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    • I apologise if I was being unclear. Where it currently stands is that they will have it repair, placing scaffolding in our garden for 5 days. They have moved fast, but we will still have to postpone our contractors, meaning, we won't necessarily have the work done in time for the wedding and therefore will incur additional expenses for either a marquee or a wedding venue. They are vehemently against having any kind of liability in any regard but continue repeating that they are legally entitled to use our garden for their repairs (I believe this is true unless the work can be carried out using a cherry picker). The neighbour seems either indifferent or oblivious to the fact they can't reach all of the side of the roof from the space where they can place the scaffolding. They have asked their roofer of choice about using a cherry picker but the roofer has said it wasn't possible. It's not clear whether the roofer doesn't want to use a cherry picker or whether there is an issue with it. They have told us it is a problem that we are installing a gazebo as it will prevent them to access their roof from our garden in the future?!?  
    • Couldn't agree more, really wanted a true ruling on this just for the knowledge but pretty sure the Judge made some decisions today that he didn't need to?.. maybe they all go this way on the day? We hear back so few post court dates I'm not sure. Each Judge has some level of discretion. Their sol was another Junior not even working at their Firm, so couldn't speak directly for them! that was fortunate I think because if she would have rejected in court better, she might have  been able to force ruling, we are at that point!, everybody there!!, Judge basically said openly that he can see everything for Judgement!!!  but she just said "I can speak to the claimant and find out!" - creating the opportunity for me to accept. I really think the Judge did me a favor today by saying it without saying it. Knowing the rep for the sol couldn't really speak to the idea in the moment. Been to court twice in a fortnight, on both occasions heard 4 times with others and both of my claims, the clerk mention to one or both parties "Letting the Judge know if you want to have a quick chat with each other"! So, it appears there's an expectation of the court that there is one last attempt at settling before going through the door. So, not a Sol tactic, just Court process!. Judge was not happy we hadn't tried to settle outside! We couldn't because she went to the loo and the Judge called us in 10 minutes early! - another reason to stand down to allow that conv to happen. Stars aligned there for me I think. But yeh, if the sol themselves, or someone who can make decisions on the case were in court, I would have received a Judgement against today I think. She was an 'advocate'.. if I recall her intro to me correctly.. So verbal arguments can throw spanners in Court because Plinks dogs outsource their work and send a Junior advocate.
    • that was a good saving on an £8k debt dx
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    • "We suffer more in imagination than in reality" - really pleased this all happened. Settled by TO, full amount save as to costs and without interest claimed. I consider this a success but feel free to move this thread to wherever it's appropriate. I say it's a success because when I started this journey I was in a position of looking to pay interest on all these accounts, allowing them to default stopped that and so even though I am paying the full amount, it is without a doubt reduced from my position 3 years ago and I feel knowing this outcome was possible, happy to gotten this far, defended myself in person and left with a loan with terms I could only dream of, written into law as interest free! I will make better decisions in the future on other accounts, knowing key stages of this whole process. We had the opportunity to speak in court, Judge (feels like just before a ruling) was clear in such that he 'had all the relevant paperwork to make a judgement'. He wasn't pleased I hadn't settled before Court.. but then stated due to WS and verbal arguments on why I haven't settled, from my WS conclusion as follows: "11. The Defendant was not given ample evidence to prove the debt and therefore was not required to enter settlement negotiations. Should the debt be proved in the future, the Defendant is willing to enter such negotiations with the Claimant. "  He offered to stand down the case to give us chance to settle and that that was for my benefit specifically - their Sols didn't want to, he asked me whether I wanted to proceed to judgement or be given the opportunity to settle. Naturally, I snapped his hand off and we entered negotiations (took about 45 minutes). He added I should get legal advice for matters such as these. They were unwilling to agree to a TO unless it was full amount claimed, plus costs, plus interest. Which I rejected as I felt that was unfair in light of the circumstances and the judges comments, I then countered with full amount minus all costs and interest over 84 months. They accepted that. I believe the Judge wouldn't have been happy if they didn't accept a payment plan for the full amount, at this late stage. The judge was very impressed by my articulate defence and WS (Thanks CAG!) he respected that I was wiling to engage with the process but commented only I  can know whether this debt is mine, but stated that Civil cases were based on balance of probabilities, not without shadow of a doubt, and all he needs to determine is whether the account existed. Verbal arguments aside; he has enough evidence in paperwork for that. He clarified that a copy of a DN and NOA is sufficient proof based on balance of probabilities that they were served. I still disagree, but hey, I'm just me.. It's definitely not strict proof as basically I have to prove the negative (I didn't receive them/they were not served), which is impossible. Overall, a great result I think! BT  
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Ministry of Justice amends contracts for court fine enforcement with new fee scale and updated Forced Entry Provision.


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Ministry of Justice amendments to Contracts for Court Fine enforcement.

 

In 2006 the Ministry of Justice awarded contracts to private sector bailiff companies to enforce magistrate court fines. Over time, new contracts have been awarded and the current position is that only four companies are contracted to enforce unpaid criminal court fines with Marston Group and Collectica Ltd enforcing in the UK and Excel Ltd and Swift Credit Services covering Wales.

 

In April 2014 the Ministry of Justice Procurement Directorate (as representative of the Secretary of State) made important amendments to each of the companies contracts to ensure that they were compliant with Part 3 of the Tribunals, Courts and Enforcement Act 2007 which came into effect on 6th April 2014.

 

In this respect amendments were made to Schedule 4 (Specification) and Schedule 5 (Price Schedule).

