Moorcroft Debt Recovery and Lombard Direct- Second Letter?

[KissKake]

Hi, I've received some great advice from people on here and got my first letter sent off to MDR and Lombard this week. In a nutshell, here's what happened to me:

 

I've been dealing with MDR for a number of years now. I started off with a debt of £10,000 + approx. £1,500 in interest in 2003 owed to Lombard Direct to be paid back over 2 years. A few months later in 2003, due to unforseen circumstances, I realised that I would no longer be able to afford the monthly payments and I called Lombard and told them that I couldn't make the agreed payments and asked if a new payment plan could be arranged where I could pay back less a month over a longer period of time. They refused and verbally gave me a deadline of a few extra days to pay the outstanding amount by. I tried to obtain other loans but failed all the credit checks. Shortly after this deadline went by, I got a call from Moorcroft saying I needed to pay them instead of Lombard. I don't recall getting any paperwork from Lombard or Moorcroft as it happens so I don't know if my debt was sold to them or if they're acting on behalf of Lombard? Does anyone know what normally happens?

 

I wanted to do the right thing so I made an uncomfortable agreement with Moorcroft to pay back something like £300 a month ( I didn't know any better at the time). Over the years, I managed to negotiate with them to pay less though- though this was extremely difficult as sometimes I don't have a choice in the matter and they just put it up to what they want to.

I now owe £3280 and currently pay £120 a month- they won't accept less than this even though I can't afford it (I told them they should take me to court because I couldn't pay this and they said they'd send someone round to my house first before they take it to court so I just agreed to pay it and cut back on other things instead...sigh...).

 

Up till now I can't obtain any credit and last year I got my credit files from Experian and Equifax which showed they were entering a default status for me every month since 2003!!! On a friend's advice (which to be truthful, I foolishly doubted at the time), I did send Lombard Direct a letter last year asking for a copy of the original default notices and of the original signed agreement which I sent recorded delivery with a £1 postal order. They never replied even though Royal Mail shows the letter was delivered. Again, life got on top of me and I didn't see my friend again till September last year and I sent another letter as a reminder which Royal Mail also showed as being delivered and no response was had. Again life got on top of me until I came across this forum recently and I realised that it was actually something that could work and had worked for many others!

 

So I've now written to Lombard informing them that it will be the final time that I will be writing. I wrote to both Lombard and MDR asking for:

 

1) Removal of all multiple defaults entered on my credit files as only one should have been entered right?

 

 

2) A copy of the original, signed and executed ‘default’ notification letters for all the defaults entered on my file for the past 5 years. If they do not have one, I insisted they remove all defaults they entered on my credit files asap. In either case, the multiple defaults should be removed anyways.

 

 

3) A copy of the original, signed and executed credit agreement and if they cannot produce this they must cease to enforce the agreement and complete a full refund of any already monies paid.

 

 

4) A copy of the deed of assignment for the debt being assigned to Moorcroft Debt Recovery.

 

 

5) A cessation of debt enforcement and collection by them both because of this query and in light of this a refund of all monies paid to MDR since delivery of my first letter on 25/06/07 as enforcement and collection should not have continued after my first letter until my dispute was resolved (I don't expect they'll refund this but it's my right to ask for it right?).

 

 

6) A statement of account from MDR.

 

 

I also informed them that I will onlycommunicate with them in writing and revoked permission for them or their representatives to enter my property.

 

 

I gave Lombard 7 days to reply and MDR 12 days (as it's the first time I've written to them).

 

 

They both received this letter on Wednesday morning this week. I got the following written response from Lombard in the post this morning:

 

 

"Thank you for contacting us with your complaint regarding your account with us. I am sorry that you felt the need to raise this issue with us.

 

I will be dealing with your case and will do my best to resolve this for you as soon as possible and to your complete satisfaction.

