Penalty for lacking GSC

[gsc-cert]

Hello Friends,

 

My current contract started on 01-Dec-2011 and ended on 30-Nov-2012. Subsequently I have been on rolling tenancy on monthly basis. I am moving out on 31-May-2013.

 

My LL had not protected the deposit and only after I pressed him did he protect my deposit on 15-Nov-2012, which means a delay of nearly one year. My LL has been very nasty to me. I stayed at this placed for five years, took good care of his property and still he is a nagger. He has not got me the GSC either. I want to pull him to the court for delay in protecting my deposit and claim compensation.

 

What is the best way to do this? Will the fact that he did not get Gas Safety Check done in last two years help build my case?

 

Many Thanks for your reply.

 

Regards

Edited May 8, 2013 by ngrv

[mariner51]

Lack of GSC may demonstrate LLs knowledge of his Stat obligations but an action for deposit non-protection should be decided solely on whether LL protected deposit and provided PI within required time. The level of LL culpabilty and subs penalty will be decided by Judge. As this is a clause 8 action, ther is only one CC route avail & it can be expensive to initiate with high pot costs for loser.

[gsc-cert]

As this is a clause 8 action, ther is only one CC route avail & it can be expensive to initiate with high pot costs for loser.

 

Mariner51, Many Thanks for your reply.

 

What is the maximum that I could lose if I were to go to the county court? The LL did not obtain GSC despite my request/reminder to have it done. He said that he will get the GSC done only if I enter into a fixed term contract. He has got GSC done only once in last five years.

 

Also The LL did not protect the deposits for last four annual contracts and for the latest contract he has protected the deposit but only after I chased and chased. So my deposit was protected but delayed by 11 months. Can he get away if he has protected, late though?

Edited May 9, 2013 by ngrv

[samderby]

To comply with the localism act 2011, he would have had to protect the deposit by 5th or 6th May 2012. As he has failed to do this, he has certainly breached the act. You can claim compensation between 1 and 3 times the deposit amount, however it would not be a SCC. You can now also start the claim up to 6 years after tenancy has ended. To start, you need to fill in an N208 form, provide evidence that the deposit amount was paid and also that it was registered late. The hearing fees for these cases however are in excess of £1000, so your total court costs could be in excess of £1500. Of course assuming you win, you can claim these costs from him as well. The lack of a GSC is a seperate matter and one that I'm afraid I know very little about. I do believe though that it is quite serious, not sure if it will help your case for non protection of the deposit.

[gsc-cert]

Thanks Samderby, Did you have a personal experience of this. Just asking as you sound quite familliar

 

How can I press for the maximum penalty? I was thinking of using lack of GSC certificate to demonstrate the nature/personality of my LL. Can you suggest what are the points which can help me to press maximum penalty. He has not protected my deposits for last four annual contracts. Will this help maximize the penalty?

 

Thanks

Edited May 9, 2013 by ngrv

[samderby]

Thanks Samderby, Did you have a personal experience of this. Just asking as you sound quite familliar

 

How can I press for the maximum penalty? I was thinking of using lack of GSC certificate to demonstrate the nature/personality of my LL. Can you suggest what are the points which can help me to press maximum penalty. He has not protected my deposits for last four annual contracts. Will this help maximize the penalty?

 

Thanks

Nishant.

 

I don't have personal experience insofar as going to court. However I have read everything I can find on the issue available on the internet, including the government legislations, and had a nice chat with a woman at shelter about it. I am moving out of my current rented house very soon and my deposit is not protected, hence the reading up

I don't think the fact that your deposit has not been protected in the last 4 contracts would really matter...Up until the localism act came into effect last year, many landlords got away with non-compliance simply by securing the deposit before the hearing, nullifying any charges. That is no longer the case however.

I was advised by shelter that a judge will tend to award the maximum fine unless there have been issues with rent payments etc. I have been unable to find any recent cases though, since the localism act came into effect, all of the successful cases I have found date before this.

I would advise though, due to the high costs of the hearing, to at least have a one-time chat with a solicitor, as while I can provide advice on what I have found, I am by no means an expert and would hate for you to act upon any perhaps wrongly given advice and lose a case.

