Southern Water/shumans/Shakespeare Martineau claim form - debts from 2007 - 1st claim struck out - now 2nd claim.

[Bekki0405]

No @Andyorch different amounts, different date ranges, although they overlap, so some of the debt was covered in the previous claim 

[AndyOrch]

Name of the Claimant ? Southern Water Services

 

Date of issue – 12th December 2018

 

Particulars of Claim

 

1.The Claimant is a statutory water and sewerage undertaker to the Water Industry Act 1991 (the Act)

 

2.The Claimant claims the sum of £4559.62 for unpaid water and/or sewerage charges payable under s.142-144 of the Act and the Claimants’ Charges Scheme.

 

3.The unpaid sum of £4559.62 is for water and/or sewerage services provided to the Defendant(s) at XX XXXXX XXXXX (my address is here) for the period 11/07/2007 to 09/07/2018

 

4.The claimant claims interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% a year from 09/07/2018 to 11/12/2018 on £154.90 and also interest at the same rate up to the date of judgement or earlier payment at a daily rate of £1.00

 

 

 

Name of the Claimant ? Southern Water Services 

 

Date of issue –  30 Mar 2021

 

 

Particulars of Claim

 

What is the claim for – the reason they have issued the claim? 

1.The Claimant is a statutory water and sewage undertaker pursuant to the Water Industry Act 1991 (the Act).

 

2.The Claimant claims the sum of £4380.99 for unpaid water and/or sewage charges payable under s.142-144 of the Act and the Claimants’ Charges Scheme.

 

3.The unpaid sum of £4830.99 is for water and/or sewerage services provided to the Defendant(s) at XXXX for the period 14.01.14 to 23.07.20 Interest at a rate of 8.00% to 26/03/2021 amounts to £236.21 and is increasing at a daily rate of £0.96. 

 

AND THE CLAIMANTS CLAIMS

(1) The principle sum of £4380.99.

(2) Interest under s.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 of £236.21 and

(3) Continuing internet on (1) above from 26/03/2021 to the date of judgement or earlier payment at a daily rate of £0.96

[Bekki0405]

Dear Sir,
 
Re: Southern Water Services v xxxxxxxxx Case No:XXXXXXXX
CPR 31.14 Request
 
On 5th April 2021 I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the Northampton County Court Business Centre. 
 
I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.
 
Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of each of the following documents mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:
 
1: the agreement. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.
 
2: A copy of all bills relating to the date range in the particulars of the claim 14/01/14 to 23/07/20
 

Although your claim is for a sum which is not more than £10,000.00 and will in all likelihood be allocated to the small claims track for determination upon my delivering a defence, at this moment in time I have not delivered my defence and the case has not been allocated to a track. In consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise

 
You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the documents I have requested are disclosed at your earliest convenience. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.
 
Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.
 
In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.
 
If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request please confirm this in your response.
 
 

 

I’ll draw up my defence later, but are you saying they can’t go after the debt from the first claim. That being anything up to and including 11/12/18.

[dx100uk]

stop putting your pers details on an open forum!! names removed

 

dx

 

[dx100uk]

is this a joint claim both mr and mrs are named like before?
 

[Bekki0405]

Yes in joint names still. Sorry I thought id removed the personal details, I’ll be more careful

[AndyOrch]

Joint names as in 1st and 2nd defendant on one claim form ?

[Bekki0405]

 We both got a claim form, which we are both named on jointly as defendants,  not separate  claim forms with individual names on each

Edited April 27, 2021 by Bekki0405

[AndyOrch]

So 1 claim form both names on and one claim number.?

[Bekki0405]

Yes same claim number, I’ve double checked 

[AndyOrch]

Lets start again...by saying same claim number signifies 2 claim......how many claim forms have you received 1 or 2 ?

 

If 1 does it have both your names on ?

If 2 does it have both your names on ?

[Bekki0405]

Two claim forms in two envelopes were sent in the post. Both had both of us named as defendants. One with my name and address in left hand box, and his in the right hand box. The other envelope contained another claim form with the babes the alternative way round. Hope that makes sense 

[AndyOrch]

Strange...well as long as there is only one claim number...but you will both have to acknowledge service (this should have already been done claim issued 30th March 2020) and both have to submit a defence and separate CPR 31.14...everything in duplicate.

 

Your defence will have  to be adapted this time using the initial defence but updated to inform the court of their previous claim and being struck out.

 

I can draft this for you which is due this Friday by 4.00pm

 

 

 

.

[Bekki0405]

I’ll call the court tomorrow, to check about my ex claim form. He wouldn’t have received it as he doesn't live here. I didn’t realise we’d have to both do AOS and defence.  I’ve sent my CPR 31.14 off, I’ll make sure he does as well. 
I would really appreciate help in drawing up the defence if you’re able to. It would be good to send it with appropriate wording

thank you 

[AndyOrch]

Quote

I’ll call the court tomorrow, to check about my ex claim form. He wouldn’t have received it as he doesn't live here. 

 

Last known address is deemed good service...so unless he advised SW of a new address...then thats not going to wash with the courts.

He needs to try and do an acknowledge of service ASAP.....if the system will let him and a bar has not already been put in place.

[AndyOrch]

Particulars of Claim for reference only.

 

1.The Claimant is a statutory water and sewage undertaker pursuant to the Water Industry Act 1991 (the Act).

