Deposit help! Refusing to pay me.

[feedthefrog]

Just after some advice please, its all a bit complicated so I apologise in advance.

 

 

 

I have had no end of trouble with my estate agents, they have refused to give me bank details to pay rent, so when we went to their office (an hour away) and paid cash we asked for receipts, they said they can't issue them there and then and would post them, they never came. This was the first time I had rented and I didn't know any better. In July this year I emailed them about a problem with the property, sewerage was leaking under the house and the smell was awful, we had the council out numerous times but nothing was sorted. I threatened court action and was then served with a Section 21 Notice on 27th August which ended 16th November, the landlord's reason was he needed us out to sort the problem. We contested this and it then changed to because of rent arrears even though I didn't know about any. Apparently in April 2014 my rent went up by £156 a month but we weren't informed, no paper work was given to us and no one said anything when we went in to pay rent.

 

We moved out on 13th November 2014 and were planning to return to the property on 15th November to get the rest of our things, my partner moved everything on her own as I work away, and she home schools our 3 children so we decided I'd move the sofas, cooker etc. When I went to the property with a man and a van, carpet cleaner and someone to paint the walls the locks had been changed and a notice saying 'we have reason to believe you have abandoned the property so we've changed the locks' on the door and in the window. I don't know where they got that from because rent was still being paid weekly and no one had attempted to contact me or my partner.

 

 

 

I rang a solicitor for advice who said its a grey area because we've got a place to stay but its with family, so we're not homeless. They told me to ask for my things back so I emailed them and asked to be let in to get my stuff and tidy the place up, they said no, we've taken pictures and you're not allowed back in. I was looking at my deposit protection certificate and noticed we paid our deposit on 27th August 2012 and it was protected on 8th October 2012, 42 days after it had been paid. On the letter it says it has to be paid within 30 days. I emailed the estate agents (also attached a photo of the certificate) who said their records show it was paid to My Deposits on 27th August 2012 and I'm basically lying. They then ended the email by saying 'a residential tenancy is not as secure as a commercial one, and you don't have any legal rights as you would with a commercial tenancy'. I have no idea why he said that, but I emailed back with a notice before action letter saying I would take the landlord to court. Estate agents said I can try all I like because rent arrears and the property having things in still would make me lose the case. I emailed back asking him to forward the email to the landlord as its for him, not the estate agent.

 

On 27th August I get an email saying the landlord has agreed to pay my deposit back to me. I sent my bank details and then had another email saying they won't give it me until I have sent them a council tax bill for my new property. I don't have one because I'm living with family at the moment. I have a feeling this is the estate agents and not the landlord. I've found out also that because of the deposit not being correctly secured that the Section 21 was void, and I need to be let back in to the property and the eviction process started again because essentially they have let themselves in to my home, changed the locks and kept my stuff. I don't want this. I just want my money.

 

 

What can I do now? How do I get them to pay me? Everything I have said I can prove through emails. I have been trying since 30th August to pay the rent arrears at £140 a week but the landlord refused my offer and demanded £500 cash that same day, which I said no to because they wouldn't give me a receipt. How do I go about getting my money back? I'd prefer to not go down the court route because then I'd have to take time off work, which I really can't do. Can I go through My Deposits? Or will that fail due to the landlord not letting me pay the rent arrears and my things still in the house? I was still charged for the man and van, carpet cleaner and decorator, which I can prove. I've lost a lot of possessions but right now, I want to cut my losses and just move on from this nightmare. I have given them my mum's address but its not good enough apparently.

 

Would just like to add, the agent we are dealing with now is not the agent we signed up with. Original agent went bust in 2013, this agent then took over. We first had a AST, and never received any paperwork when it went on to a rolling contract (not sure if this is of any importance but Shelter thinks it is).

 

Thanks in advance, and sorry for the essay!

[raydetinu]

rent increase cant be valid if you were not notified about; they should of issued a s13 which you could challenge and has your rights!

Ask for copy of AST you signed if you have not got one. ( court would assume it was anyway )

What is rent arrears from, just this increase or missed payments?

