ILLEGAL CCJ on ACCOUNT - DESPERATE!**WON AT LAST**

[electric lemon]

Just wanted to apologise if I have caused any confusion??

 

Also wanted to say a big thanks to Laiste who has offered never-ending support & help to me over many issues. She has always come to my aid & promptly too, not to mention the many times she has had to go over things with me when I havnt understood!

 

Never-ending patience she has.:o

 

Laite has always been most genuine with her knowledge & expertise which without I would be up SHI** creek!

 

Ive Pm'd you Zoot.

 

Love to all,

 

Lemoney with another cold & feeling achey & really crappy.

[electric lemon]

Huh?

 

OK Zoot, will try again.

[electric lemon]

Hi everyone,

 

Not been around for a while.

 

Work, ill mother & all this really had got to me & stressed me to the max so took some much needed time out from it all.

 

Im back to a degree but taking things gently.

 

Need to update you with what has happened since Ive been away.

 

Very sadly as we all know, Laiste departed from CAG much to the shock & sadness of many. I must say that she was only ever trying to help me through all my correspondance here & elsewhere. She was an honourable lady to whom many of us owe much.

 

After she left she amazingly continued to help me, & assisted me with my urgent application for a stay. This we did between us (I didnt do the legal stuff of course!!) & in the nick of time got it in.

 

A stay was requested until the outcome of the OFT case ?feb/march next year in order to get a counter-claim together.

 

I cannot tell you the amount of relief it gave me to get a phonecall from the court the day before,saying that it had been accepted & that I didnt have to attend the court. I could have cried.

 

Anyway, that was that. And I had the time that I so needed to decide what to do next.

 

OR so I thought. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Then low & behold I get a letter from the court end of last week saying that they have stayed the case only till the 14th December!!!!!!!

 

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!

 

So, Im back to being in the poo again.With not really a clue of much what to do.

 

CL are really digging the knife in.

 

 

Oh by the way, CL have still to furnish me with all the other statements that are missing so I still don have an accurate figure of what is owed due to thefact that some of the amount they are claiming consisit of charges!!

 

I did notice tonight that Bella had her case with EGG struck out, which is fantastic & wonderful news! So when I can I think I shall get a little peek over there to give me some hope.

 

Is anyone in a position at some time to assist me with a Counter-Claim. I am happy to do the work but havent a clue of where to start and as I understand they take alot of time to do.

 

Matbe I could just see one that has previously been done.

 

Love to you,

Electric:)

[electric lemon]

P.S. I havent looked in yet but I was so pleased to see an appreciation board for Laiste. She so deserves it, & all I have to say about that is a HUGE " Here-Here"!!

[electric lemon]

Bless you Thailand.

 

Thank you for your neverending & wonderful support.

 

You cheer me with your comments on "The Tiddly-Peeps"!!!!

 

Hope all is well with you.

 

Virtual hugs coming your way. (((((((((((())))))))))))))))

 

Love Electric

x:)

[electric lemon]

Hi there everyone,

 

I dont know if any of you are able to help but I am more desperate than I have ever been I think.

 

I posted on here a few days ago as I had been away a while.

 

Anyway, point is I applied for a stay of my case until the oft test case outcome. Paid £75. All went well so I thought. Anyway about 10 days ago I got a reply from court stating that the matter was relisted for hearing on Dec 14th.

 

Relief I felt was immense though I was disssapointed to see that it hadnt been put off till next year & really need to buy some time. ( Laiste had previously advised that doing a counter-claim took a very long time.).

 

Anyway I just got the letter from the court out again to go over it and to my complete & utter shock saw right at the bottom that the time for filing & serving the defence & counterclaim be only extended till 4pm November 5th - TOMORROW!!!

I am in pieces, so if anyone of the mods or anyone else can help could you help please, please.

 

I dont know why I didnt see it. I clearly just didnt read it properly.

 

I feel that CL have won, & yet the credit agreement hasnt been given to me still nor have alot of missing statements with charges on them.

 

I am a desperate woman.

 

Does anyone know of anyone that might be able to send me a copy of their CC to adapt?? Or anything.

