Laptop broken 1 month out of warranty

[soma]

Hi i have an Acer 5021 laptop from ebuyer.com bought last august. The laptop now has a problem with the screen going blank and stopping responding effectively rendering the laptop unusable. I know it comes with a 1 year warranty but i am now on 13 months so is it possible to have it fixed by ACER?

 

Anyone in the UK know where i stand legally with regards to a laptop developing a hardware fault just out of warranty. It would seem to me that its not fit for purpose if it breaks so soon. Do you think the sale of goods act or any relevant legislation would apply? I also think EU legislation will apply.

 

I find it interesting then that many manufacturers only supply a default 1 year warranty. I suppose they reckon that most people cannot be bothered going to the effort of arguing their case with them.

Directive 1999/44/EC of the European Parliament and of the Council of 25 May 1999 on certain aspects of the sale of consumer goods and associated guarantees

 

Article 3

 

Rights of the consumer

 

1. The seller shall be liable to the consumer for any lack of conformity which exists at the time the goods were delivered.

 

2. In the case of a lack of conformity, the consumer shall be entitled to have the goods brought into conformity free of charge by repair or replacement, in accordance with paragraph 3, or to have an appropriate reduction made in the price or the contract rescinded with regard to those goods, in accordance with paragraphs 5 and 6.

 

Article 5

 

Time limits

 

1. The seller shall be held liable under Article 3 where the lack of conformity becomes apparent within two years as from delivery of the goods. If, under national legislation, the rights laid down in Article 3(2) are subject to a limitation period, that period shall not expire within a period of two years from the time of delivery.

 

EUR-Lex - 31999L0044 - EN

 

Now if i have a case under the sale of goods act or EU Law, how do i go about getting acer to accept responsibilty.

 

Should i approach ebuyer.com as the seller (they have very poor customer service i believe) or go direct to the manufacturer Acer?

 

Acer only supply a premuim rate contact number for out of warranty repairs.

[soma]

OK so i will write a letter to ebuyer.com quoting sale of goods act and asking for either repair / refund / replacement and if they disagree i will issue a small claims for the £760 it cost.

 

The only thing i am worried about is (from DTI website http://www.dti.gov.uk/consumers/Fact%20Sheets/page24700.html)

 

What does the "reversed burden of proof" mean for the consumer?

 

It means that for the first six months the consumer need not produce any evidence that a product was inherently faulty at the time of sale. If a consumer is seeking any other remedy the burden of proof remains with him/her.

In such a case, the retailer will either accept there was an inherent fault, and will offer a remedy, or he will dispute that it was inherently flawed. If the latter, when he inspects the product to analyse the cause, he may, for example, point out impact damage or stains that would be consistent with it having been mistreated in such a way as to bring about the fault.

This reversal of the usual burden of proof only applies when the consumer is seeking a repair or replacement. After the first six months the onus of proof is again on the consumer.

 

 

If the onus of proof is on the consumer, ie me, then how can i prove the product was faulty at time of sale. If it is due to the laptop overheating then i dont see how it can not be a design flaw but proving this in court would seem to be impossible! In effect does this not mean that our "rights" under the sale of goods act only extend for effectively 6 months?

[barracad]

The manufacturer's warranty is in addition to your statutory rights, not instead of them.

 

Goods must be of reasonable quality and fit for the purpose. It is not reasonable for a laptop to stop working after just over a year.

 

Your complaint is with ebuyer, not Acer, so you need to contact them.

[soma]

One more thing I forgot to add, i bought the goods under a credit agreement (which is now paid off) would i have any extra rights or be able to claim against the credit company?

[barracad]

In what way do you have a claim against the credit company? Have they charged you for late payments etc?

[soma]

In what way do you have a claim against the credit company? Have they charged you for late payments etc?

No sorry, I took out a buy now pay later (9 months) agreement with able2buy arranged through ebuyer. I paid off the full amount after 9 months, with no charges or interest.

 

I saw this (Buying goods - your rights)

Making a claim against a credit company

 

If you paid for your goods by credit, you may be able to make a claim against the credit company, instead of the trader. The goods must have cost more than £100 and less than £30,000. This can be useful where the trader has gone out of business or has no money to compensate you.

 

 

I wonder if this still applies after the agreement has been repaid.

 

PS ebuyer.com T&C's are here (ebuyer.com)

[barracad]

This can be useful where the trader has gone out of business or has no money to compensate you.