 

Your case is being investigated fully and you will be provided with an update or full response within the next 14 days. So you know how we deal with complaints, I've enclosed our leaflet, "Welcome to Lombard Direct". In the meantime, please do not hesitate to contact me on 020x xxx xxxx if you would like to discuss the case further.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

Mr Kxxx Lxxxx

Customer Concerns Analyst"

 

 

It was signed by this person which strange enough isn't the person or department I was told I needed to address the letter to.

 

 

So, did I say the right things? Did I sent the right letter? And where do I go from here? Lombard are saying 14 days for a response from them but I gave them 7- should I allow them this extra time given that they already had over a year to do something or should I sent a second letter?

Edited August 29, 2008 by KissKake

[palomino]

I think you did very well indeed!

 

Couple of minor points -

 

- you won't get back any of the money you've already paid. Life's a bitch sometimes...

- you won't get a copy of the deed of assignment. This is between Lombard and MDR. What you should get is the Notice of Assignment which is sent by the creditor [Lombard in this case] to the debtor [you in this case]. But you probably won't get this either.

 

 

Looking to the future you will probably find you have trouble getting the defaults removed. Everyone will blame everyone else, and they will all use excuses like 'duty' and 'responsibility'. Be prepared for a fight.

 

 

I've enclosed our leaflet, "Welcome to Lombard Direct" [sic]

Well it gave me a wry laugh!

[KissKake]

I think you did very well indeed!

 

Couple of minor points -

 

- you won't get back any of the money you've already paid. Life's a bitch sometimes...

- you won't get a copy of the deed of assignment. This is between Lombard and MDR. What you should get is the Notice of Assignment which is sent by the creditor [Lombard in this case] to the debtor [you in this case]. But you probably won't get this either.

 

 

Looking to the future you will probably find you have trouble getting the defaults removed. Everyone will blame everyone else, and they will all use excuses like 'duty' and 'responsibility'. Be prepared for a fight.

 

 

 

Well it gave me a wry laugh![/font]

[/font][/color]

 

 

Jesus, what was the point of writing to them then? The main reason I was writing was to get rid of the defaults. I didn't expect they'd refund anything but thought I'd shake them up and ask anyways cause that's the kind of thing they'd probably say to us. Jez, hope I haven't gone and opened a can of worms with them...it's the last thing you need before Christmas!

[palomino]

The main reason I was writing was to get rid of the defaults.

 

Fair enough. I'm not saying it can't be done, rather that it's going to be a long and tedious fight. None of these people like to be seen to be wrong (it suggests they are liable) so they fight like cornered wolverines.

Roll your sleeves up and get stuck in! And best of luck.

 

There are several threads going on at the moment on this subject. Have a good browse around and you'll get a better feel for what's going on.

 

Come back here when you have some progress to report and we'll see how to help you then.

[emmaf01]

I really like your letter, KissKake.

 

I can't wait to hear what happens.

[KissKake]

I really like your letter, KissKake.

 

I can't wait to hear what happens.

 

 

Aw, thanks emmaf01 and Palomino. That's very encouraging I'm really grateful cause I'm really nervous about doing this and getting into more trouble.

 

Further to my last posts, I got the following reply from Moorcroft today:

 

 

"I refer to your recent correspondence (which they received on the 26/08/08. We are continuing to seek to obtain a copy of the Consumer Credit Agreement that you have requested. Our systems provide for reviews to be sent to our client on a regular basis and this we are continuing to do. I will contact you again just as soon as the agreement has been made available to ourselves and confirm that at this stage the account has been placed on hold and that we will not seek to enforce the debt until such time as the agreement is obtained (should I allow them extra time or should they be providing it within the 12 days? Also, does the 12 days include weekends?).

 

In the meantime however we believe that it may be of assistance to all parties if we also take this opportunity to ensure that any potential areas of dispute are addressed prior to any possible court action or further investigation. Please could you give an indication of the information you will be providing, when giving evidence to the court or providing information to the relevant statutory authoroties in relation to the alleged subject matter of the account (I thought I already did this in my first letter summarised in my previous post. Also, can they ask me to do this?).

