Private sale Goods arrived un-useable - Help please

[tanx]

Hi Guys,

Hope someone can help me with this one. CAB were not much use.

 

I purchased a used Heat Press from a guy in Scotland (i am in England).

I asked the questions i needed answering , does the thing do what it's supposed to do.

He emailed saying yes it was in perfect worker order.

 

 

I bought it, it arrived next day, plugged it in and......no heat.

 

I informed the guy straight away and he said he would sort it.

I said a repair (at his cost) was exceptable or a refund.

 

 

He then contacted the manufacturer and emailed a mail saying it was "all sorted" with the company to send it to them and he would cover the cost.

Luckily, i didn't send it.

 

 

I emailed the company and asked what the guy had "sorted" with them

and they said just the £25 shipping charge to collect from me and drop to them !

 

 

I emailed the guy back and said this wasn't exceptable to me and could i have a refund or repair.

No, he decided to claim off the courier despite not having purchased additional insurance.

They said no and offered standard £20 compensation which he then said he had paid into my paypal account - he never did.

 

 

I again said this was unacceptable and would accept a repair (at his cost) or a refund.

A lot more waffle went under the bridge but the crux of it is , he won't refund or repair.

 

 

How do i stand on this ?

I made sure i asked the questions BEFORE i bought it.

 

 

Surely i can't be held responsible for the damage when the item never worked at all.

Any help appreciated as i want to file a small claim if i have the right to

 

Cheers

Edited June 16, 2015 by dx100uk

[aburobert]

Did you pay him by Paypal? If yes just do a chargeback - item not as described!

[BankFodder]

Was it bought through eBay?

Are you sure that the seller is a private seller?

[tanx]

Did you pay him by Paypal? If yes just do a chargeback - item not as described!

 

This was a private sale , not through Ebay

[tanx]

Did you pay him by Paypal? If yes just do a chargeback - item not as described!

 

Hi , this was a private payment not through Ebay. I don't think there is any chargeback.

[tanx]

Was it bought through eBay?

Are you sure that the seller is a private seller?

 

 

Hi

Yes , he's not a private seller. I have emails from him stating it was in perfect working order BEFORE i bought it. Surely, just having something delivered can't make you liable second hand or not. If that was the case i could just sell it on and play more stupid than i am already.

[tanx]

I have emails from him stating it was in perfect working order BEFORE i bought it. Surely, just having something delivered can't make you liable second hand or not. If that was the case i could just sell it on and play more stupid than i am already.

[aburobert]

Unless you used the family and friends option to send the money you can do a chargeback for 'item not as described'.

 

If you used the f&e option you cannot do anything as Paypal gets no commission on such transactions.

 

Anyway what have you to lose in attempting the chargeback? Paypal will 'freeze' the money whilst they investigate and it may galvanise your seller to actually be more proactive in settling the dispute.

[tanx]

Unless you used the family and friends option to send the money you can do a chargeback for 'item not as described'.

 

If you used the f&e option you cannot do anything as Paypal gets no commission on such transactions.

 

Anyway what have you to lose in attempting the chargeback? Paypal will 'freeze' the money whilst they investigate and it may galvanise your seller to actually be more proactive in settling the dispute.

 

Hi

Thanks for the reply. I can't claim through Paypal as i used the Family / Friends option.

I would like to know if anyone reading this post has used the sale of goods act regarding second hand goods. I know you lose a lot of rights buying privately, but i'm sure not as described is still covered, bearing in mind i have the email describing the item in perfect working condition.. Can anyone confirm this please before i go ahead and file a claim.

Cheers

[aburobert]

Presumably the seller insisted on the f&f option? This should have set alarm bells ringing because it negates any protection Paypal affords. It should only be used for what it is meant for - certainly not for sending payments to someone you do not know!

 

Anyway no use 'crying over spilt milk' now!

 

Your only option it seems is the Small Claims.

 

So long as you have a print off of the sales listing (his advertisement) with all the claims the seller makes and proof his description was misleading (an independent report. eye witness statements etc.) you should win. If this sale was 'word of mouth' you may have a harder time proving your case if the seller defends. But if he knows he is in the wrong he may back down thinking it is not worth all the hassle so see what his reaction is to a LBA because if he loses the cost of the claim is added to the total cost.

[tanx]

Presumably the seller insisted on the f&f option? This should have set alarm bells ringing because it negates any protection Paypal affords. It should only be used for what it is meant for - certainly not for sending payments to someone you do not know!

 

Anyway no use 'crying over spilt milk' now!

 

Your only option it seems is the Small Claims.

 

So long as you have a print off of the sales listing (his advertisement) with all the claims the seller makes and proof his description was misleading (an independent report. eye witness statements etc.) you should win. If this sale was 'word of mouth' you may have a harder time proving your case if the seller defends. But if he knows he is in the wrong he may back down thinking it is not worth all the hassle so see what his reaction is to a LBA because if he loses the cost of the claim is added to the total cost.

 

Thanks for your reply. I have emails from him BEFORE i bought the press, stating it was in "perfect working condition". I did ask the essential questions BEFORE i bought it otherwise i wouldn't have bought it. I have those emails also. Do i need a witness if he admits he in his messages to me it was in perfect working condition when it left him ?

