Land of Leather - Help Required

[Mr Rhodes]

Hello All,

 

New to site just researching re a dispute with Land of Leather. I have read some really bad stories / experiences on here and cannot believe how they treat people and seem to get away with it.

1. Okay order sofa in Feb 07 paid cash deposit and then they missed their "approx" delivery date by 4 weeks during which time they can not advise a revised delivery date.
   
2. Paid balance prior to delivery via switch (debit) card
   
3. Sofa delivered damaged and was not installed/set up correctly
   
4. Reported faulty to store who arranged a technician to look at the sofa and assess, which took another two weeks
   
5. The sofa was damaged and an attempt at repair had already taken place prior to delivery, as per thier technician
   
6. They then offered me a repair (which I did not want) a higher value sofa at my additional cost (which I did not want) or my money back and I had to decide in 7 days or they would consider the matter closed or charge me usage
   
7. Wrote to store and said would need to consider the options and would not be forced into a decision in 7 days and would not be paying usage charges
   
8. Store then wrote and said they could not repair so keep the sofa or get my money back
   
9. Despite my serious resevations with LOL (they wanted to collect the sofa and give me a refund 14 days later) I agreed to this to obtain closure
   
10. They arranged a 4 hour window for collection and I fitted in with their timings and I faxed them to confirm the details. They did not turn up and then turned up at the wrong address nearly two hours later.The driver called me and said he was outside ay which point I checked the address with him and he was at the wrong address:-x
    
11. I then wrote to their HQ in Kent advising the situation and copying all previous correspondence.
    
12. I gave them 7 days to collect thier damaged sofa and issue a refund by return advising them if they did not collect the sofa within the 7 days I would assume they did not want to collect it and would dispose of it for them. I also added that I would issue a County Court Claim for the monies they owed me without further notice
    
13. I received a letter from their area manager telling me to contact the store to arrange collection of the sofa and I could collect my refund cheque from the store following collection of the sofa
    
14. Faxed store FAO area manager advising my position clear and I would not be dealng with their store again
    
15. Nothing heard from their HQ
    
16. Refund cheque rec'd and banked which they then cancelled after they did not collect the sofa:-x

Ok I want to issue County Court Claim against LOL. I see they have several CCJ's and a very bad reputation.

 

The goods are damaged and a refund has been agreed by both parties

 

They failed to (a) collect the damaged goods when they made an appointment to do so and (b) respond to my recodred delivery letter to their HQ giving them 7 days to collect the goods and issue a refund

 

They then issued a refund and cancelled it because they coud not collect the sofa!

 

At this point I am no longer happy with a refund as they have wasted my time and treated me very poorly, although having read their treatment of others it seems I am doing ok so far (comparatively speaking).

 

I note LOL state on their T&C's if you refuse delivery when they advise the goods are in stock they may charge £4 per day storage charge. Can I therefore charge LOL £4 per day storage for the rubbish they delivered trying to pass off as a new sofa which they failed to collect? Can I sue them for their failed appointment and wasting 6 hours of my time?

 

I will keep CGA forum updated with progress in the hope that it will help others (there seem to be many)

 

Any help and or advice appreciated. TIA

[gyzmo]

Was this ordered by distance selling or did you go into a store?

[Mr Rhodes]

In store order and paid cash deposit, balance by debit card pre delivery

 

Thanks

[gyzmo]

Well teh goods certainly are not conforming to the contract, and you have indicated your right of rejection to the company. All well and good.

 

Make it quite clear that if the goods are not collected by a reasonable time, your duty of care to look after the goods will cease to exist, and you will leave them out in the garden (or something). the beauty is that you will still be entitled to a full refund.

 

You may be able to claim additional damages under common law, but to be honest you might have a fight on your hands.

 

I cant help notice that Land of Leather's intitials, in txt mssgs and on the internet, means laughing out loud. I suspect many of their customers are not.

[Mr Rhodes]

LOL it is ironic and I have deliberately avoided the use as I agree that a lot of their customers seem to be going through a tough time with this operation, particulalry those caught up in the 'interest free' [problem] side of it. It is also very concerning to see a trend of 'short life' on their products.

 

If their attitude was more helpful and they at least had seemed to be apologetic then there would be no need for a conflict with them. Their reaction to my legitimate complaint goes along way in identifying their aims & objectives and their lack of respect for the consumer.