 

Please could you provide this information by return (does this mean they won't reply anymore until I satisfy their request?). We believe that this is a simple request that will assist in ensuring that all possible areas of dispute are identified as quickly as possible and potential costs and delays are kept to a minimum level (kept to a minimum level for who? me or them? can I incur costs if I don't do this?).

 

I thank you for your assistance and patience in this regard.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

Mrs K Dyde

Operational Support Supervisor"

 

What do you guys think? Is this letter a good sign or a bad sign?

 

Looking forward to hearing from anybody...

[ScarletPimpernel]

The letter from Moorcroft is a standard template. There's no need to reply. Moocroft have 12 working days to comply with your request, so just sit back and wait to see what they come up with - if anything.

[cashins]

they said they'd send someone round to my house first before they take it to court so I just agreed to pay it and cut back on other things instead...sigh...).

Debt collectors often threaten a home visit, in reality it rarely happens - the just wanted to scare you into paying. If it ever does happen, they actually have no legal rights at all. Tell them to get off of your property and call the police if they dont go.

 

Up till now I can't obtain any credit and last year I got my credit files from Experian and Equifax which showed they were entering a default status for me every month since 2003!!!

 

Are they actually entering a NEW default every month? Status will read Default, (as in, this account is in default), there should be a date shown when the default was entered. Even if another company has taken it over, the original default date, 2003, should stand.

From what you say they have been in default of your CCA 1974 request since 12+2 working days since they received it, (and ignored it). Legally, while they reman in default of your request - you can stop paying them.

 

That would shake them up a bit.

 

David

[The GodMother]

working days are monday to friday not including bank holidays and any other public holidays which may mean works get the day off.

 

On and you may get your money back there is a new ish thing were ppl can ask for the money back but they may not get it this is due to the way ppl inturpretat a ruling.

 

I will dig it out for you. I will advise you tho not to get ur hopes up as they may not give you the money back.

 

here is a link to the exact wording i am on about 45 not the thread is a sticky in the debt page mabye above this thread

Edited September 4, 2008 by The GodMother

[KissKake]

From what you say they have been in default of your CCA 1974 request since 12+2 working days since they received it, (and ignored it). Legally, while they reman in default of your request - you can stop paying them.

 

That would shake them up a bit.

 

David

 

 

Thanks David. I've cancelled my direct debit to them And yes, they've been entering a new default every month- I thought you could only get 1 default per debt (as per the definition of a default by Credit Ref Agencys')? Is this true?

[KissKake]

working days are monday to friday not including bank holidays and any other public holidays which may mean works get the day off.

 

On and you may get your money back there is a new ish thing were ppl can ask for the money back but they may not get it this is due to the way ppl inturpretat a ruling.

 

I will dig it out for you. I will advise you tho not to get ur hopes up as they may not give you the money back.

 

here is a link to the exact wording i am on about 45 not the thread is a sticky in the debt page mabye above this thread

 

Thanks- I've been wondering about that for ages- whether the 12 days included weekends. And thanks for pointing out the ruling. If they send another negative letter then I can reply and include the ruling and reinforce my request for a refund- keep them on their toes cause they've kept me on mine for so long...you're a star- will let you know how it goes.

[The GodMother]

that is not the whole ruling just to make u aware

 

it s best u read the thread b4 u do anything more as it will provide a full instite as to what is being said due to a full discussion and a resdient TRAINEE sol also having his say.

 

You need to read this Will you get payments back because of the lack of a credit agreement? then the link within the thread at the bottom i think will take you to were we have been discussing the subject.

[KissKake]

that is not the whole ruling just to make u aware

 

it s best u read the thread b4 u do anything more as it will provide a full instite as to what is being said due to a full discussion and a resdient TRAINEE sol also having his say.

 

You need to read this Will you get payments back because of the lack of a credit agreement? then the link within the thread at the bottom i think will take you to were we have been discussing the subject.

 

 

Thanks, this is really really good.

