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    • just to be clear here..... the DVLA do not send letters if a drivers licence address differs from any car's V5C that shows the same driver as it's registered keeper.
    • sorry she is a private individual, the cars are parking on her land. she can clamp the cars. only firms were outlawed from doing it bazza. thats what the victims of people dumping cars on their drives near airports did and they didn't not get prosecuted.    
    • The DVLA keeps two records of you. One as a driver and one for your car. If they differ you might find out in around a month when they will send you a reminder as well as to your other half for their car. If you receive nothing then you can be fairly sure that you were tailgating though wouldn't explain why they didn't pick up your car on one of drive past their cameras. However even if you do get a PCN later then your situation will not change. The current PCN does not comply with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4 which is the main law that covers private parking. It doesn't comply for two reasons. 1. Section 9 [2][a] states  (2)The notice must— (a)specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates; The PCN states 47 minutes which are the arrival and departure times not the time you were actually parked. if you subtract the time you took to drive from the entrance. look for a parking place  park in it perhaps having to manoeuvre a couple of times to fit within the lines and unload the children reloading the children getting seat belts on  driving to the exit stopping for cars pedestrians on the way you may well find that the actual time you were parked was quite likely to be around ten minutes over the required time.  Motorists are allowed a MINIMUM of ten minutes Grace period [something that the rogues in the parking industry conveniently forget-the word minimum] . So it could be that you did not overstay. 2] Sectio9 [2][f]  (ii)the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver, the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid; Your PCN does not include the words in brackets and in 2a the Act included the word "must". Another fail. What those failures mean is that MET cannot transfer the liability to pay the charge from the driver to the keeper. Only the driver is now liable which is why we recommend our members not to appeal. It is so easy to reveal who was driving by saying "when I parked the car" than "when the driver parked the car".  As long as they don't know who was driving they have little chance of winning in court. This is partly because Courts do not accept that the driver and the keeper are the same person. And because anyone with a valid motor insurance policy is able to drive your cars. It is a shame that you are too far away to get photos of the car park signage. It is often poor and quite often the parking rogues lose in Court on their poor signage alone. I hope hat you can now relax and not panic about the PCN. You will receive many letters from Met, their unregulated debt collectors and sixth rate solicitors threatening you with ever higher amounts of money. The poor dears have never read the Act which states quite clearly that the maximum sum that can be charged is the amount on the signs. The Act has only been in force for 12 years so it may take a  few more years for the penny to drop.  You can safely ignore everything they send you unless or until they send you a Letter of Claim. Just come back to us if they do send one of those love letters to you and we will advise on a snotty letter to send them. In the meantime go on and enjoy your life. Continue reading other threads and if you do get any worrying letters let us know. 
    • Hopefully the ANPR cameras didn't pick up the two vehicles, but I don't think you're out of the woods just yet. MET's "work" consists of sending out hundreds of these invoices every week so yours might be a few days behind your partner's. There is also the matter of Royal Mail.  I once sold two second-hand books to someone on eBay.  Weirdly the cost of sending them separately was less than the cost of sending them in one parcel.  So to save a few bob I sent them seperately.  One turned up the next day.  One arrived after four days.  They were  sent from the same post office at the same time! But let's hope I'm being too pessimistic. Please update us of any developments.
    • New version after LFI's superb analysis of the contract. Sorry, but you need to redo the numbering of the paras and of the exhibits in the right order after all the damage I've caused! Defendant's WS - version 4.pdf
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Orange data roaming charged - what to do?


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Hi all,

 

here a quick overview:

 

My fiancee went to the Philippines, and

once there turned data roaming on.

 

Apparently it was not possible to call or text with it turned off, and

 

she wanted to be available in case of an emergency (me and our son stayed here in the UK).

 

She got a text from Orange with information about the usage - £8 per MB.

 

She thought it would mean 8p per MB and left data roaming on (she remembers the text saying £?8).

 

The result were several texts from Orange about data usage which were ignored as she was swamped with other texts

and busy first arranging surgery and later a funeral as a result of it. I.e. it was a pretty distressing trip for her.

 

The result of data roaming being on and apps running in the background (they were not actively used) was a usage of 200MB = £1600.

 

I realise that a good part of this is our fault, but I do not regard £1600 as an acceptable price to pay.

£8 per MB is far removed from their costs,

from the value of the service to us etc.

 

Also, their own data packages are cheaper by multiples (the same amount of data paid by packages would be about £240).

 

We've called Orange,

but the call center didn't want to amend the bill,

now we emailed them (executive office, customer service) as well, asking to amend the bill.

 

The direct debit is due soon, and I'd prefer the issue resolved before that date...