 

I gave them 7 days notice which is equal to the timescales they insist on so I cannot see how they can complain about that. I also agreed for them to collect thier goods and facilitated the same by accomodating thier timings at some inconvenience. They did not turn up!!!

 

I then wrote to them at HQ and Directors adddresses and advised (a) refund by return (b) collect goods within 7 days or I will assume they do not want to collect them and I will dispose of on thier behalf adding any costs to my claim against them.

 

The problem I have is I can argue my corner but I want to back that by actual legal argument. Not just what I see as fair and reasonable.

 

I have decided to be more complete in my understanding of consumer rights as I have noticed a significant attitude change in recent months towards me as a consumer. Businesses seem to be more agressive and hardfaced about their inability to deliver a reasonable level of customer service and/or a product. Utility companies, banks and BT, I am shocked how these large corporations treat people and it concerns me that they bully and intimidate people.

 

In this instance I notice Land of Leather have had 5 CCJ's registered against them and two are active whilst three are marked as satisfied. They have a plc holding company and five companies in the group with 6 Directors. They are not a small business.

 

I have written to all 6 Directors without reply. There is a lot of Directorships and disolved companies.

 

Thanks for your advice, very much appreciated.

[Darren]

Hi Mr Rhodes,

 

The person to deal with is

Kevin Maguire

Company Secretariat

Units K1-K2

Lower Road

Northfleet

Kent

DA11 9BL

 

Ours was sorted quickly with him involved, although it was in response to a Court Summons. I was going to post a copy of their defence on my thread, but decided to wait until the cheque had cleared, having read that they cancelled a cheque on you I'm glad I did.

 

complain to your local Trading Standards and copy everything to Kent Trading Standards:

 

Kent County Council

Consumer Advice

PO Box 71

Ashford

Kent

TN24 8WB

 

Apparently they have a large file on LOL

 

I would suggest writing a final letter headed LETTER BEFORE ACTION, if you haven't done so already. This is advice from Patricia Pearls book: Small Claims Procedure. Read Bankfodders review http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/announcement.php?f=43&a=35

 

Good luck with this.

 

I note you say they are a large company. Do you ever wonder how they got so big, when they sell sub standard products and have little - no (bordering on non-existant) Customer Services.

 

We did an SAR and the tone of all the phone calls and letters was 'fob 'em off and they'll go away'

 

It seems that they've built a very large business with this approach

[Mr Rhodes]

Hi Darren,

 

Thanks for the advice, I have also read through the other Land of Leather trauma experiences and gained a lot of background.

 

They have written recorded delivery givng the usual 7 days or matter closed routine. I am treating them in the same respect, 7 day deadlines and £4 per day storage charge. It's all in my favour at present except they have my cash.

 

Anyway the store called last night, they are saying a full refund via cheque when they collect the sofa which I have accepted on the basis they collect at an arranged time and not a four hour window which they fail to turn up in.

 

I am back to square 1 except 4 months down the line with time, effort and inconvenience dealing with this bunch of losers.

 

Re thier Business growth - 20 million UK homes and 60 million population and growing, also very cheap product. Fingers crossed the consumer wakes up to thier bad product, bad service and the false economy of their 'cheap' product.

 

Thanks again - I will post to confirm the end result/outcome.

[gyzmo]

Hope it goes well. Your last point hit the nail on the head. Unfortunately, I think it is a long time coming. I personally would rather have a decent monopoly than crap choices.

[Mr Rhodes]

Okay I decided to accept them turning up and giving me a replacement cheque when they collected their sofa, but they did not call me as they arranged and then called two days later as though it was my fault, saying the line was busy.

 

I have got nowhere again trying to be reasonable and giving them the opportunity to resolve without the need for conflict and use of the County Court.

 

I received a letter today from their HQ in Kent saying 'time is of the essence' and asking me to arrange collection via the local store.

 

I make the following points:

1. The evidence clearly shows they do not appreciate my time yet insist time is of the essence in thier latest correspondence.
   
2. It is not for me to arrange collection of their sofa, and in any event I had written recorded delivery and advised them they had 7 days to collect after which I would assume they did not wish to collect thier sofa and I would arrnage disposal of the same.
   
3. In the same correspondence I advised them I was unable to store their sofa after the 7 day deadline.
   
4. I have telephoned their HQ and faxed thier HQ again today marked URGENT and got no response.
   
5. I have spoken to Kent Trading Standards following advice from this site, thanks for that.
   
6. I have given Land of Leather Limited every opportunity to resolve this matter.
   
7. I am now filing a county court claim against them and sending copies of documents to Kent Trading Standards.

I will keep you all updated with events and hope my postings can help someone else dealing with this cowboy company.