 

Well, I got a response from Lombard today and I've got loads of questions . This is so nervewrecking guys...can anyone help me please to find some answers?

 

This is what they said:

 

"Thank you for your patience whilst your recent complaint has been investigated.

 

Your complaint has been investigated fully and I can advise you that:-

 

The status on your credit file reflects that you are in default of this loan account. This is a true reflection of how you have conducted your account with us and we are unable to amend this. (I had asked them to remove the multiple defaults they were entering every month for the last number of years as there should only be one default entered because the definition of a 'default' according to the credit reference agencies is a single account has defaulted and has been closed so they should have only entered one default right? I read that on this site somewhere. The other thing I had told them in my letter was that that they should remove all defaults if they couldn't provide the credit agreement. They haven't really addressed any of these issues right? Is it worth replying and telling them they haven't addressed them?).

 

I have enclosed a copy of the Default notice and the Notice to Terminate the agreement (Neither copy of what they sent has been signed by them so does that mean it was not executed? Also, I am 100% sure that I never received any of these letters from them. I did receive about 2 arrears letters and then later a call out of the blue from Moorcroft Debt Recovery.). I confirm that only one Default Notice has been issued on your account. (Perhaps they have only issued one default notice but that should only cover them for entering one default on my credit file right? Would it cover them for the ones they have been entering every month for the last 4-5 years? I would have thought they needed to serve me with notices for each one they have been entering??? Help!) A copy of your signed credit agreement has been requested and will be forwarded to you shortly (They received my request on the 27/08/08 so it's more than 12 days now- should I allow them the extra time?).

 

I am unable to provide you with a deed of assignment as your account was not 'sold' to Moorcroft Debt Recovery. They were instructed to act on our behalf on 19.03.03, following your failure to bring your account up to date (Does this mean I don't have an agreement with Moorcroft so I don't have to pay them?).

 

In light of the above, the information relating to your account is correct and you are bound by the terms of your agreement (which they haven't provided as yet ). Therefore you will not receive a refund of any payments made as these are due and payable.

 

I hope you will consider that this is a satisfactory resolution to your complaint, however, if you would like to discuss the case further, please call me on the above number and I will be happy to help you further.

 

Thank you once again for bringing the matter to our attention.

 

Yours sincerely

 

Laura Lee Foon

Customer Concern Analyst"

 

Hope someone can help.......:sad:

Edited September 13, 2008 by KissKake

[ScarletPimpernel]

Their failure to comply with the CCA is the point to focus on.

 

Dear Ms Lee Fool

 

Thank you for your letter dated (date). You have not answered the points I raised regarding the recording of defaults with CRAs satisfactorily.

 

However, as you have failed to comply with my formal request for a copy of the credit agreement within the statutory time limit, you are in default. I am sure you are aware that in these circumstances the alleged debt is unenforceable and any demand for payment is unlawful.

 

I now require you to confirm that you have instructed Moorcroft to cease all activity.

 

Yours etc

.

[KissKake]

Thanks, I'll wait then Love your letter Scarlett Pimpernel- Dear Ms Lee Fool

[KissKake]

Hi guys, I need some advice asap please! Further to what I wrote above, I got a letter from Lombard Direct saying this:

 

"Further to my letter dated 09/09/08, please find enclosed a copy of your signed credit agreement that you have requested. Please do not hesitate to contact me should you require any further assistance.

 

Yours sincerely,

Laura Lee Foon"

 

I got this letter around 20/09/08 which I haven't had the time to respond to as yet. They sent a photocopy of a signed credit agreement. It was just one page and the signature looks like mine. They never responded to any of the other issues I mentioned though and I still want to dispute the multiple entries on my credit file so does that mean the account will still be in dispute?