 

Questions:

 

1) Considering that there have been texts, what is the best way forward for us?

2) What is the best way to deal with the impending direct debit payment? I want to solve this as amicable as possible, and don't want to go down the route of cancelling the direct debit, getting additional charges etc.

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For your benefit and to avoid further charges, CANCEL THE DD...

It will be better because you can reset it back up after all this has been sorted out...

 

You've sent an email to the execs office? Well id say that it might be an idea to wait and see what happens with that.

This was once on Watchdog... "BillShock" as it known.

 

any charges you do get charged if you dont cancel the DD you should claim back from orange.

Do you still have the original texts?

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For your benefit and to avoid further charges, CANCEL THE DD...

It will be better because you can reset it back up after all this has been sorted out...

 

You've sent an email to the execs office? Well id say that it might be an idea to wait and see what happens with that.

This was once on Watchdog... "BillShock" as it known.

 

any charges you do get charged if you dont cancel the DD you should claim back from orange.

Do you still have the original texts?

 

 

I can pay the DD, so if I let if go through no further charges should come. I am just not sure if/how I'd get the money back if there'd be a solution for us.

 

The texts are gone, the Missus deleted the whole batch at some point (too many well wishing/condolence texts to read through she said). The call center people read the texts from Orange to me, so I have an idea what was in them.

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One thing to prepare yourself for is the that they will probably not agree to the 'bill-shock' defence due to the text messages that were sent. From my understanding, the following texts are sent:

 

- when data is first used a text gets sent advising how much data is, what bundles are available to buy and how to buy them

- at various increments of data use a text is sent advising how much has been charged so far

- when £51 has been used then data is barred and a text sent advising that a limit has been reached and the service restricted. To lift this cap then you'd reply to the text as instructed to remove the bar and continue using data.

 

From the last point, does your wife remember receiving the barring text and did she text back to specifically reactivate the data roaming?

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  • 1 month later...

Thanks for that. I looked on the other providers' websites, and they all have that cap in place, some at £40 some at £42.50.

 

So I paid the bill including a £42.50 data roaming charge, leaving £1557.50 data roaming charge unpaid.

 

I sent a complaints letter according to EE's Complaints Code of Practice as well, but didn't get a reply.

 

Today then an email from the executive office that they won't budge. I replied with above link, stating that I am not willing to pay more than these £42.50, and asking if there is any other option than CISAS.

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Bugger. It seems she did actually opt in. She thought it was 8p, not £8, and sent a text to 6640 (she also deleted the texts, so I can't verify that, but it's what EE says anyway).

 

Is there any point in going to CISAS with this or is there no way around paying £1600 for misreading a text?

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Your best bet now is to ask them to lower the amount as a gesture of goodwill in the circumstances, with the option of proceeding to CISAS if they refuse. Still worth going down the CISAS route as it is free for you but will cost Orange, so they might be more willing to reach a goodwill agreement rather than fork out for defending via CISAS.

 

The other option is to take it on the chin and not pay. This will then be a mark on your credit file for 6 years plus some usual chasing letters from debt collection agencies. So you have to weigh up whether this route is worth it or not.

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  • 1 month later...

Ok, it is with CISAS now, and EE put in their defence - a long list of points, essentially saying that it's all our own fault, they adhered to law and their T&C etc, i.e. we have to pay the full amount. I am not sure how to reply. Should I go both routes (a) ask to consider the situation of my fiancee/beg, b) argue the price is too high/usury, it's outlawed in Europe for a reason), or concentrate on one? What will CISAS be looking for in my reply?

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  • 3 weeks later...

EE didn't provide enough evidence that they warned sufficiently about the removal of the data cap and that they got permission from my fiancee to do so.

 

They did provide evidence that my fiancee accepted their offer of a 10MB bundle, but they didn't include a text in their defence that stated clearly that accepting this offer would remove the data cap. The one text EE included in their defence was a sample text about a travel bundle, but a different travel bundle than the one my fiancee accepted, so it was unclear what the relation was to the issue at hand.

 

I have no idea what was texted, as all texts were deleted by my fiancee when she was still in the Phils, so the issue depended on EE providing the texts that were sent and received.

 

Not sure why EE didn't provide more texts - whether it was sloppiness in their defence, or if there were just no texts with regards to the removal of the data cap.

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  • 1 month later...

They could be collecting on behalf of EE. Either way, a swift curt letter explaining that EE's legal team have accepted a CISAS decision and cancelled the bill, so please explain their involvement and the basis of their demand. Also add you expect either confirmation that they have withdrawn their claim or a copy of their complaints procedure. Orange also deserve a kicking and a demand for an explanation - with a copy of the DCA demand & the email attached - maybe sent to their MD.

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