HSBC account was assigned to Link Financial in Jan 2009. The responsibility to manage the information placed with Credit Reference Agenecies by HSBC was also passed at the time of purchase Therefore we do not believe we are in breach of our responsibilites under the act with regard to your details. WE maintain the information we are reporting to the credit referenve Agencies is an accurate reflection of how the account has been paid and therefore we will not be removing the default.

The debt is known as a "chose in action". As the original lender holds the legal right to collect the debt, they also hold the right to assign their rights to Link Financial. Although the lender does not need your permission to do this, Section 136 of the Law of Property Act 1925 requires, in order for there to be a legal assignment, that notice of assignment should be given in writing. This was sent to you on the 14th January 2009"

 

 

So...as I've requested a CCA and they're currently in default, do they have a leg to stand on? And although I received a letter that said it was from HSBC, it was sent in a Link Financial envelope, and HSBC have no record of sending it.

 

Cheers

[angry cat]

Quote:

I received a letter that said it was from HSBC, it was sent in a Link Financial envelope, and HSBC have no record of sending it."

 

If that is the case report Link to Companies House!

 

Also, demand proof; documentary evidence that Link are legally entitled to pursue the alleged debt;

Deed of Assignment;

Deed of Sale and;

 

Advise Link that they have not yet fulfilled their obligations under s77/78 of the CCA.

 

AC

[citizenB]

Just thought I'd c&p that to fill you guys in on where I am.

 

Basically from that thread I was pointed over here and I've read this thread from beginning to end. A couple of things have flagged up though, I've received nothing from either Link or GE to tell me that the debt has been passed on. The first I knew of it was a phone call from Link.

 

Up until this saga I'd been quite co-operative with Link as the gentlemen who was dealing with my 'account' seemed to be quite sympathetic to my position, I'm not actually sure when the first phonecall was but it must have been sometime before Christmas and the bloke had managed to stall management on demanding some kind of payment till the last few weeks.

 

Now since the original post above on a different forum I've had the paperwork through from Barclays about the unauthorised payment, I'm now of the opinion though to claim for the £40 too since they didn't confirm they were taking either of them never mind both!

 

I've sent off a CCA request and from reading this thread I'm fully expecting the £1 to be added to my payments rather than used for its intended purpose. I'd just like to add aswell that the only mail I have had from Link is an I&E form in the 6 months or so that they've been calling me, which due to the gentleman dealing with my account has only been every 2 weeks or so.

 

So yeah, theres my story so far ladies and gentlemen.

 

Any advice?

 

If you start your own thread, then you will get plenty of advice specific to your own circumstances.

[di.harry]

jj77,

and to add to angry_cat's suggestions:

when I had requested a CCA from Link and they kept asking for payments even though they had not sent me a Creadit Agreement I kept writing back to them with a copy of receipt from the Post office (registered mail) reminding them that they still had not provided this. Then they sent me the wrong CA and despite me telling them that this is not even in my name, they still pursued the account. So I wrote back again another two times with copy of the CA that belong to someone else. Eventually they found the correct CA... but it goes to show that you need to answer back and make sure you've got all receipts etc. to prove of your request for a CCA. Another trick is that they may claim that they've sent the CA to you... well since they don't send these things registred post there is a small chance it may get lost, but that's their problem... so if they claim such a thing, you tell them where is their proof?

[angry cat]

Oh Yes,

The it got lost in the mail trick!

 

Link must have massive amounts of Mail Lost...

 

AC

[di.harry]

Disarrono,

I've had Debt collectors take payments twice due to similar misunderstanding and what I've always done is to write a letter stating their mistake and then saying "so next month I'm not sending you any payment, as you've already taken more than we agreed"... i.e. in the following month I adjust the amount of the payment, so that I pay them exactly as much as we had agreed.... so in your case, if I had agreed on 40 pounds and they got 30+40, I would pay them 10 pounds only the following month to make the total 80, which divided by 2 is 40 per month as agreed. However, it seems that they take payments for you from some account, or a debit/switch card. I don't know if that is always a good idea. I prefer to send them cheques by mail, so I know how much I pay them and they don't take out whatever they like.

 

Once, I had missed 1 payment due to an unsigned cheque, so I called them up and made 2 payments by phone using my debit card (2 payments to cover the missed one and the forthcoming one -in advance as a way of apologising to them - what an idiot I was). Next month, when I went back to my regular monthly payments by cheque I got a threatening letter from them saying that I've reduced my payments to half and all sort of nasty things! So I wrote back an angry letter telling them that my previous payment was double due to the missed cheque and that they are in error - eventually they agreed and apologised. The point of this story is that DCA's are stupid, or like to play stupid, and you need to keep defending your positions - spell it out to them.

 

Regarding the CCA request for a CA: don't send any more payments until they provide you with a valid CA. Write back to them if needed and tell them that you're still waiting for this - enclose any copies or proof that you have, etc.

[di.harry]

To add to the above... I avoid negotiating with them on the phone. In fact, now almost always everything I do is by mail. Even if they ask me to call, or whatever, I never ever call them. I always want to have a written record of what has been said, etc., as in many cases I had to go back and refer to letters and things they said or things I said, pointing out the exact paragraph etc... by phone, even if you record the conversations, it is harder to go back and find the exact line that proves what you want.