 

Ive come so far with these awful, people that I feel utterly despondant at the thought that they might just win now.

 

Many many thanks,

 

Electric lemon:(

[electric lemon]

My defence is based on the fact that they:

 

1. They dont appear to have furnished a proper credit agreement (is an application form jobbie). Laiste looked at it & said that its not a proper one & that the first time in court it should have been thrown out, but I didnt really know what I was doing.

 

2. There are penalty charges that they still havent furnished me with, despite being requested from me & the Court.

 

This was in the letter last submitted to court with help from Laiste:.......

 

As part of the Amended Defence & Part 20 Counter-Claim that I wish to file, I will be raising the issue of penalty charges which form part of the sum claimed by the claimant, which I intend to challenge.

 

I will also be questioning the legality of the default notice issued in respect of the alleged account, as it is my contention that the amount claimed in said Default Notice included penalty charges, which I beleive to be unlawful..

 

I asked for the court to be allowed to submit the amended defence & Part 20 Counter-claim once the test case litigation was concluded.

[electric lemon]

After much consideration & alot of hard work I have come to the conclusion that I honestly dont know that I have the strength to do this, even though Tom term has helped me immensley in the 11th hour tonight.

 

In addition I have to find another £75 for another AN which will be difficult. It was only 4 weeks ago that I forked out the other £75 that was supposed to stay my case till next year (. That makes £150 if I go ahead with no guarantee of winning.

 

CL have already placed a default on my credit file as well.

 

I have never disputed the fact that I owe them money, but the fact that the amount they are claiming is incorrect due to charges levied on the account which they have still failed to show by supplying the statements that both I & the courts have requested from them.

 

I have no choice but to resign to this defeat.

 

Thank you Tom so very very much. You have been honourably helpful to me tonight. Incredibly so. I owe you.

 

I know that this case has just been too big for me. I am so tired, & feel exhausted by it all but very angry that CL after all this time have won.

 

I feel that in the past others have looked up to this thread for support & advice & encouragement & I am so very sorry to let you down, for I feel that I have.

 

Thanks hugely to all that have been my saving grace for all this time particularly Laiste, but most importantly for the hope you gave me all of you. Sadly it hasnt ended positively & Im very sorry for that.

 

I am scared now as I guess I just wait for the letter from the court saying the CCJ has gone through. How much will I have to pay a month. Does anyone know? The amount owed is about £2300.

 

This one has gone to bed.

 

Love a very sad, deflated & agonised,

Electric

[electric lemon]

Hi Guys,

 

Thanks for your help here. Massively.

 

Im chronically lacking in confidence & I still dont know that I will/am able to do this.

 

I am at work & wont have the ability to sort this out this afternoon anyway.

 

I am totally confused about what I should put where on what form and what should be type written anyway. Would I ask for a S127 at the court??

 

Im not adverse to hard work of any type its just that I find these legal formats & neccessities mind-boggling.

 

Do you think that, If & I mean if, that I would be able to be a day late by taking this down to the court tomorrow???? Would they accept it?

 

Cl & other companies have done it before with the courts, some being as much as 10 days late in furnishing the courts with info etc.

 

I looked at Curly bens defence & there are parts I think I could use but can this be right? as CL have sent me the application form/credit agreement but there seem to be doubts that this fits the criteria for being the right thing. (the previous judge when I first went said that the credit agreement was acceptable before, but so have other judges elsewhere but when some case ? wilson has been suggested they have back-tracked from what I remember reading??

 

In addition, the MAJOR reason for my defence is that CL since when I first requested statements in March & despite court instruction in August STILL havent furnished me with them so I can check for penalty charges.

 

To me that renders the ccj REQUEST VOID AS IT IS AN INACCURATE AMOUNT STATED ON THE CLAIM FORM.

 

Can anyone put that into a defence or Counter-claim for me??

 

I am comp[letely foxed with what I should put in a counter-claim? What would I be claiming for & am I supposed to claim costs from them?? (dont want their money - just want to get rid of this).

 

 

What I cannot understand is why when it was so simply spelt out & stated in the last defence when requesting a sray till after the OFT case did the judge refuse. It was supposed to put things on hold till next year.