 

I have checked out the Directors details on companies house and obtained all 6 Directors names and addresses. I understand this information is in the public domain so If anyone wants the details get it from Companies House website or leave me a message. It may benefit the Directors to hear directly from their customers.

 

Thanks for all your support to-date.

[Darren]

Court Summons has to be addressed:

 

Land of Leather Ltd T/A Land of Leather

 

and can be addressed to either the store you dealt with or Head Office

 

Have you tried calling Kevin Maguire 01474 322277, it may be the kick they need.

 

But then again I would totally agree if you say 'Why should I' as they know how to p*ss people off.

 

If you do issue summons, you will see a total diiferent side to the Company, everything is done efficiently. Its a shame they dont run the company like that all the time.

 

You say you have the Directors names & addresses, it would be interesting to see if any of them sit on LOL sofa's - I doubt it though

[ellieanna]

hi there, can anyone give me the Directors names & addresses, i bought my sofa from land of leather in milton keynes and paid cash for it, after 9 months the sofas were falling apart, they put it down to wear and tear, i complained and they are sending someone else out on 22-6-07 and know they are gonna say the same thing, i want to be prepared and know who to write to next, can anyone help please?

[Mr Rhodes]

Hi Ellie Anna,

 

Legally you are entitled to a refund less usage charges for the 9 months. I am no expert but the info is all on this site, including how to calculate the fair usage charge.

 

Unfortunately you will find Land of Leather very abnoxius to deal with, once they have your cash they are not interested. Do not expect them to be fair or reasonable but do expect them to try and delay, stall, and avoid their responsibilites.

 

Stick to your guns and document everything.

 

Re the Directors names and addresses, they are listed on companies house etc. I wrote to all 6 and got no response, not even an acknowledgement or a standard "thank you for your letter" response.

 

If Land of Leather are as bad as they seem to be and all customers CC'd complaints to the Directors they would be inundated.

 

Stick with it and keep in touch. Good Luck on the 22/06/07.

[Mr Rhodes]

Hello All,

 

Land of Leather Ltd have filed an acknowledgement of service following receipt of my County Cort Calim against them. This allows them 28 days to file a defence instead of the standard 14 days.

 

Interesting that all their correspondence gave me 7 day ultimatums, the latest of which said time is of the essence.

 

So much for time is of the essence when they need 28 days to defend their position in a very simple and straight forward case.

[Darren]

Good luck,

 

They should get their ass in gear now and get things moving quickly.

[twittowho2]

Well i am having nothing but problems with them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I firstly purchased a corner suite at just over 4 mths ago now. Got the suite in time (Shock Horror)--Then it was unwrapped, it had a few marks so rang Poole store and had to wait a month to get it repaired. In that time one of the recliners collapsed, so i rang the poole store again stating the problem!!!!!!!! So some one came out in the end, fix the scuff marks and just looked at the other recliner, saying we will have to order, yet another month goes by. Upon repair they offered me after a push £150- which i accepted and it was credited back onto the agreement. Then yet another problem, the leather starting pealing:shock: so i called the store againthey said that they would have to send someone else out. We was then visited again, the guy said it was not worth repairing. He said he would have to do a report again, at this point i am fuming:evil: So i called the store and all they said was we have to wait for the report. I left it a week and still no return call from Nigel the Manager or anyone else, so i had to call- then they said it can be repaired:cool: so at this point i have had enough, asked for a replacement. DO you know what the manager said, well we have to try a repair first, i said NO. Then he said ok you can have a new one, but we have to pick up the old one and you will have to pay the extra £150 that we gave you back:lol: so i just laughed at him. Then he said he would have to speak to his boses this went on and on continous mobile phone cost and my time. Finally got a call saying we could have the new suite, at no extra costs, so i was happy. He then said it will be 2-4 weeks which i could live with. Called 2 weeks into this to get an ETA and Mike the sales rep said the goods will not be in the country to 11th sept, making the time 12 weeks. Then the sales rep Mike had the cheek to say at least we are leaving you with the suite, so i have asked for a return call from Nigel the so called shop manager..... Would never use this shop again, All you people thinking about going to LAND OF LEATHER RETHINK ABOUT IT----GO ELSEWHERE................ .......Any advise from anyone would be appricated

[Mr Rhodes]

Check the threads on here about Land of Leather. You purchased and paid for a new sofa and you have a repaired sofa. The delays and inconvenience do not come in to the equation for Land of Leather, they really do not give a moments thought to you once they have your money.

