Mis Sold a Car

[Ltin]

Hi, I need some help if anyone has some advice.

 

I bought a vehicle off a private owner last week, who sold the car as a perfect runner, no issues or problems.

 

All was fine until I drove the vehicle home it started to over heat. The next day I was on my way to my local garage for a look over and it broke down! There are numerous problems with the vehicle and it is now un usable in my drive way. I contacted the seller the very next day of purchase and discussed the issues - they however dont want to know me and are unwilling to take the vehicle back or assist me in getting it road worthy.

 

This car was clearly mis sold and I am extreamly angry.

 

Do I have any legal comeback? Surely you cant sell someone a car knowingly faulty then say "You bought it - now its your problem" especially when I informed them the next day - 11am of what had happend (bearing in mind the vehicle was only collected 6pm the previous day so less than 24 hours of ownership!)

 

Any help or advice would be so appreciated, I am a single mom and cannot afford to be out of pocket with a faulty car.

 

Thanks.

[Billyhunt]

Sorry to hear this Ltin, you must be livid.

 

Buying privately does make it extremely difficult if things go wrong. How old is the car and how much did you pay for it?

 

 

Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended), a secondhand vehicle, like any other goods sold, must match its description, be fit for its purpose and be of satisfactory quality. However, the standards for meeting the requirement that the vehicle is of satisfactory quality will be lower because it is secondhand. A secondhand vehicle should be in reasonable condition and work properly. It is a criminal offence to sel a vehicle that is unroadworthy. In deciding whether a secondhand vehicle is in reasonable condition consider the following:-

• the age and make of the vehicle
  
• the past history of the vehicle
  
• the price paid.
  

Also, are you sure it was a private seller, many times dealers pose as private sellers. Did he/she have other cars for sale? If you can prove they are a dealer this may strengthen your position.

 

If the car is unroadworthy, you can report them to the police and you can report them to trading standards.

 

Have a look at this, http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/c_secondhand_cars.pdf and Consumer Direct who also have an advice line.

 

As a last resort, it may mean taking them to court via the small claims.

 

Hope this helps

 

Billy

[Ltin]

Hi Billy,

 

Thank you so much for your quick reply. I am livid, you are right. The car is reg. in 1994 and I paid £1150 for it. The past history seems ok, nothing out the ordinary however my garage has explained that there were issues with the vehicle the previous owner would of known about or at least suspected needed dealing with. Such problems range from overheating due to the water filter needing replacing, clutch and cam belt needs replacing. The vehicle also leaks, which I was told time and again it had none! All the work to get the vehicle repaired comes to a total of over £600!

 

Your help has been so appreciated and very useful, I have contacted the seller in writing and will probably need to go down the small claim route as they seem to think I have no rights to take this further.

 

With Thanks

[raydetinu]

caveat emptor; let the buyer beware! if from a private seller!

However if the car has been misrepresented you do have a come back, particularly if you have an add with its description, saying in good condition, no problems etc. it does not need to be roadworhty unless they have said that it is. the onus is on you to check it out and ask the right questions. if they have lied can you prove it!

If the add just gives car model, mileage, MOT, etc. without any description of its condition or status then that is exactly what it is.

You have delv a bit deeper and ask questions, then it is up to you to check if you are satisfied with their answers or have misled you. you can threaten them with lagal action and see what happens, and in the last resort actually take them to court, but you will need evidence that you have been mislead or it has been misrepresented in some way.

[Conniff]

What water filter?

 

Who said the cambelt 'needed' changing and why?

[shywazz]

You saw a advert for a road-worthy car taxed and mot-ed, and at an price affordable to you, upon inspection, you indeed took the car for a little run-around ? didn't you...aswell as looking at various things, engine, tyres, body-work, tax disc paper-work... and no dought even managed to get the odd hundred pounds or so knocked off the asking price, you obtained written proof that you exchanged payment for the car, and drove the car away, with a smile on your face thinking nice car and cheaper than expected, the transaction has took place, car bought as seen and per your test drive and visual inspection... Next day you make contact stating the car has things wrong with it, dohhh Sir you bought the car as seen, and signed stating you were happy with the car b4 handing over the money, why should the seller have to take the car back ? even if she/he knew of the faults, its off there hands now, in my eyes the seller doesn't have to take the car back or offer to pay for faults...there will just state there knew of NO faults when selling the car... Looks like you fell victim to buying a crappy car, we all learn by our mistakes, its either face the costs of repairing the car, or better the devil you know, play daft and sell the car on......as long as you think the car is road worthy of course. Unles the car seller is a dealer or works in a garage, there wouldnt know the cam belt needed changing, or that the water pump was on its way out, and if the clutch was vibrating or felt funny when driving, you would have noticed such on the test drive... etc unless there had the car from new and then mayb there might have had just cause to think there were needing replacing hence sold the car rather than get repaired....