[electric lemon]

Just looked on Bellas thread which she got struck out.

 

One of the things that I possibly could put would be this...????

 

I put in an App Notice to strike out the case on the grounds that they had not complied to the Judges Court Order! And because they have not produced the agrrement and everything else asked for, I am unable to make a amended defense and counter claim!

 

The Sols sent us threats to withdraw this and that they would rigorously defend any such actions, In fact we found out that the sols had written to the Judge asking the Judge to award Judgement because I had not filled a amemded defense and counter claim by the alloted time on the Court Order!

 

Could me requesting a strike out on an AQ copying this work???

[electric lemon]

Thanks everyone.

 

Gosh, there seems to be real teamwork here & Im very appreciate of it ell.

 

Tom-Term I will get my details up asap.

 

Bella, got your PM-many thanks.

 

Its not all the details of your AQ I needed, as of course I appreciate that your case was quite different with EGG. Its just the part about EGG not adhereing to the judges orders, and how that part was laid out thats all so that I can apply it to CL's actions.

 

I am hoping that I may have a slight possibility for a strike out on their non-compliance of the judges orders.

 

I do feel that I just may have a glimmer of hope. Thank you all.

 

Electric

[electric lemon]

Hi everyone,

Ive not been able to be around - again because of my very unwell mother, however I am back now for 2 weeks & finally have the time & energy to put into somehow coming up with something that may help me, as the court date is Dec 14th.

 

Tom Term are you around?

I would so like to be able to call upon you for your assistance, or anyone else that might be able to help.

 

I will get all the info up in the next 24 hours.

 

The main thing with this case is that CL finance have failed to comply with the judges orders from September to supply me with missing statements with which are required to deduce an accurate amount that is owed.

 

This renders the amount that they are claiming on the Judgement inaccurate. Laiste when she was previously here felt that this may not be enough to present to the judge & that even with CL not complying that this would not stop the Judge making judgement against me, however Im willing to try anything.

 

So if anyone is out there that can help I would be so very grateful.

 

Its been such an arduous journey I really feel that I dont want to give up without a fight.

[electric lemon]

Hi there All,

 

Just wanted to say that Im in Court tomorrow at 10.a.m.

 

It will be D-Day.

 

I havent been able to get on here adequately, nor have I had a bean to spare/any money to file a defence or counterclaim.

 

I am anticipating that judgement will be filed against me, that CL will win, and am sadly prepared for it.

 

I can only appeal to the Judge in the fact that I have had no means/money to appeal/counterclaim & that CL finance have failed to furnish (despite judges orders ) the missing statements showing charges that deem the amount CL are claiming inaccurate.

 

If anyone is out there that feels they may be able to offer me any advise or anything at all with which to take with me tomorrow, advise or otherwise I would be most grateful.

 

Yours, Electric:(

[electric lemon]

Hi Elsinore,

 

Your advice is much appreciated.

 

I saw on another thread that there is a case that could be quoted (?Wincester V ?) which stated that a default was illegal if the amount claimed for included charges, which mine does.

 

I had PM'd Sequenci but he/she is on a training day & so asked me to contact PT3573? But Ive not heard anything yet.

 

I cant quote Judges I know but there is a Judge that appears to be fairer than the one I had last time (Name similar to the Man in the ****).

 

If I get the other one I may not be so fortunate as he was far from considerate last time & got very agitated when I quoted legal stuff to him.

 

I will take your advice and request an adjournment. Its the only thing I can do really. Excellent of you to suggest - thank you.

 

CL Finance have never turned up & its been to court twice already, so I shouldnt think that they will tomorrow. They'll just send a letter that the judge will read out.

 

Awaiting Paul PT3573.

 

Leccy

x

[electric lemon]

Hi again Elsinore,

 

I found it!

 

Its The:

 

"Woodchester Lease Management Services Ltd V Swain & Co, NLD 14 July 1998"

Dont know how to get at it though?

[electric lemon]

Anyone...pretty please?!

