The issues raised by Llloyds bank defences and claiming beyond 6 yrs

[photoman]

hello having trouble with lloyds

 

Dinner lady

 

First of all read the Frequently asked questions here

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/faqs-please-read-these/

DO READ THE STEP BY STEP INSTRUCTIONS !!!!!!

As you go on, you’ll also find this very helpful:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/site-questions-suggestions/53182-cant-find-what-youre.html

You’ll then need to start your own thread;

Go to here:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.c o.uk/forum/

 

Find the name of the Bank your action will be against.

Click on it (the name of the Bank in Bold Blue)

On that page, you will then find a label saying "Forum Tools" (just under the list of page numbers).

Click on it. It will show you some options.

Firstly, it's a good idea to subscribe to the Forum ,as you'll then recieve updates from people in similar situatioins against the same Bank. So click on Subscribe. It will ask how often you want updates (Personally I like Daily).

Once Subscibed to the Forum it will redirect you back.

Hit the same button and choose "Start new thread"

Give your Thread a title eg: yourforumname v whatever bank

(choose how often you want updating by email if anyone posts responses in your thread)

 

Then your up and running !

 

Whilst your there, you might want to take some time to have a look at some of the threads by people taking action against your same Bank, very helpful. Remember, any threads you want to follow, you can either choose the thread tools button, and choose subscribe to thread, or simply whenever you make a post in a thread it will automatically subscribe you to that thread.

On the main page I've posted above, you'll also find lots of highlighted "stickies", which have lots of very informative stuff in them too.

Once your ready to start , you’ll need to do a schedule of charges to submit to the bank, try this one:

http://www.zen122856.zen.co.uk/CompoundSheet_v1.9.xls

 

Best regards and good luck

 

photoman

[jodyperry]

hi

 

i have had 390 in charges over 6 years but the 4 previous to that i was unemployed or in and out of work where i was getting loads of charges. can i estimate these charges as they have only provided 6 years, and since 6 years ago was when i started my current ful time job, the estimated charges are at least 1900 . since this bears no relation to the charges i have had in 6 years will i be able to do this?

[Pen]

Hi Jody,

If you read back from posts #50 onwards that should anwser your question

 

Pen

[welshlass]

Hi, I have just received a response from Lloyds Bank to my bank charges reclaim letter. Their letter states that I am not receiving my claim as my charges were charges for "extra services" and they feel it is fair to make these charges as it "causes them extra work". They also claim that they are completely open about their charges to new customers by giving them a guide to their charges. The letter goes on and on about only applying to credit card charges and that the guidelines are about "default charges" that people pay when they have broken their agreement and that I have not broken my agreement with them. My charges are for unauthorised borrowing, unpaid direct debits etc.! They finish off by stating that they cannot agree to cancel my charges and that they will put me in touch with the Financial Ombudsman if I do not agree.

 

Could somebody please advise on my next move..... Help!

 

Many thanks to everybody for the information on this site!

 

Hi

 

i just want to say i have just recieved today exactly the same letter as above..its a joke!!! so if anyone got any advice on the next stages i would be grateful..

 

thanks louise x

[Pen]

Hi Welshlass and fluffy, these letters are all standard so just ignor them and go on to the next stage thats either the letter before action or if you have done that follow through court proceedings you will find the moneyclaim or the N1 both on here to fill in. sorry don't know how to do the links for it otherwisae I would do it.

Pen

[welshlass]

thanks pen am doing the lba letter today xxxx

[PeterAnderson]

Pen - Hi,

 

I am in the process of recovering (so far) £9.1k I got all my information from:-

 

Copy Statements Unit

Swallow House

PO Box 139

10 Swallow Street

Birmingham, BX1 1LT

 

Best of luck

[Pen]

Hi Peter, thanks, but I have writtern to that department so many times, I just think they have an issue about giving me them which I am not party too.

 

Pen

[RopeyDonkey]

Umm I dont understand why I cant find anything on here about it but LloydsTSB WON today... the judge ruled that LloydsTSB's fees were perfectly legal... it would appear that not all are familiar with this 'cloaking' term and that LloydsTSB have an extremely strong position now, and that while this District Court judgement does not set a true precident, it is obvious that many other judges will read the very clear case notes that instantly put many of our claims in tatters

 

 

I am about to start court proceedings vs LloydsTSb but with these recent developements I am less certain, as all of my arguements were raised at this hearing and were disregarded.