[Billyhunt]

I can see what you are saying regarding a car and its roadworthyness raydetinu but I dont agree that the onus is on the buyer to ask if the car is roadworthy or not and then try to prove the seller had lied. The onus would be on the seller to prove he had sold the car as seen or made the buyer aware that the car had serious safety defects or was unroadworthy. If the seller has described it 'as seen' or something of that nature and had proof of this, then that would be different but if they advertise a car for sale and sell it with an mot etc in the normal manner and anyone buying it would expect to be able to drive the car safely when purchasing it, then it is an offence to knowingly sell an unroadworthy vehicle. This is according to the citizens advice bureau, trading standards and The Department for Business, Enterprise & Regulatory Reform, who supplied the info below.

 

Where a vehicle is sold with serious defects which might give cause for concern over its safety, the seller may have committed a criminal offence under section 75 of the Road Traffic Act 1988.

The Act states that no person shall sell, offer for sale or supply, or expose for sale, a vehicle deemed to be unroadworthy, unless the seller can prove that he had reasonable cause to believe that the vehicle would not be used on the road until it had been made roadworthy. “Supply” in this context may also be taken to mean return after servicing or repair. Though it would ultimately be for the courts to decide on the interpretation of the Act in any given set of circumstances. Furthermore, the Road Traffic Act 1991 requires dealers to make safety checks on their vehicles by requiring them to identify any unroadworthy vehicle they are offering for sale. The Road Traffic Acts are enforced by local authority trading standards departments.

 

A private seller would also be covered by the sale of goods act but the grey area is to what degree as it is hard to gauge reasonable condition and fit for purpose etc when dealing with a second hand car. Thats when age and cost come into play.

 

Billy

Edited July 14, 2008 by Billyhunt

[Conniff]

The onus would be on the seller to prove he had sold the car as seen

 

There is no such thing as 'Sold as Seen'.

 

This was not a dealer, it was a private seller and as such 'Buyer Beware'.

There is very little regulation over a private sale.

 

In this case the car was not in a dangerous condition or unroadworthy.

[Billyhunt]

Fair enough Connif, but sold 'as seen' may enable the seller to go some way in proving the buyer was made aware that the car was not roadworthy but I accept this may not have been a good example. I also appreciate that in this case the car was not unroadworthy but my point was that it if a seller knew a car was unroadworthy and sold it without making the buyer aware then this is unlawful and this was in answer to raydetinu's previous point that 'it does not need to be roadworthy unless they have said that it is'. They being the seller. This is incorrect, the seller does not have to state the car is roadworthy, they have to state if it is not. If they sell it in good faith and it proves to be unroadworthy then this may be different but if they sell it knowing it is unroadworthy and do not make the buyer aware this is a criminal offence.

 

I agree that there is very little regulation over a private sale, I have said as much, though the sale of goods act does apply but is difficult to interprete when it comes to second hand cars. It is an offence to knowingly sell an unroadworthy vehicle even if you are a private seller though and not inform the buyer and that was the point I was trying to clarify.

 

Billy

[Conniff]

I didn't make my last post sound very friendly did I, sorry, it wasn't intended that way.

 

The problem with a private sale is that in general unroadworthy is just about all you can prove, it's so difficult to get anything else.

[ellie1997]

wouldnt have been a Fiat Punto would it?

[raydetinu]

Private sale, they do not have to say it is roadworthy, thats the buyers decision based on thei nfo given and checking the vehicle.

If you buy a fridge of somebody, private sale and the add did not state in full working order, you would not buy it or you or you would ask, not assume it was. the same with a car. but more so.

A car can still pass its MOT and still have lots of things wrong with the engine, gearbox; its a good runner but not for long!!! no comeback. its the risk you take when buying privately.

[jbradbury]

I thought i would ad my own comment to this post. You do have a way forward, it is a criminal offence to sell a car with faults and there is no such thing as sold as seen. Simply contact trading standards and inform them of your issue (Road Traffic act 1988), providing it is within 4 weeks of purchasing the car they can choose to prosecute and place a fine of upto £5000. Also you can pursue the seller through the county court for selling goods (Misrepresentation of Goods act 1967:7:2 & Sale of Goods act 1979).

Good Luck

[Conniff]

Welcome jb - I would hope that 4 years later this has all been settled, it is a rather old thread.

 

If you would like me to move this to the motoring section for you so you can get it across there, I will do. You're no likely to get much response here. ??