 

In respect to Schedule 4 the following changes have been made to the contracts:

 

The word 'Bailiffs' have been replaced with ‘Enforcement Agent’

 

‘Distress Warrants are now known as Warrants of Control’

 

'Taking Control of Goods' has replaced words, such as ‘Levy’ and ‘Distrain, Distraint and Distress’ ...
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In respect to Schedule 5 (Price Schedule) the following changes have been made to the contracts:

 

The amendments confirms that the Statutory Fees and Forced Entry Power Procedures have both been revised.

 

In respect of bailiff fees the contracts have been amended to provide that the following statutory fees are to be levied on defaulters:

 

Compliance stage: Fixed fee of £75

 

Enforcement stage: Fixed fee of £235

 

Sale or disposal stage: Fixed fee of £110

In respect of Removal and Sale, Storage and Locksmith fees the bailiff must only charge the 'actual amount' to the defaulter.

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The Secretary of State has also granted permission to extend each contract by a further one year.

 

A copy of the amendments to Schedule 4 and Schedule 5 outlining the changes to the statutory fees that each company may charge to fine defaulters is shown below.

 

PS: To see the revised fee scale it will be necessary to scroll down to page 3 of the attached.

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Having read the above 2 posts there appears to be a lot of information missing I think clarification on several points will be needed to allow readers and debtors to have a better chance of understanding the role of the EA and this fee schedule, my observations are as follows.

 

 

Since this fee schedule is maybe live now for all intents and purposes does this now put an end to the saying that Courts fines/recovery fees are not payable by the debtor?

 

 

Also does this mean that the debtor is FULLY responsible for the fees from now on and ARE recoverable once enforcement action has started.

 

 

Finally will this put an end to paying in the foyer and online to avoid those fees accrued after the point a warrant of control has been issued I.E. paying the fine in full once you have had the NoE through your door?

 

Observations

 

1. A clamping order

2. The amount recoverable on the 1st visit or those there after

3. Wrongful clamping of a 3rd parties car

4. Wrongful control of a 3rd parties goods

5. Obtaining proof of value of the goods sold at auction

 

 

Questions in order

 

 

1. If the EA decides to clamp a vehicle without checking to see if it is the property of the debtor what can the ACTUAL owner do legally

2. Is the EA allowed to claim "in full" at 1st visit as they do atm? Can the debtor be allowed to make an arrangement to pay?

3. Is the EA still allowed to clamp a vehicle without a clamping order, if not can the defaulter still ask for proof of the order?

3a. Can the EA randomly clamp ANY vehicle that they THINK the debtor owns or has an interest in? To gain the £205-00 fee this attracts?

4. Will goods belonging to a 3rd party still be "protected"?

5. To protect the debtor from rogue auctions can they demand proof of the actual amount obtained at auction for the goods they lost?

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BA, do you know how often are clamping orders issued?

 

Although 'Clamping Orders' are rare they are one of the sanctions available to a Fines Officer under the Courts Act. There are a number of reason why they are rarely used.

 

Firstly, a 'Clamping Order' is specific to an actual vehicle and a DVLA search (as you will know) is not confirmation of vehicle ownership but is confirmation only of the vehicle 'keeper'. Also, DVLA searches would not be able to ascertain whether the vehicle could be 'exempt' and in particular....used by a disabled person and displaying a Blue Badge.

 

Secondly, with a Warrant of Control the individual officer has the same 'power' under the warrant to 'clamp' the car without the need for the Fines officer to make his own enquiries.

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Since this fee schedule is maybe live now for all intents and purposes does this now put an end to the saying that Courts fines/recovery fees are not payable by the debtor?

 

Also does this mean that the debtor is FULLY responsible for the fees from now on and ARE recoverable once enforcement action has started.

 

Finally will this put an end to paying in the foyer and online to avoid those fees accrued after the point a warrant of control has been issued I.E. paying the fine in full once you have had the NoE through your door?

 

 

Thank you MM.

 

Parliament amended legislation on 6th April 2014 to enable all debts (magistrate court fines, road traffic debts, liability orders etc) to be enforced using the procedure outlined under Schedule 12 of the Tribunals, Courts & Enforcement Act 2007 and its secondary legislations; The Taking Control of Goods Regulations 2013 and The Taking Control of Goods (Fees) Regulations 2014.

 

Accordingly, the enforcement of magistrate court fines has the identical statutory fees as all other debts and this has been in place since 6th April 2014.

 

On the question as to whether debtors will continue making payment of the court fine (without bailiff fees) direct to the court, the simple answer is that some debtors will continue to do so but the number of cases where this happens has significantly reduced over the past couple of months and it is my understanding that all courts are now forwarding direct payments to the relevant enforcement company so that the EA can properly deduct the Compliance fee (of £75) and apportion the balance on a 'pro rata' basis (approx 60% towards the court fine and 40% towards the balance of bailiff fees) in accordance with the regulations.

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The Secretary of State has also granted permission to extend each contract by a further one year.

 

A copy of the amendments to Schedule 4 and Schedule 5 outlining the changes to the statutory fees that each company may charge to fine defaulters is shown below.

 

Very good post BA this clears up the 'myth' that the said fees have not been approved by parliament

 

PS: To see the revised fee scale it will be necessary to scroll down to page 3 of the attached.

 

 

Very good post BA this clears up the 'myth' that the said fees have not been approved by parliament.

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Very good post BA this clears up the 'myth' that the said fees have not been approved by parliament.

 

Would you like to bet on that ?

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

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I can answer this one HCEO's. If memory serves me correctly they were an admin fee of £85 and a one off enforcement fee of £215.

 

Thanks Coughdrop. I'm guessing the bailiff companies contracted with this kind of work will welcome the new fees especially given the ability to add a Sale Stage fee of £110 on some cases.

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