 

But you said you were claiming of ebuyer who are, as far as I am aware, still trading.

 

Why can't you take it up with them?

Why don't you think they will have the money to compensate you?

Have they gone out of business?

 

I'm really confused as to where the credit company come into all this and why you feel you have some sort of claim against them.

[soma]

But you said you were claiming of ebuyer who are, as far as I am aware, still trading.

 

Why can't you take it up with them?

Why don't you think they will have the money to compensate you?

Have they gone out of business?

 

I'm really confused as to where the credit company come into all this and why you feel you have some sort of claim against them.

The only reason i thought of involving the credit company is to get a faster response eg if the credit company put pressure on ebuyer they will be more willing to address the issue. ebuyer have very cheap prices due to their almost complete lack of customer service. After reading of other peoples dealings with them (and based on some of my own) i would expect them to

 

A) ignore the problem

B) deny all responsiblity

C) tell me to contact the supplier

D) and generally have very poor CS

E) only do anything when they absolutely had to

 

i know this may be unfair to ebuyer, so i will update here how they respond, hope i am proved wrong!

[barracad]

If they try and fob you off then ultimately it will result in you issuing proceedings against them - this will get the message through to them and they won't be able to fob you off any more.

 

Your complaint is with ebuyer - not the manufacturer, and not the credit provider.

[robbond55]

Hi there.

Regarding the credit company, I think you can only claim against them if you are still paying for the goods (I believe under section 75 of the Consumer credit act).

However, as it has been settled in full you will have to go to the merchant , who in this case is Ebuyer.

It is the sellers, not the manufacturers responsibility to ensure goods are fit for the purpose.

Sometimes, just a strongly worded letter stating the sale of goods act (I enclosed a printout of key points of the act highlighted from the DTI website) and how it applies to your case can sometimes be sufficient.

Have a look on my thread regarding a tumble dryer problem and how quick and easy it was resolved with a letter to the retailers that I bought it from.

If you would like a copy of the letter that I sent then just PM me.

All the best!

[gordonhall]

Did you read this thread?

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/pcworld/2654-acer-laptop-computer.html

[soma]

Thanks for the link!

[robbond55]

Soma -

Hope the letter is OK for you.

regards,

Rob

[Guest Niklowe]

http://www.dti.gov.uk/consumers/Fact Sheets/page24700.html

[JonCris]

One more thing I forgot to add, i bought the goods under a credit agreement (which is now paid off) would i have any extra rights or be able to claim against the credit company?

 

They might try & tell you different but yes you do under sec 75 of the CCA. The fact that you have paid them off does not negate their liabilty/responsibilty under the act. They have equal status with the seller.

[soma]

Have sent this off to ebuyer

 

Dear Sir or Madam,

I purchased an Acer Aspire 5021WLMi Laptop (QuickFind 90575) from your ebuyer.com store on 11/08/05.

 

This item has recently developed a fault with the display which renders the laptop unusable and which been quoted as costing hundreds of pounds to repair, for a notebook computer which cost only £760 to purchase.

 

For a machine that cost £760 I feel the cost of repair is grossly disproportionate to the price that I paid for the unit.

 

I did not purchase an extended warranty as goods should last a reasonable amount of time as according to The Sale of Goods Act 1979.

 

I enclose a copy of the relevant parts of the act from the Department for Trade and Industries own web site and highlighted the relevant parts.

 

This to me is an unacceptable as a consumer who has purchased this in good faith.

 

I understand that not having an extra guarantee does not mean that the seller has no responsibility after the guarantee period has expired and may I point you in the direction of the DTI website and as mentioned, I have printed out a copy for your reference.

 

I have followed their advice and am now writing to you to claim for a cost of repair under provision of the Sale of Goods act.

 

I would respectfully request a reply within fourteen working days.

 

Yours Sincerely

[Bookworm]

Sounds good. I tend to refer to Tradig Standards rather then DTI, but that may be just me.

[JonCris]

Under section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act if the sum was over £100 you DO have a claim against the credit supplier & you MUST notify them of your claim against the dealer at the same time otherwise they will claim you have prejudiced their position by not advising them of your intentions & giving them an opportunity to try & resolve matters by intervening with their client on your behalf.

 

Although they might try & tell you different this still applies even if the finance is settled. You will also, provided the deposit was over £100, have a claim if you used a credit card against the credit card company. In short you would have 3 places to seek recourse. The dealer & the finance suppliers

[soma]

Rumors are flying around that ebuyer.com are going out of business?