[Pen]

Hi Ropey, where did you read that.

Pen

[Curlyben]

Try this:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/90246-first-victory-lloyds.html

 

Now the judge DIDN'T rule that the charges where legal at all.

Please before going off half cocked make sure you have ALL the facts to hand.

[mcuth]

Umm I dont understand why I cant find anything on here about it but Lloyds TSB WON today...

 

Umm, this is the main 14 page (so far) thread:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/90246-first-victory-lloyds.html

 

And there's a sticky from Bankfodder here in the Lloyds forum, putting the case into perspective:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/90521-lloyds-victory-birmingham-perspective.html

 

There are also quite a few other threads dotted around, since it was quite a popular talking point yesterday (and no doubt will continue to be for a while)!

 

Cheers

Michael

[Pen]

Found it, how sad for Kevboy, and me i am in court next week and SC&M have said they are going to defend the case, Pen

[mgp]

Posted this today and then just came across this thread. Have received the following from Lloyds as part of their defence.

 

 

 

Insofar as part of the Claimants claim is based on charges levied on their account prior to six years from the date of issure of the claim that is 19.4.2001, this part of the claim is statute barred by sction 5 of the limitation act 1980. The Defendant is unable to verify the amount claimed prior to the 19.2.2001 as the particulars of claim does not show how the amount claimed is arrived at.

 

The claimants claim is denied in its entirety . It is further denied that the Claimants entitled to the sum claimed or to any sum from the bank

.........................

 

I took all infomation from the statements they sent to me and started my claim 19th April 07 , my mistake was claiming back 3 months to many. Very worried about this as think this may injure my claim. I have been thinking of giving up but have had a message from a member saying not to do so but to send a letter to Lloyds shwing the updated charges and a copy of the schedule to the local court. Unsure if this will stand up in court

 

Feel quite stupid about my silly mistake so any advice gratefully received.

[Pen]

Hi Everyone,

As most of you are awere I have a disposal hearing on the 25th June concerning Data Protection Act so I would like to prepare for it some how, thats if i can.

 

One of the directions state: To Prepare for the hearing

"At the disposal hearing the court may decide the amount payable and give judgement for that amount or give directions as to the future conduct of the proceedings

 

Parties should note that provisions of part 26 Practice Directions paragraph 12,4 apply to a disposal hearing."

 

Can anyone tell me how i should prepair for this, hearing. Should i write a witness statement, or do I need to write to the judge stating what the effect of not recieving any of my DPI has had on my claim and or future claims. I have no idea what i should be doing so please advice if you can. I gather that any information would need to be submitted 14 days before the hearing which is now really so what do i need to do if anything,

 

there is a lot of my Data information I would like to see for instance in the early 90s we had a small amount about £3,000 invested in PEPS, I have the statement showing this but we can not remember what happend to it, did we cancel or left it to build we just cannot remember as a lot has happend in our life's since then. My data would have told me but without it, all i have to go on is prove that it was deposited. Since LTSB can not supply me with any information hence the judgement can I assume that this PEP is still earning interest and can LTSB dispute it since they can give me no information relating to it's excistance. I have no idea so would welcome any advice from those who know.

 

HAs anyone been to a disposal hearing before and can tell me what what to expect, what happends, how it is conducted? i gather i can not give oral evidence at this hearing. I have called SC&M to try to discuss the judgement but they have claimed no knowledge of having recieved one in my favor from the court and said they knew nothing about it, if thats the case (no pun intended) SC&M are hardley likley to turn up.

 

having never attended a disposal hearing I am a bit nervous as to what to expect and what i should be doing now.

[mgp]

Has any Lloyds customers been successful in claiming beyond the 6 years ?

[mgp]

Really need help with this.........

 

Claim just transferred to my local court. Made a slight mistake and claiming for 3 months prior to 19.4.2001, Lloyds are now defending on these grounds ,saying I am unable to verify these charges (I actually took this info from statements they sent me)

 

Should I delete these 3 months when sending my schedule to the court (also updated version to the bank) or is the original amount set in stone and by doing this will it be thrown out of court?