 

Get your replacement ASAP and keep hounding them, put it all in writing and keep records (time & dates) of all telephone calls.

 

If your replacement turns out to be faulty write and demand a full refund wthin 7 days.

 

Also keep posting warnings on the internet and advise all you speak to about your experiences with this retailer.

 

Be warned they will stall and stall and stall again in the hope you will give up and go away.

[Mr Rhodes]

I have received the defence from Land of Leather Ltd after filing my claim. They are defending my claim in full despite having already issued (and then cancelled) a full refund.

 

They filed an acknowledgement of service and took 28 days to file their defence, which was 6 or 7 short sentences.

 

Having read my claim and their defence they are clearly hoping to hold onto my money for as long as possible even though it must be evident to them I am pursuing my reimbursement.

 

Speaks volumes about their company policy towards the consumer.

 

I will post more details when I have time.

[Darren]

Good luck

 

 

Speaks volumes about their company policy towards the consumer.

 

I didn't know they had one

[Mr Rhodes]

Yeah they definitely have a company policy towards customers, but it is not at all about providing any level of service or value for money or after sales care.

 

It's more like insult the customers intelligence, insult them personally, issue demands, do not not allow communication, mislead the customer and hang onto their money for as long as possible.

 

Did you ever get the "it's not company policy" response in your dealings with them?

 

Land of Leather Limited - Be warned and avoid at all costs.

[twittowho2]

HI... Starting to get really annoyed with this company, thanks mr rhodes for the fax number, i have sent a letter and it is on send every five minutes. think they will soon get annoyed with this. I have never in my life come across a bigger bunch of blaggers. All i am asking for is a new suite again, not my money back. All the two managers keep saying is that they can only offer a full refun. (so glad goods paid for on buy now pay next year) The two so called managers nigel and ian from the wessex gate store should not be trusted as far as you can throw them.

So can any one advise am i within my rights to ask for another suite??????????????????

I do not think so!

[Mr Rhodes]

You will have to watch that buy now pay next year scheme. Check out the complaints on this site about excessive interest and charges and underhand tactics to create a late payment situation.

 

Also, do you really want a replacement from them?

 

I can not legally comment or advise you on your case but I can share the experience with others to assist and warn.

 

The goods are clearly not fit for purpose and you have informed them of this in writing. You have also informed the finance company who pay Land of Leather. I would give them 7 days notice to replace the goods and honour the contract with you and stipulate time is of the essensce adding that you can not be responsible for storing thier faulty goods beyond the 7 days. Send it by fax and recorded post to the store and the head office in Kent and the finance company and make it clear the goods are faulty, Land of Leather have agreed this and they must collect thier faulty product within 7 days or you will not be responsible for it beyond 7 days.

 

When you send recorded delivery always track it on-line and obtain the POD.

 

Again I cannot legally advise you but I can share my experience with anyone on this site regarding Land of Leather.

 

Mr R:)

[gyzmo]

You can ask, but to be honest, I would take the money and run as far away as possible. Also, the store may argue that giving a refund is more convenient than replacing.

 

I think you will have a job arguing your ground with this lot. Do youreally want to continue business with them?

[Mr Rhodes]

Just to advise anyone who is interested Land of Leather tried every tactic to delay and stall. The County Court unwittingly assisted Land of Leather but I got there in the end.

 

I got a full refund plus my court costs and the accrued interest. They had to collect the pile of sh*ite they tried to pass off as a leather sofa.

 

I was hoping to get judgement and send in the bailiffs but at least I got my money back.

 

My advice to anyone dealing with this cowboy retailer is:

1. DOCUMENT EVERYTHING
   
2. DO NOT GET INVOLVED IN PROTRACTED VERBAL DISCUSSIONS
   
3. GO STRAIGHT FOR THE LEGAL RESOLUTION ASAP

Good Luck:)

[gyzmo]

Well I am pleased for you, but I cannot agree entirely with point 3. Courts do not look favourably on cases where there has been little or not attempt to resolve the situation beforehand. In your case there has been, hence a factor towards a win for yourself. It may seem horrid, especially when you know its going to end up in court anyway. c'est la vie.

 

But well done.

[Darren]

Well done mr Rhodes,

 

a long time but worth it in the end.