 

digg - Ebuyer is about to go into receivership?

ebuyer.com about to go bust? - Mac Forums

[JonCris]

Hi there.

Regarding the credit company, I think you can only claim against them if you are still paying for the goods (I believe under section 75 of the Consumer credit act).

However, as it has been settled in full you will have to go to the merchant , who in this case is Ebuyer.

It is the sellers, not the manufacturers responsibility to ensure goods are fit for the purpose.

Sometimes, just a strongly worded letter stating the sale of goods act (I enclosed a printout of key points of the act highlighted from the DTI website) and how it applies to your case can sometimes be sufficient.

Have a look on my thread regarding a tumble dryer problem and how quick and easy it was resolved with a letter to the retailers that I bought it from.

If you would like a copy of the letter that I sent then just PM me.

All the best!

 

The finance company is liable under section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act even if the finance is settled. Liablity is only limited be the Statute of Limitations (6 years).

[soma]

ebuyer have sent a letter in response.

 

It basically says sorry for any inconvenience or distress I may have suffered, but it then states that ebuyer.com only offer a 1 year warranty on goods.

 

It also says that if I was to claim under the sale of goods act 1979 (as amended) for the laptop being not fit for purpose due to an inherent fault that it will be my responsibility to prove that fault existed at the time of sale as 6 months has passed. So they say there is nothing they can do.

 

So ebuyer's stance is that they only offer refund/repair to item's less than 6 months old and they only repair goods less than a year old.

 

This in effect means that ebuyer never take responsibility for any goods as the manufacturer offers a 1 year warranty and if it breaks down in this time they say send it to the manufacturer and if its out the 1 year warranty, then that’s hard luck as 6 months has passed.

 

Any suggestions as to what to do next?

 

I think I will send a letter back saying that any warranty cannot negate my statutory rights as they are well aware. I will give full details of the fault and how I am confident that it is due to a design / manufacturing fault.

 

Basically the fault it that after half an hour or so the laptop overheats, display goes blank and it crashes. I have replicated this by reimaging the laptop back to its default software environment with the manufacturer’s supplied CDs so the problem must be with the hardware.

 

I will point out that they are liable for the fault and tell them I will take them to court in (14 days?).

 

One thing is I live in Scotland but they are registered in England and under their t&c

 

13. Governing Law and Jurisdiction

These terms of sale and the supply of the goods will be subject to English law and the English courts will have jurisdiction in respect of any dispute arising from the contract.

 

Can I still sue them in Scotland? Is this an unfair clause by forcing customers not in england to travel to england to raise court action?

[JonCris]

You can issue proceedings in Scotland & serve out of jurisdiction.

 

The English & Scottish Courts don't like clauses of jurisdiction.

 

As you made the purchase in Scotland that court will have jurisdiction despite what their T&C's claim.

 

Tell them that as they refuse to repair the laptop which is only just over 1 year old you WILL rely on the protection afforded by the Sale of Goods Act 1974.

[soma]

Thats excellent, cheers for the help. I have found a company that will examine the laptop for £25 to find out whats wrong. Hopefully they will say the flaw was present at manufacturing and I will add the £25 if i have to take them to court!

[JonCris]

Don't forget to ask the court in your papers for damages for "loss of amenity"

[soma]

My reply to ebuyer

 

Thank you for your response. On the subject of Ebuyer UK Ltd only offering a 1 year warranty I am sure you are aware that any guarantee cannot negate the statutory protection afforded by the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended).

 

As such, and as you refuse to repair the laptop which is only just over 1 year old I WILL rely on the protection afforded by section 14 of the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended).

 

The problem with the laptop is that the screen blanks and the computer crashes after 30 min to 1 hours use. I have returned the software environment to its supplied condition using the manufacturer restore discs and I am using the default drivers supplied. As such the problem is not a software error but a hardware problem. It is my belief that the laptop is overheating leading to problems in the graphics subsystem.

 

This renders the laptop unusable, it is not fit for purpose and it is of an unsatisfactory quality. With regard to the reversed burden of proof in the sale of goods act, I am confident that a judge will find in my favour. It is my intention therefore to raise court action against Ebuyer UK Ltd if you are not willing to address the issue.

 

I would respectfully request a reply within fourteen working days or court action will commence.