 

2.The Claimant claims the sum of £4380.99 for unpaid water and/or sewage charges payable under s.142-144 of the Act and the Claimants’ Charges Scheme.

 

3.The unpaid sum of £4830.99 is for water and/or sewerage services provided to the Defendant(s) at XXXX for the period 14.01.14 to 23.07.20 Interest at a rate of 8.00% to 26/03/2021 amounts to £236.21 and is increasing at a daily rate of £0.96. 

 

AND THE CLAIMANTS CLAIMS

(1) The principle sum of £4380.99.

(2) Interest under s.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 of £236.21 and

(3) Continuing internet on (1) above from 26/03/2021 to the date of judgment or earlier payment at a daily rate of £0.96

 

 

Proposed Defence

 

I Mrs XXXXXX being the joint Defendant in this claim , accordingly I set out my case below and rely on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been I made.

 

It is brought to the courts attention that the claimant has previously issued this claim on (date) under claim number (xxxxxxx) which was struck out in the XXXXX County Court on ( date xxxxxxx).The particulars of claim are identical with the dates and alleged amounts slightly changed.

 

Again as in the previous claim the claimant has not complied with paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (pre action protocol) Failed to serve a letter of claim pre claim pursuant to PAPDC changes of the 1st October 2017. It is respectfully requested that the court take this into consideration pursuant to 7.1 PAPDC.
 
It is accepted that I currently reside in an area that is serviced by the Claimant as a statutory water and sewerage undertaker pursuant to the Water Industry Act 1991 (the Act).
 
The Claimants claim of £4882.20 for unpaid sewerage charges payable under s.142-144 of the Act and the Claimants' Charges Scheme for the period 14/01/14 to 23/07/20 is denied. The claimant has never billed or contacted or requested this amount and is put to strict proof to evidence this fact.
 
Furthermore the claimant is prevented from billing for a period of more than 6 years pursuant to the limitation act 1980 and has failed to follow its own Code of Practice therefore years 2014/15 and 2015/16 are denied.

 

I have requested further information with regards to the alleged debt by way of a CPR 31.14 request. The claimant is yet to comply.
 
I  had previously requested information from the claimant with regards to making a payment arrangement or through the Watersure scheme but have had no reply to my communication.  I was not offered a payment card, or any offer of help, despite my contact to state I have a disabled child.

 

It is therefore for the above reasons that the claimant claim is denied

[Bekki0405]

Thanks @Andyorch this is a great help 

[dx100uk]

not sure on the back billing bit? that doesn't apply to water debts.. or are those words just used without implying the back billing rules on elec/gas apply to water? 

 

i believe water bills are issued annually in april? requiring full payment almost immediately , but if a bill remains unpaid it still doesn't allow the sum to be included in latter bills outside of 6yrs from date of claim.. so in this instance bills for 2014-15, 2015-16 are outside 6yrs ..

 

just musing.

 

dx

[Bekki0405]

That seems a reasonable point. @dx100uk

Just to confirm what I have done so far. I’ve sent a CPR 31.14 to SM, with proof of postage obtained.

And I have filled in the blanks on the defence, and will update the case online. I haven’t clicked send yet, I wanted to ensure I have it in order before I commit.

After I’ve sent it, I guess I wait for the bills to come back and the case to be heard?

[AndyOrch]

I did rephrase the defence and wasnt actually referring to back billing the legislation...see edited defence above.

 

 

 

.

[dx100uk]

[dx100uk]

hidden claim number in pdf.

 

just a std letter tongue pokeout letter saying stuff you pay up or we'll get a default judgement look how clever and threatening (not) we are cause we are actually totally powerless and all we can ever do is harass ...safe to ignore 

 

get reading up like claims so you know what is next, what is to come and how to respond. 

 

 

[Bekki0405]

Thanks

They’ve just emailed as well, this ones from uksearch, but we all know they’re one and the same. 
I’ll be reading up, but obviously I’m hoping they don’t reply by the end of the month and it gets stayed. Not sure I’m going to be that lucky this time, but I would be interested to know if these two pieces of correspondence would be viewed by the court as them trying to settle this informally 

[Bekki0405]

Ok, I’m back for some more advice on this. 

 

As mentioned before, I sent a CPR 31.14 to SM/Court, and received confirmation from the court that it had been received. Both had proof of postage obtained at the time, which was the 28/4/21. I received a letter from the court, stating that they had sent instructions to SM on the 29/4/21 giving them 28 days to tell the court how they wish to proceed.

 

I have heard nothing, although I appreciate it’s only just past the 28 day deadline, and possibly the court has a backlog. I’ve tried contacting the court, although I’ve just noted that the last letter came from Northampton Court and not Southampton (where it was assigned on the small tracks path) Online there is no further update to the case after I sent my defence on 28/4/21

 

Do I continue to wait it out?

I’d really like to know if they’ve progressed with this, or hopefully not, given that some of the debt is from a previous case that was struck out. Also part of the debt is out of time. SM did contact me to ask me to arrange to pay the £4882.20, which I ignored given that this figure was wrong, and as advised, it was them fishing for me to pay the alleged outstanding debt 

Important to note that my defence was sent on the 28/4/21 and I received court correspondence on 29/4/21 so I’m hoping this means that they’re not hugely behind.

 

Obviously I’m praying for it to be struck out, but even if they recalculated the debt, I would have thought I would have heard before now, if only from SM offering to reduce the debt 

 

[dx100uk]

what is the status of the claim on mcol?