I also informed him within 10 minutes of receiving it that it wasn't working.

Is it worth a shot at a claim??????

Cheers

Edited June 17, 2015 by tanx

[aburobert]

I don't think you can use the Small Claims as your seller is in Scotland.

 

You will have to issue the claim through his local Sheriff's Court (I think) which operates like the Small Claims here in England.

 

Personally I have done this to someone in Scotland who ripped me off and was successful but that was many moons ago so things may have changed a bit since then.

 

What I did was write to his local court asking for Claim forms to be sent to me which I then filled in, sent off with payment for the fees. I did not attend and the defendant in my case did not turn up or offer any response so I won by default and the defendant then coughed up.

 

Before you go down this line find out what the process is these days in chasing someone in Scotland as I'm way out of date.

[tanx]

I don't think you can use the Small Claims as your seller is in Scotland.

 

You will have to issue the claim through his local Sheriff's Court (I think) which operates like the Small Claims here in England.

 

Personally I have done this to someone in Scotland who ripped me off and was successful but that was many moons ago so things may have changed a bit since then.

 

What I did was write to his local court asking for Claim forms to be sent to me which I then filled in, sent off with payment for the fees. I did not attend and the defendant in my case did not turn up or offer any response so I won by default and the defendant then coughed up.

 

Before you go down this line find out what the process is these days in chasing someone in Scotland as I'm way out of date.

 

 

Thank you very much - appreciated

[steampowered]

Of course, the goods must be as they are described. Some parts of the Sale of Goods Act only apply where the seller is a business, but the rule that goods must correspond with their description applies regardless.

 

You could certainly sue him in Scotland. The default rule is that you are supposed to sue people where they live.

 

But I think you could also sue him through the small claims process in England if you prefer. When you are suing people under a contract, you are able to sue them either where they live or where the contract was performed (i.e. where the goods are delivered - being England). The advantage of doing this is that a hearing would be closer to you. The disadvantage is that, if you won the case but he still refused to pay, there would be an extra step before you could enforce the judgment as you would need to register it with the Scottish courts first.

[tanx]

Of course, the goods must be as they are described. Some parts of the Sale of Goods Act only apply where the seller is a business, but the rule that goods must correspond with their description applies regardless.

 

You could certainly sue him in Scotland. The default rule is that you are supposed to sue people where they live.

 

But I think you could also sue him through the small claims process in England if you prefer. When you are suing people under a contract, you are able to sue them either where they live or where the contract was performed (i.e. where the goods are delivered - being England). The advantage of doing this is that a hearing would be closer to you. The disadvantage is that, if you won the case but he still refused to pay, there would be an extra step before you could enforce the judgment as you would need to register it with the Scottish courts first.

 

Thank you all very very much for your help , it's really appreciated. I will be filing a claim today at my local court.

[tanx]

Hi All

Well i went to my county court only to be given a Pack of forms to send to Salford Claims Centre. I also found out because i am claiming against an individual in Scotland, it is classed as out of Jurisdiction. Therefore , i needed another form (N510) and tick which statement applies. There are so many "legal jargon" statements on their i have no idea which one applies. I called the Claims Centre "HELP" line and they can't advise which box to tick !!!!!! Totally ridiculous. Who said claiming was easy !!!! Anyway, could one of you kind forum members let me know which statement applies to me please.

I would be most grateful.

Thank you all

PS: If anyone would like a look at the form here is a link - https://www.moneyclaimsuk.co.uk/PDFForms/N510.pdf

Edited June 18, 2015 by tanx

[Ganymede]

How much is this claim worth?

[steampowered]

Gosh, yes. I had forgotten how bad that form is. It must be one of the very worst examples of legalese in the system.

 

You need to tick the first box, delete the words "High Court of England and Wales" and enter the name of your nearest county court, delete the reference to Judgments Regulation, delete the reference to Member State. If you are using the paper form just cross-out those words with a pen.

 

The justification for this is that you are relying on rule 6.33(b)(i) (https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part06#6.32), i.e. the fact that the defendant lives in the United Kingdom, and the legislation that governs jurisdiction between Scotland and England is the 1982 Act (rather than the Regulation mentioned on the form which would govern jurisdiction between the UK and other EU member states).

[tanx]

How much is this claim worth?

 

Hi Ganymede

It's only a couple of hundred pounds, maybe not worth chasing, but the fact is it's clearly not right and i'm just not the type to sit back and take it.

Cheers

Edited June 19, 2015 by tanx

[tanx]

Gosh, yes. I had forgotten how bad that form is. It must be one of the very worst examples of legalese in the system.

 

You need to tick the first box, delete the words "High Court of England and Wales" and enter the name of your nearest county court, delete the reference to Judgments Regulation, delete the reference to Member State. If you are using the paper form just cross-out those words with a pen.

 

The justification for this is that you are relying on rule 6.33(b)(i) (https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part06#6.32), i.e. the fact that the defendant lives in the United Kingdom, and the legislation that governs jurisdiction between Scotland and England is the 1982 Act (rather than the Regulation mentioned on the form which would govern jurisdiction between the UK and other EU member states).

 

Thank you very much i really appreciate your help - and so will many others