Perch/TM Salford Fast Track Claimform - Progressive Money loan from 2016

[AndyOrch]

18 minutes ago, gibson71 said:

I think it is a formal skeleton argument, it doesn't state it is a list and it is to be served on the other side and the court before the trial.

   Yes I'm aware of the difference thanks'  that why I told you to prepare a list not a statement to file, for your own use at the hearing.

Final points to consider given this is Fast Track please be aware of the costs that will be added if you fail to successfully defend, you have a lot riding on a technicality loop hole with the agreement...you may wish to consider coming to some agreement with the claimant before this gets to close to the hearing date.

[gibson71]

@Andyorch of course. I know you know! Just meant I guess it needs to be formal with court headings etc. if it's being filed with the court?

The claimant's end game is a charging order once a CCJ is obtained.  I did try to agree token payments early on in the proceedings and they said a charging order was the way they wanted to go.  I guess that order will include all the added costs too.  A charging order isn't the worst scenario as long as they don't try and force the sale of our house.

[AndyOrch]

I didn't say to file it with the court its for your use only  (informal) thats why I stated Skeleton list not Statement.

There are no extra add ons if they apply for a Charging Order simply a procedure to secure the judgment.

[gibson71]

I understand but statement also has to be filed with the court and other side.  

Costs will be added to the judgment though I guess as we won't be able to pay these upfront as neither of us are working.

[AndyOrch]

8 minutes ago, gibson71 said:

I understand but statement also has to be filed with the court and other side.  

Again and for the last time thats why I didn't refer to the Skeleton argument as a statement I said prepare a List for your own use with bullet points for you and you only to look at at the hearing to raise points...not to file it with the court not to serve it on the claimant, for your use only ....LIST not Statement.

You have not got enough points to raise or argue to be able to draft a formal Skeleton Argument Statement.

[gibson71]

[gibson71]

We have had index to bundle, case summary and chronology.  Case summary is now stating this relates to an electronically signed Fixed Term Loan Agreement! This contradicts them saying in their witness statement that we signed and returned the agreement.  

Also received today was Form N260 relating to all the costs totalling about £7,500. Will these be added to the judgment and ultimately to the charging order? The court says it's the judge's discretion regarding costs but that they normally get added to the judgment.  Very concerned about bailiffs, is that a possibility?

 

[dx100uk]

even if you do lose and not pay within 30days thus settling the judgement, the use of bailiffs essentially make no difference other than to add more fees to the judgement sum, the claimant will have to return to court and ask for them to be sent, be that court bailiffs or high court bailiffs if they pay a fee and cross courts.

the agreement is regulated by the consumer credit act so it by definition a consumer debt, there is no right of forced entry upon consumer credit judgements.

as for the n260 it is a fast track claim as andy advised re costs a few posts back. , but as it says, those fees are at the discretion of the judge if if if you lose. and poss not all of them. 

 

[gibson71]

OK, they want to apply for a charging order next.

The other thing I meant to say is that the N260 states that a barrister will be at trial which I am guessing is bad news.  What do you think about them now saying it is electronically signed?

[dx100uk]

well its not as you've got proof otherwise, theyre shooting in the dark

as for a barrister, if their case was that water tight they should not need one so its done for 2 purposes, 1 to frighten, 2 to try and bamboozle the judge with legalese and tecknospeak.

[gibson71]

There is no actual proof of us either signing a physical agreement or electronically signing it.  We can't prove anything but neither can they! 

[gibson71]

Just to update on this matter ...

trial on 12 September was sadly unsuccessful after hours of deliberation. 

Perch now have their CCJ but six weeks on and they have done nothing despite the judge recommending TM Legal write to us within 7 days with their intentions going forward. 

No charging order has been applied for. 

The only contact from TM Legal is just annual statement which they are obliged to send every 6 months. 

Very strange and also frustrating

[AndyOrch]

Was the Judgment forthwith or installment's ?

[gibson71]

Neither, no time limit or installments.  

[AndyOrch]

Strange no payment must be made by on the Notice of Judgment....oh well leave it until they contact you.

[gibson71]

Thanks @Andyorch, will do!  Thanks to you and @dx100uk for all your help over the past 12 months with this case, much appreciated.  The judge was very impressed at how organised I was and that I had prepared all the documents myself and that is all down to this group

[AndyOrch]

Your very welcome pity you didn't get a positive result.

 

Andy

[gibson71]

One positive point was that despite their costs being about £9,500 especially as they hired a barrister to attend the trial, they only claimed basic costs of just under £2,000. 

[AndyOrch]

Yes I had forgot this was Fast Track...well done. If and when they get in touch get your N245 ready and make an offer of affordable payment

£10 per month it will only take 3000 payments around 25 years

[gibson71]

Well they did advise previously that they expected no payments from us and just wanted the charging order to ensure future repayment.

[dx100uk]

as this was a joint claim on a joint loan, a co would guarantee them their money one way or another no matter what happens