[electric lemon]

Hi all,

 

Back from court - here's what happened:

 

The security guard chatted to me on the way in about what was in my handbag (the weight!). He also asked me if I knew where I was going. I replied that I did, and was looking forward to seeing Judge " man in the ****", as he was really nice.

 

Whereupon he agreed with me and said that I wouldnt be so fortunate as this Judge had now moved to Torquay!!!!!!

 

My first negative.

 

Went into Court - had only been there 5 mins when I was called.

 

Dread of dreads a male solicitor stood up & followed me in. I felt like I had had it. This was the last thing I wanted to see.

 

My second negative.

 

There who should be sat in front of me was Judge "not so nice" from before. My heart well and truly sank.

 

Anyway, the solicitor went straight for the jugular stating that I had had more than enough time to file a Defence & CC, hadnt & so they should be awarded their claim.

 

The Judge retaliated that in fact it was him/CL finance that were in breach & that he was forgetting that he/CL finance had not, despite judges orders furnished missing statements since ordered to from August & so was worse!!!

 

It was brilliant! I couldnt believe my ears & that this was the same Judge. Increased my confidence in him I must say.

 

I took this opportunity to speak up, and stated that I hadnt been able to complete a Defence & CC as the statements were still missing & that this was a breach on CL finances part, and because my mother had been so unwell.

 

I asked for an adjournement based on these facts. I then quoted the "Woodchester case" and that without the information being furnished by CL Finance that their claim may be deemed illegal & that I would request for it to be struck out. I got no reply to this other than...you appear to have been doing a little homework!

 

The Judge then said that he felt that an adjournment was appropriate and that he would give me enough time to prepare my defence. He asked CL's solicitor if he had any objections which he stated that he didnt.

 

The Judge went on to say that the time span also included him (the solicitor)& that he was giving CL Finance until the end of January only to furnish the missing statements. The Judge asked if Feb 29th was ok as a date to complete my Defence/CC, which I said it was.

 

He then said that he would request a date not before March 24th to return to Court but said that this wouldnt be the final hearing. (dont know what that means?).

 

The relief I cannot tell you was immense.

 

Many thanks you guys that have been around the past couple of days. I am so grateful to you all.

 

Now have to get to work on the main work & prepare really well, though may still need some advice & help if thats ok with you here.

 

Love,

A very relieved & somewhat brighter & sharper Electric Lemon tonight!

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[electric lemon]

Wow - you guys really are terrific!

 

Thank you for all your really wonderful comments & confidence boosting moral giving words.

 

Feel really lucky to have you.

 

The Virtual drinks tonight are on me!!

[electric lemon]

Hi Everyone,

 

Well not been here since the court case in Dec as a friend of mine very kindly offered her boyfriends services (he's a law student). He appeared very interested & most genuine in his enthusiasm to help & I really thought that I was sort of home & dry. NOT SO :0(

 

I have had to badger & badger him (not good for the soul) to advise me where he was with everything & what I could do to assist in any way, aware of my time schedule. He has stalled & stalled every step of the way, & now my friend went & dumped him (2 weeks ago) & Ive just got all my stuff & papers back, with a lame, lame pathetic excuse from him that he didnt think he was good enough to be able to help anyway!!

 

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh!!!"£$%^&

 

I have had 3 migraines in the last week due to all the stress & am no further on with a deadline of 29th Feb/10 days with which to come up with another defence & counter claim.

 

Here are my details if anyone thinks they may be able to help, especially pt2537, if you are there.

 

In a nutshell:

 

1. Back in March 2007 received a default notice for an amount owing for £2135.00 to Ge Money. I didnt actually receive notification of this & it wasnt until I got a letter from CL Finance saying that they were issueing a CCJ if I didnt pay them outright. They didnt even give me an opportunity to make arrangements to pay them. This made me VERY angry.

 

2. Anyway, I filed a SARS to GE & also to CL finance as I beleived there were charges to the account rendering the amount innaccurate. Waited & waited got nothing. In meantime filed a defence stating this (lots of help from here - thanks masses,xx).