[magickminion]

I also have received ONLY 6 years worth of statements from LTSB. Is it really in my interest to try to fight them for records further back? I know they will owe us quite a bit more. Also, is it advisable to add all o/draft charges, account charges, and account fees or are some of these inadmissible? Thanks!!!

[Pen]

Hi Mag,

I suppose it depends on how much you estimate that they owe you, even then if they do owe you money why should they have in and not you it's only in their interest if you don't claim it if you see what I mean, but then the choice is yours and yours alone I supose if for instance all they owed you was £25.00 then i would not bother either.

[magickminion]

Thanks Pen..What about question number 2..any ideas about which charges to tally up? I've looked through the forums and haven't found anything concrete. All help is most appreciated. BTW, I will be asking for further statements. They owe much more than £25.00

[Daz1972]

Can any one tell me where to look on Lloyds web site for the T&C

 

Thanks

Daz

[Pen]

Hi Daz, I think It's under a thread called wayback machine by mastermind, sorry MM if it's not yours.

 

pen

[MJay69]

Hi there!

I have to complete the documentation for delivery to Court tomorrow afternoon...

 

Is there any details on the site that can be added to the template for the witness statement to cover claims over 6 years. I have downloaded the Case Law from the relevant link but cannot find an appropriate way to phrase siting the additional legislation........

 

Help would be sincerely appreciated.

[PeterAnderson]

Hi - Guys

 

I am certainly not a legal bod, I am in the same position of you guys but I found this on someone's POC's (lost the link - sorry

 

a). In so far as any charges relating to the period before xx/xx/xxxx, the Claimant wishes to invoke s.32 (1) (b) of the Limitation Act 1980 in that the Defendant deliberately concealed the true cost of administering the contractual breaches committed by the Claimant and thus essential facts relevant to the Claimant's right of action have been concealed and continue to be concealed by the Defendant.

 

b). Alternatively, the Claimant seeks to rely upon s.32(1)© of the Limitation Act. The Claimant paid the charges in the belief that they reflected the true cost of administering the contractual breaches. The Claimant has now discovered, following revelations relating to a similar organisation, that the true costs are much lower and that the belief held by Claimant was in fact mistaken.

 

It is thus submitted that in accordance with s.32(1)(b), s32(1)© and s.32(2) that the time period for the purposes of the Limitation Act does not begin to run until the Claimant’s reasonable discovery. This was the 21st March 2007 when the revelations were made public

[MJay69]

Thanks to those who wrote to me.... Bad time to lose email and I had to just go it alone.... I too am no legal bod but this is what I eventually wrote:

 

" XXX I would ask your Honour to decide that Lloyds are disguising their penalties and that this must amount to a concealment as they are aware that they were “cloaking a penalty”. On this basis, Lloyds TSB Bank should they lose the protection of the Limitation Act 1980 (Section F Page 96).

Section 32 (1) (b) the Limitation Act 1980 states

 

32 Postponement of limitation period in case of fraud, concealment or

mistake

(1) Subject to subsections (3) and (4A) below, where in the case of any

action for which a period of limitation is prescribed by this Act,

either—

 

(a) the action is based upon the fraud of the defendant; or

 

(b) any fact relevant to the plaintiff's right of action has

been deliberately concealed from him by the defendant;

 

or

 

© the action is for relief from the consequences of a

mistake;

 

33.In Cave v Robinson Jarvis & Rolf (2002) (Section F Page 17), Lord Millet states that

“The statutes of limitation have been described as "statutes of peace". They are regarded as beneficial enactments and are construed liberally.”

Referring toSection 32 (1) (b) the Limitation Act 1980 he also states

“In such a case the period of limitation does not begin to run until the plaintiff discovers the concealment or could with reasonable diligence discover it. The rationale for this provision is plain: if the defendant is not sued earlier, he has only himself to blame”.

34. I have supplied some other relevant case law in relation to this Act namely Williams v Fanshaw Porter & Hazelhurst (2004) (Section F Page 1) and Sheldon & Others. Appellants and R.H.M.Outhwaite (1996) (Section F Page 34) and ask that my claim for repayment of charges dating back to 1996 is allowed"

 

Hope this helps someone.

 

Mary