It looks as though you will have to threaten court action to get anywhere.

It also sounds like an illegal eviction to me! ( possessions still there ). They cannot repossess without a court order! so you could have legally forced entry when you went back!

Have you informed deposit scheme that you have moved out and you want deposit back?

[feedthefrog]

Thanks for the reply. We never got any S13. I've asked for a copy of the tenancy agreement but they said it would cost be £150 + VAT! I'm not paying that. It says on my deposit protect certificate it was an AST, the original tenancy agreement is at the old house in a file along with all our birth certificates, passports etc.

They're from the increase in rent, I've never missed a payment. When ever I went in and paid they said things like 'paying in full, thank you. We'll post your receipt'.

I've already threatened court action, I sent them a notice before action letter, the reply back was 'our records show your deposit was protected on 27th August', my reply was a picture of the protection certificate, their reply was 'landlord has agreed to pay you but unfortunately, you won't be getting it until we have utility bills and a council tax bill proving your new address'. Am I right in thinking that they can't withhold it from me like this? Think I have read somewhere that once the amount of money has been agreed between me and LL then he has 10 days to pay me. Is the email from the estate agents the LL agreeing to the amount to be paid, which can be used as evidence for me? This is so stressful

No I haven't informed them, I was under the impression from the estate agents that the LL informed them? Can I send them a copy of the email saying the LL has agreed to pay me the full deposit back? Will that help? Thanks so much for the help, its really appreciated.

Thank you.

[raydetinu]

yes contact scheme and raise a dispute, anything from LL can be used.

As I said rent increase sounds invalid! and illegal eviction; you gain a lot if you went to court! ( not sure you would get far with the late protection though, depends on judge, but would certainly add to list of claim.).

Suggest you write again to LL, copy to agent stating above and give them 7 days to respond, with deposit and compensation, give amount you want.

When have you paid rent till?

I suggest you may still able to force entry even now as they have not got legal possession.

[mariner51]

I would not force entry at this time on basis T is still in operation, they could charge rent until you give valid Notice.

Sounds like you did not inform LL/LA you intended to vacate on expiry of s21.

Just arrange a mutually convenient time to remove all your belongings from property

LA/LL prob used MyDeposits insurance deposit scheme. A complaint to scheme would require LL to lodge deposit amount with scheme and pot delay return to you.

You have several strong bargaining points eg illegal eviction? no s13 served, in your favour, to negotiate favourable settlement with LL

[raydetinu]

M51 you are right, however LL and agent do not seem to be reasonable in their approach up till now and will probably deny any liability that they have done anything wrong!

OP will have to force their hand in some way to get things moving!

[Lea_HTH]

The 'rent arrears' if only relating to the increase in rent, aren't valid and no court would enforce it as a rent increase needs either your agreement, your payment, a notice served in the appropriate format, or the signing of a new tenancy agreement. None of which occurred.

 

Secondly, there is no ability to correct the late deposit protection, so you are entitled to go to court and make a claim for non-protection and request the judge to make a penalty payment (judge will decide whether it will be one, two or three times the deposit amount, dependent on a variety of things). The LL may counterclaim for the alleged rent arrears, but as per the above paragraph, he's very unlikely to succeed.

 

Thirdly, LL or agent are not entitled to demand anything from you before repaying the deposit - make a claim direct to the scheme it is protected in. Deposits should be repaid 10 days after you move out.

 

Fourthly, I have no idea why the solicitor made the assumption that because you were not homeless that there was no illegal eviction - he/she is wrong. If the end date on the notice was 16th November, you were entitled to have access to the property until that date at midnight. So changing the locks sooner than that is unequivocally an illegal eviction - whether you have somewhere else to stay is neither here nor there. See another solicitor, one that specialises in possession (more likely to have dealt with illegal eviction). However be forewarned, any monetary gain from such is likely to be very minor...though that may increase by the subsequent unlawful holding of your possessions.

[raydetinu]

we all seem to concur that you will be wise to pursue court action if they don't come to their senses!