 

3. Went to court for a hearing, said that CL's claim was inaccurate & didnt have the statements & requested a strike out, whereupon Judge said...."here you are they sent them to me!!!!". I went through them & told the judge we couldnt continue as they had only supplied statements from june 05 - feb 07, and that 3 years of statements were missing!!

 

4. Adjournement was agreed. Cl were given 2 months to come up with the goods. They didnt, and when I went to court again in Dec 07, the judge as you know told them that they hadnt complied with his orders & had one last chance basically. He gave them until end of Jan to send them to me. 2 weeks ago a bandle arrived form CL of statements :0(

 

5. However, having gone through them with a fine toothcomb, there are still statements missing from:

Nov 2002

March, sept, oct 2003

March, june, july. aug. nov, dec 2004

Jan, march, april, june 2005

July, aug, sept, nov, dec 2006

Jan 2007

 

That makes 20 statements in total missing!!!!!!! STILL!!!

 

6. Ok, here is where I need help!

AS my defence has been that CL's claim is an inaccurate amount due to penalty charges can I quote the : "Woodchester lease management services Ltd v Swain & Co, NLD 14 July 1998"???

 

Do I do a S127 defence based on the fact that CL have failed to supply documents?

 

Can I state that the default notice is in breach & is ineffective as it specifies a sum exceeding that actually neccessary to do so???

 

Im going by the fact that from the statements that they have supplied there are 4 x £15 charges. As you know there are 20 statements missing. One would have to assume that there could be a further 20 x £15 charges that are penalty charges on these statements.

 

The fact that we cannot prove that there isnt is the thing I think.

 

That would make a total of £300.00

 

7. In addition, from going through the statements I notice that there are strangely Some figures charged to me that appeared from Dec 2002 - April 2004 under the description of "Account Cover Premium".

 

What the hell is that??????

 

That accounts for £189.00

 

Could these be further unorthodox charges like PPI????

 

This would make a total of £489.00 that should I think be removed from the amount owing.

 

However, Its been such a long, looooong arduous journey I'm damned if they should get away with all this.

 

Is there anyway that I can request a strike out as CL STILL havent come up with the statements, OR is the Judge just likely to say, ok just knock off the £489 & award the rest to CL??

 

I dont really care about the money, I will pay what I owe, its the damned CCJ that bothers me, terribly.

 

If there is help out there from anyone, I would sure, sure appreciate it.

 

Thank you tremendously.

 

Yours,

Electric

xxxxxx

[electric lemon]

Here are some details from the beginning though it may be in stages:

 

From page 2

The particulars of CL's claim are stated from them as follows:

 

1. The Claimant's claim is for the sum of £**** being monies due from the defendant to the Claimant under a regulated agreement between the Defendant & GE Capital Bank Ltd under reference **** **** **** ****, and assigned to the claimant on the &th March 2007 notice of which has been given to the Defendant.

 

2. The Defendant has failed to make payment in accordance with the terms of the agreement and a default notice has been served upon Defendant pursuant to section 87(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

3. Pursuant to clause 7 of the agreement, the claimant also claims contractual interest at a rate of 24.573% per annum from the date of these proceedings to the date of judgment, or sooner payment, accruing at a daily rate of £1.57.

 

Please also remember that I have in my hand a written letter from the solicitors dated 9th March 2007 saying that they hereby give notice that GE Capital Bank have by an assignment dated 7th March between GE Capital & CL Finance assigned the debt & that I am to pay CL Finance.

 

Oh & also the solicitors told me when I called that the claim went to the court on the 6th March. Despite me having until the 8th!!!!!!!

 

Just to remind...A S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) went off on the 12th March to GE & also I requested all transcripts of conversations made on the same letter. They said there were no records of this!

[electric lemon]

A). Default Notice was issued on 22nd March by ...Letter says, GE Money, with address at bottom as P.O. Box 700, Leeds, LS99 2BD. States GE Money is a trading name of GE Capital Bank Limited.

 

B) Unfortunately, all name & address of mine is correct as is account number.

 

C) The default notice was issued before it was assigned to CL Finance.

 

D) I received NO NOTICE from GE Capital that the a/c was to be assigned. One day I had a normal statement & the next day I recieved a default notice from GE Capital!

