Mortimer/MCE - claimform very old Direct Car Finance - ***Time Order***

[AndyOrch]

WS is okay amac...if you could confirm...is it 2 claims forms same number or one with both your names as defendants?

[amac31]

Yes thanks Andy, it is two claim forms with the same claim number so I have prepared 2 versions one with my name and one with my wifes name and I have also prepared 2 separate bundles for court and 2 separate bundles for the claimant.

Does the statement need tweaking or is it fine as is? Obviously the original has all of the relevant dates and other information correctly filled in.

[AndyOrch]

Thats fine amac

[amac31]

Ok thanks for your help lets see what happens now. Should I contact MCE to ensure we exchange documents at the same time so as to not give them an advantage?

[AndyOrch]

Not really...I doubt you have anything to disclose that they are not already in possession of.

[amac31]

URGENT HELP NEEDED!

 

 

We are due in court next week and today we have just received a copy of the alleged terms and conditions from Credit Acceptance Corporation.

 

 

Mortimer Clarke claim that they assumed that they were included in the previous copies of the agreement.

 

 

They say that they have been provided with a copy of the standard terms and conditions

and that they have been instructed that these would be the terms and conditions that would have been applied to our account.

 

 

Firstly

the copies they have sent have sentences missing from the bottom of each page because of the way that they have been copied

 

 

most importantly they have now issued a revised witness statement to try and disprove everything we said in our witness statements,

 

 

how can this be fair ?

 

 

they have read ours and adjusted theirs to suit.

 

 

They said that they would submit them to the court in time for the hearing

 

 

how is this legal given that the time scale for submitting statements has elapsed?

 

 

Really need help big time with this because we cannot let these muppets win.

[dx100uk]

scan then up please

 

 

'standard' T&C's don't wash

they must have YOUR name and address on them to show they were served with the agreement

[amac31]

Ok will do tomorrow.

 

 

How are they allowed to submit another witness statement? surely this makes a mockery of the system?

 

Lorrymans case was exactly the same as ours yet his was discontinued because they could not provide any terms and conditions

 

but they miraculously find them for ours.

[amac31]

Here are the Terms and Conditions exactly as sent to us.

[dx100uk]

it says 'the borrower named herein'

 

 

nowhere does it state your name

 

 

could have been from anywhere even a filing cabinet.

[amac31]

would those T&C's not have been printed on the back of the signed agreement so the borrowers name would have been on the front?

[dx100uk]

prove it

 

 

you cant they cant

[amac31]

Ok thanks, what about the second witness statement, are they allowed to do this?

[dx100uk]

not andyorch will have to answer that one

 

 

dx

[amac31]

Ok, hopefully he will pick up on this thread and get back to me.

[amac31]

has anyone got any idea if they are allowed to issue a second witness statement after the original deadline has passed?

[theoldrouge]

refer back to post #80

 

the t&cs they have sent dont match the default notices/ agreement:!:

 

as far as I can see

[amac31]

Sorry I must be missing something, could you please point out to someone who is a little bit slow how they do not match. Sorry for me not getting it.

[theoldrouge]

from post #80----

 

The default notices, very helpfully refer to "Provision of agreement breached,

Clause 2 which requires you to pay instalments at the time specified in the agreement" -------

 

and of course MCs t&cs now provided describes default under clause no5

[amac31]

Ok thanks for pointing this out, I need to make some notes for the hearing.

[AndyOrch]

Responding to your RP amac

 

On arrival at the hearing just inform the court that the claimant has served a further revised WS out of compliance time and without your agreement and assume without the courts...and that you request that only their original WS be inadmissible as you know its has been drafted after receipt of yours and places you at a disadvantage.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[amac31]

Ok thanks for that,

I thought it was a bit unfair given that we did not receive it until yesterday

and the hearing is in a few days.

 

 

Why would they have done this if they knew it was not allowed?

 

 

They have named it witness statement 2 and have also included a revised bundle with the alleged terms and conditions included.

 

 

They claim that they had assumed that they had sent it to us even though they send the same documents 6 times and never once included it.

 

 

How come they have suddenly come up with them when Lorrymans case was discontinued because they could not provide them?

Edited January 18, 2015 by amac31
additions

[amac31]

Court day tomorrow, any tips or pointers?

[AndyOrch]

Keep calm...dont let your emotions run away with you...listen and ask questions.......and remain cool and polite.

 

Oh and best of luck amac...please update your thread with what transpires...good or bad.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[amac31]

Well I think this is a victory,

 

 

the judge would not allow a judgement as MCE could not prove their case conclusively

but as we were also unable to prove our case conclusively

the judge would not dismiss the case completely.

 

 

What he did do was to make MCE reduce the total amount by nearly half including all costs

and then he made an order ( similar to a Tomlin order but not a Tomlin order ).

 

 

He said due to the time elapsed a judgement would be inappropriate

he has allowed us to pay £1 per month and ordered that there are no entries with the CRA's

and if we do not keep up with the £1 per month MCE could get a CCJ by default.

 

 

He also added to the order that even if we default and they go for a CCJ

they can still only recover the new lesser amount less any monies paid .

 

 

The barrister for MCE even agreed with the judge in the end and hoped that MCE would just write off the debt completely

because at £1 per month it would take them nearly 1000 months just to recover the court fees and her fees.

 

 

She thinks that later down the line they will probably do this anyway.

 

 

I am a bit annoyed that as we believed we did not owe this debt that we now have a new debt for over 3k

 

 

but on the other hand I think MCE have come of worse than us as £1 per month is nothing

and no entries to our credit files is a bonus.

 

 

We would like to thank everyone on here for the advice

and a donation will be made next week on payday.

Edited January 21, 2015 by amac31
grammer