[raydetinu]

You can fill out a form on the HSE site regarding the lack of GSC and they will follow that up with LL.

[mariner51]

ngrv, you won't be able to sue for non-protection for any tenancy that ended before 5 Apr 2012. Before that date, non-protection could not be pursued once that T ended. To date I am not aware of any Localism Act binding precedents. So max 2 unprotected deposits, poss 1 if Judge decides same deposit not protected for 2 years.

 

You can't press for maximum penalty, it is entirely at Judge's discretion.

 

In addotion to high initial Court fees and instructing a solic (£1500 sounds reasonable), if you lose you will be liable for LLs uncapped defence costs. The only persons likely to make money will be the lawyers.

[gsc-cert]

Hello Samderby, I tried calling Shelter but could never get beyond the menu which asks me to press zero. So just thought of asking you weather I could be liable for uncapped defense cost? Is there any organisation which can help me sort such questions.

[samderby]

If you lose the case, then you are indeed open to the defendants costs in this type of case.

This is why I would suggest professional legal advice to ensure you have a case.

In my interpretation, your deposit should have been secured no later than 6th May 2012. This wasn't the case, so you should win any case without even trying.

However, my interpretation may be wrong, and as I previously said, I would hate for you to go into a losing battle after what I've said.

[gsc-cert]

Samderby, Thanks for your reply. Which court will I have to go, if not in SCC ( Small Claims Court ).

[gsc-cert]

In addotion to high initial Court fees and instructing a solic (£1500 sounds reasonable), if you lose you will be liable for LLs uncapped defence costs. The only persons likely to make money will be the lawyers.

 

Hello Mariner51, Why do you think I could lose the case? The evidences to be produced in court for civil cases need to be disclosed in advance by both defendant and claimant, There cannot be any surprise for either of the parties in the court: Isnt't it? I will know about the strength of LL case very well and proceed accordingly.

[mariner51]

I didn't say I thought you would lose, just ponting out the risk IF you did.

s8 cases are heard in full County Court, not the SCC pathway.

 

Also the first two tenancies may be diregarded as they concluded before April 12.

[gsc-cert]

Thanks Mariner, Agreed that the previous tenancies will be disregarded but I am sure giving this information to judge will help get the maximum penalty awarded to me.

 

Also the LL tried to rent out my garage to one of the other tenants without taking my approval/informing me. Presenting this info should help me get the 3x penalty I suppose.What do you say?

 

Also thanks for the pointing out the risk but with the additional points ( lacking GSC and trying to rent out the garage which was mine) , should I still worry about losing. What kind of points LL could make to mitigate his side? The rent has been being paid within one week of start of month for last five years.

Edited May 10, 2013 by ngrv

[samderby]

It's very hard to say, without any recent published cases, how and when judges scale the fines.

All I know is what shelter told me - If you have been a good tenant and always paid your rent on time, not destroyed the place etc, you should be awarded the maximum amount. But until I see a case since the localism act came into legislation, it is very hard to say.

[gsc-cert]

My landlord never handed me the GSC. Is there a way to find when was the time he got GSC inspection done ? Are GSC certificates also stored with any third party organisation as well?

[gsc-cert]

Hello Friends,

 

What is the minimum penalty HSE can impose on LL for not having GSC?

 

Thanks

[mariner51]

You have already raised GSC in earlier thread. Forum etiquette is one Tenancy, one thread, this way full background to Q is avail without duplication.

[dx100uk]

two threads merged

please keep to ONE thread per issue

 

dx

[gsc-cert]

You have already raised GSC in earlier thread. Forum etiquette is one Tenancy, one thread, this way full background to Q is avail without duplication.

 

Apologies Mariner for starting another thread. I thought as this a different kind of question altogether, it is better to have a separate thread. Apologies once again.

 

Coming back to the original question: How does HSE decide the amount of penalty for non compliance with GSC legislation?

[gsc-cert]

My landlord protected the deposit quite late: Given this, I understand that I can claim up-to three times the monthly rent. Are there other items that I claim, say for example - the expenses incurred in maintaining the property cleanliness and state of repairs. If so, how can do that?