 

Then I got another letter on Friday, 10/10/08, out of the blue from Moorcroft Debt Recovery. Here it is:

 

"I am disappointed to note that despite our letters (I never got any letters from them so I don't know what they're talking about!!!) and attempted personal calls by our local representative (I nearly fell over when I read this! I used the templete I found on this site and asked them and/or their representatives not to call me or visit my property and it looks like they have ignored this letter and still came! It looks like they are confident that they can legally come to my property despite my request for them not to cause they've put it in the letter! Can they do this?) no satisfactory agreement has been reached regarding the balance outstanding of £3330.00 on the above account.

 

In one last attempt (they never contacted me, even by letter to arrange anything and I got this letter on 10/10/08 and their deadline is 12/10/08! It's so unfair...) to come to an arrangement to prevent more serious action being taken we will be prepared to accept repayment by installments of £120 a month (I can't even afford this- my electric bill went up by £40 a month). A National Giro slip is attached to enable you to make your first payment. On receipt of this payment we will forward giro slips to you.

 

Unless a payment is received by 10.00am on 12/10/08 we may recommend court proceedings to be commenced against you without further notice.

 

Such action could incur you in further costs and also affect your future credit rating. It is therefore in your best interests to give this matter your immediate attention.

 

Alternatively, you can pay using a debit or credit card by telephoning the above number.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

AJ Martin"

 

The letter is dated 5/10/08. I need to respond to it asap. Can anybody tell me if I should just call them and make a payment to avoid further costs or not?

[TheChancellor]

Calm down KK.

 

Dont panic.It looks like a pretty standard threatogram.

 

They may recommend court proceedings.

 

I may recommend that Gordon Brown lends me some of that dosh from last week but he may not.

 

I need to read your whole thread & will then get back to you.

 

In the meantime I need to know why you didnt reply to my posts & why you weren't in today when I called round to see you?

 

Exactly! same as they never did.

[KissKake]

Calm down KK.

 

Dont panic.It looks like a pretty standard threatogram.

 

They may recommend court proceedings.

 

I may recommend that Gordon Brown lends me some of that dosh from last week but he may not.

 

I need to read your whole thread & will then get back to you.

 

In the meantime I need to know why you didnt reply to my posts & why you weren't in today when I called round to see you?

 

Exactly! same as they never did.

 

Aw thanks...I needed that smile you just put on my face

 

Patiently awaiting some more cheerful advice from you...hopefully!

[TheChancellor]

Hi KK

 

My first thoughts are that they've had more than enough cash from you already and given you the run-round in the process.

 

If your account with them is 5+ years old it's a fair bet that a one page "credit agreement" isn't going to amount to much.

 

Having sent you a copy they have piled the pressure on before you have time to think about it too much.

 

Can you please scan your "agreement" (are you sure it doesn't say "Application Form" in big letters?) so we can all have a closer look.

 

Please cover personal details first.

[TheChancellor]

Have a read here - sound familiar?

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/158604-moorcroft-notice-intended-litigation-new-post.html

 

Shout SNAP if you've got the same letters - even the one asking for you to prepare their court case for them.

[KissKake]

Ok, SNAP!

 

Can I demand Moorcroft provide the CCA then? Even if Lombard have written and told me they instructed them to act on their behalf?

 

Scanning agreement as I type...will post it in a jiffy.

[TheChancellor]

Ok, SNAP!

 

Can I demand Moorcroft provide the CCA then? Even if Lombard have written and told me they instructed them to act on their behalf?

 

Scanning agreement as I type...will post it in a jiffy.

 

Gotta Go KK I'm dropping!Will look at it first thing in the morning with fresh eyes. NN

[KissKake]

Ok, SNAP!

 

Does this mean I could still insist MDR provide a CCA? Even thought Lombard said they are acting for them in their last letter?

 

Scanning agreements as I type- will post these in a jiffy...

[KissKake]

Having trouble posting images but you should be able to view them here:

 

ImageShack - Hosting :: af1js8.jpg

 

and a closer look here:

 

ImageShack - Hosting :: af3ht6.jpg

Edited October 11, 2008 by KissKake

[KissKake]

BUMP

 

Just posted some links to the images in my previous post. Are these any good? I tried to zoom in on it and posted this as the second link...