Statutory interest applied to judgement debt

[Borris the Bold]

Hi,

 

I read articles, threads etc. all over the internet about CCA 1974 provisions and that how statutory interest cannot be applied to post judgement debt relating to this act.

 

However,

 

I've just received a settlement figure which has had 8% slapped on it!

 

I've just called the solicitors in question and they informed me that the debt was over £5,000

and and that because it had been through the court system and made final (my understanding of the explanation given),

any CCA 1974 provision was overruled and irrelevant.

 

Please could somebody put me out of my misery and explain what is going on.Many thanks for any assistance.

Edited November 8, 2012 by Borris the Bold

[AndyOrch]

Hi Borris and welcome to CAG.

 

If the Claimant requested section 69 interest within their Particulars of claim on a claim over 5K then they are entitled to add 8 % up and until judgment.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Borris the Bold]

Hi Andy,

Many thanks for your reply.

 

You say 'up' and 'until', so I'm assuming after judgment this interest cannot be applied.

It's really shocking because I was quoted by solicitors representing Robinson Way & Co Ltd. £21,635.59

which differs somewhat from that on the original Court Charging Order, which is £12,294.03.

 

I believe that it is only the amount shown on the final charging order that must be paid to clear a restriction.

 

Kind regards,Borris

[AndyOrch]

Post judgment interest can apply if it is within the terms and conditions of the credit agreement...but it wouldn't be 8% that is for sec69 only.Its only the amount on the judgment that must be paid to clear the restriction.

So whatever the £9341.56 is....is a figment of their imagination.

[Borris the Bold]

Post judgment interest can apply if it is within the terms and conditions of the credit agreement...but it wouldn't be 8% that is for sec69 only.Its only the amount on the judgment that must be paid to clear the restriction.

So whatever the £9341.56 is....is a figment of their imagination.

 

Sorry Andy what is sec69?

[AndyOrch]

If you are claiming for a fixed amount of money, you can also claim interest on the amount outstanding. This is usually referred to as 'section 69 interest'.

 

If both parties are businesses and the debt relates to a commercial transaction, then it may be more appropriate to use the provisions of the Late Payment of Commercial Debts Act. This allows for a higher rate of interest and for additional debt collection charges. Details can be found at http://www.late-payment-law.co.uk. Do not use this, if either you or the claimant is a private individual.

 

To claim section 69 interest you first have to work out the total amount of your claim - excluding interest and court fees. You are entitled to claim interest at 8% per annum on this amount. Work out the 'daily rate' by multiplying 'the amount of your claim' x 0.00022. You also need to count up the number of days from when the money became due up to the date on which you issue the claim. Multiply the daily rate by the number of days to work out the 'interest so far'. Then drop each of these numbers into the following paragraph:

 

The claimant claims interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% a year, from [date when the money became due] to [date of issue of claim] of £[interest so far] and also interest at the same rate up to the date of judgment or earlier payment at a daily rate of [daily rate].

This paragraph should then be included in your particulars of claim, probably as the last paragraph.

[Borris the Bold]

Thanks Andy for this information.

 

 

It was for a Capital One loan.

 

 

 

Final Charging Order

 

On 6 October 2009, DISTRICT JUDGE HAYES sitting at Norwich County Court, The Law Courts, Bishopgate, Norwich, Norfolk, NR13 1UR

 

heard The Representative for the Claimant and the Defendant not attending

 

and the court orders that

 

1. The charge created by the order made on the 29 June 2009 shall continue.

 

 

2. The interest of the defendant in the asset described in the schedule below stand charged with payment of the sum of £12,294.03 the amount now owing under a judgment or order given on 06 April 2009 together with any further interest becoming due and £218.00 the costs of the application.

 

3. The costs are to be added to the judgment debt.

 

4. The Claimant has agreed not to apply for an Order of sale for so long as the Defendant pays £5.00 per month to the Claimant in respect of the judgment debt.

 

The Schedule

 

The address of the land or charged property is XXXXXXXXXXXXX the title to which is registered at H.M Land Registry under Title No. XXXXXXXX.

[AndyOrch]

2. The interest of the defendant in the asset described in the schedule below stand charged with payment of the sum of £12,294.03 the amount now owing under a judgment or order given on 06 April 2009 together with any further interest becoming due and £218.00 the costs of the application.

 

3. The costs are to be added to the judgment debt.

 

4. The Claimant has agreed not to apply for an Order of sale for so long as the Defendant pays £5.00 per month to the Claimant in respect of the judgment debt.

 

The Schedule

 

The address of the land or charged property is XXXXXXXXXXXXX the title to which is registered at H.M Land Registry under Title No. XXXXXXXX.

 

 

 

 

You will need to check the terms and conditions Borris the above high light does not look favourable...check for anything with regards to Post Judgment interest.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Borris the Bold]

2. The interest of the defendant in the asset described in the schedule below stand charged with payment of the sum of £12,294.03 the amount now owing under a judgment or order given on 06 April 2009 together with any further interest becoming due and £218.00 the costs of the application.

 

3. The costs are to be added to the judgment debt.

 

4. The Claimant has agreed not to apply for an Order of sale for so long as the Defendant pays £5.00 per month to the Claimant in respect of the judgment debt.