 

E) The Default Notice state that I had until the 8th to pay in full or call with payment proposals.

 

F) I have written evidence from the solicitors headed - Notice of Assignment, dated 9th March. It states that they have an assignment dated 7th March made between Cl Finance & GE Capital Bank Ltd & assigned to CL Finance for the said sum of £****

 

G) I know that this probably cant be submitted as its classed as 'heresay', but for what its worth, a girl whom I spoke to at Howard Cohen Solicitors the day that I received the CCJ, said that GE had passed the debt to Viking Debt collectors on the 6th March, before the said time that GE Capital had given me to respond/pay!!!!! She was quoting from paperwork in front of her, & I would presume that as they have to show all paperwork pertaining to this situation in Court it would show up.

 

H) There have been charges to the account for returned cheque/late payments etc.

[electric lemon]

This was my defence:

 

On the 30th March 2007, the Claimants received by guaranteed next day delivery, a written request for a copy of the credit agreement the alleged debt refers to. The Claimants were advised that as this matter was subject to legal proceedings, the information requested must be furnished by the 8th April 2007, to enable me to file a complete defence and counter-claim. The Claimants have failed to produce a credit agreement to substantiate their claim that monies are owed under a regulated credit agreement.Therefore I do not acknowledge that any debt is owed to CL Finance.

 

The Default Notice dated the 22nd February 2007, was not received until the 3rd March 2007, which failed to provide the requisite fourteen days to remedy the alleged breach of contract, as required under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. This renders the Default Notice invalid. Additionally, the amount requested in the Default Notice was in excess of what was actually required to remedy the alleged breach of contract. The amount claimed contains penalty charges, which are unlawful at Common Law, under The Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 and The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999. The Default Notice had to be accurate to be enforceable, the inclusion of penalty charges renders it legally invalid.

 

The assignment of the alleged debt from GE Capital to the Claimants is unlawful, as I have never been provided with written or verbal notice of the assignment, despite the Claimants assertion to the contrary. I put the Claimants to strict proof that notice of the assignment has been furnished to me.

 

I dispute that the Claimants are legally entitled to claim contractual interest at the rate of 24.573% per annum, accruing at a daily rate of £1.57, from the date these proceedings commenced, to the date of judgment. The Claimants have not proved that any agreement exists and what the terms and conditions of any such agreement are, which precludes them from claiming contractual interest.

 

I would respectfully ask the Court to stay these proceedings until such time as the Claimants provide the information I have already requested, or the Court orders the Claimants compliance with the same. I will seek the permission of the Court to amend my defence accordingly, should the Claimants provide the information they have to date failed to furnish.

[electric lemon]

Letter prev sent to me regarding my defence from Cl's solicitors:

 

 

" Dear Mrs EL

 

We refer to the defence which you have filed in this matter.

 

Please find enclosed a copy of the Notice of Assignment served upon you on 9th March 2007 in accordance with the Law of Property Act 1925.

 

We can confirm that GE Money's Data Credit Management Team are dealing with your Data Subject Access Request.

 

We note your comments regarding the Default Notice, however the said Notice allowed you fourteen days from 22nd February 2007 to remedy the Default but you failed to do so. Therefore, our client was at liberty to issue proceedings against you fourteen days after the issue of the Default Notice.

 

We can confirm that we shall be progressing this Claim in the County Court, however our Client may consider your proposals for settlement and should you agree to the same, we respectively request that you contact this office to discuss the matter further.

 

We trust this clarifies the position and look forward to you reply.

 

Yours sincerely,"

[electric lemon]

Hi Tomterm,

 

Bad news - have a dysfunctional scanner & cant post up any details at all :o(

 

I can tell you all thats in it?

[electric lemon]

The agreement is identical to someones on here called ? Angel & if I recollect nothing stood out & all appeared in order.

 

As for the default notice This was sent by GE Money. Dated 22nd Feb 2007 though I didnt receive it until 3rd March 2007.

 

Account number, name, address correct. Theres a red box top right hand corner stating that it is a default notice.Served under section 87(1) of CCA 1974.

 

Notice of assignment appears to be ok too with all details.