 

The Schedule

 

The address of the land or charged property is XXXXXXXXXXXXX the title to which is registered at H.M Land Registry under Title No. XXXXXXXX.

 

 

 

 

 

You will need to check the terms and conditions Borris the above high light does not look favourable...check for anything with regards to Post Judgment interest.

 

Regards

 

Andy

 

Hi Andy, thanks for getting back to me. So I need to be looking for the original loan agreement terms and conditions at the time, which was 2004 and not in any court documentation?

[AndyOrch]

Hi Andy, thanks for getting back to me. So I need to be looking for the original loan agreement terms and conditions at the time, which was 2004 and not in any court documentation?

 

Yes your T&Cs at signing and also the Particulars of Claim from the summons.( re post judgment interest)

 

 

 

Andy

[Borris the Bold]

Yes your T&Cs at signing and also the Particulars of Claim from the summons.( re post judgment interest)

 

 

 

Andy

 

Yes that does sound scary: "...with any further interest becoming due...", but i read somewhere in this forum I think that this is standard text and is often abused by the creditors. If I cannot get hold of the original agreement/T&C (back in 2004) or the summons particulars, should I request them from Robinson Way & Co? I'm sure they won't have them or want to hand them over. They may also stall for time!I see poor folk get excited when they read variations of the text: statutory interest cannot may be added to debts under £5,000 or that are CCA regulated, only to find that it is possible if it states so in certain documents.

Edited November 8, 2012 by Borris the Bold

[AndyOrch]

The summons would be vital to check the wording of the cliam..if there is no reference to statutory interest then it can not be added to the claim.

 

Its important though you under the difference here Borris...statuary interest 8% can be added to any claim over 5k Irrespective of the T&Cs or the agreement.Your dilemma would appear to be post judgment interest which whether referred to in the P.o.C or not can be added if its within the t&cs of said agreement...there is a difference.Hence the need to see sight of said agreement.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Borris the Bold]

The summons would be vital to check the wording of the cliam..if there is no reference to statutory interest then it can not be added to the claim.

 

Its important though you under the difference here Borris...statuary interest 8% can be added to any claim over 5k Irrespective of the T&Cs or the agreement.Your dilemma would appear to be post judgment interest which whether referred to in the P.o.C or not can be added if its within the t&cs of said agreement...there is a difference.Hence the need to see sight of said agreement.

 

Regards

 

Andy

 

Thanks again Andy for the assistance. Would the creditor have these documents or should I start by contacting the court for the summons?

[AndyOrch]

The Court should have a copy of the summons assuming you have not retained yours.The T&Cs/Agreement would be with the Creditor (OC) again assuming you have not retained your original.

[Borris the Bold]

The Court should have a copy of the summons assuming you have not retained yours.The T&Cs/Agreement would be with the Creditor (OC) again assuming you have not retained your original.

 

Okay thanks. The originals are nowhere to be found, which is foolish on my part. I better get on and ask the creditor, which will be fun to say the least. What should I do if the creditor has not go them or refuses to give copies to me? Are there any standard letters in CAG that I could use for this exercise to save a bit of time?Many thanks, Borris

[AndyOrch]

Data Subject Access Request should flush out the T&Cs and statements/data but rarely the agreement..there is afee of £10 and they have 40 days to comply.Because there is a judgment now they may not respond to a section 77 request (CCA) fee £1 but worth a go to see they may respond.

Send both recorded delivery.Both templates are in the library.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[AndyOrch]

in the meantime some information :- http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/consumer_credit/oft1002.pdf

[Borris the Bold]

Data Subject Access Request should flush out the T&Cs and statements/data but rarely the agreement..there is afee of £10 and they have 40 days to comply.Because there is a judgment now they may not respond to a section 77 request (CCA) fee £1 but worth a go to see they may respond.

Send both recorded delivery.Both templates are in the library.

 

Regards

 

Andy

 

Okay, I'll give it a go and see what turns up. Again, thanks a lot for your time. I'll report back with my findings!

[paulwlton]

A section 77-79 request should be sent - You need sight of the original t&cs. if they fail to provide said they are precluded from enforcing any interest charges.

 

Regards

[Borris the Bold]

A section 77-79 request should be sent - You need sight of the original t&cs. if they fail to provide said they are precluded from enforcing any interest charges.

 

Regards

 

Hello Paul,

 

Thanks for further assistance. I'm getting worried now because I'm holding everybody up in the chain. My conveyancer is just doing his job, which is to write to the solicitors of the creditors for final settlement figures in return for an RX4. We have had two figures back. One is under 5k and is fine, the second as you can read has had 8% slapped on it and I want to contest it, but with limited supporting documents and time. The third and final CO is a joke, Shoosmiths acting for Egg Banking plc passed on or sold the debt recently and did not know who had took it on (wasted two weeks). Today we were told it was Barclays, so my conveyancer has written to them. Shoosmiths gave me a settlement figure a year or so ago for a sale that unfortunately fell through. However, the figure matched that stated on the CO, which was fairplay by Shoosmiths, but now I bet Barclays or their solicitors will add 8%. Now these creditors know there's a property being sold, they'll just sit back and wait.

 

I need to ask these two creditors or their solicitors how are they claiming statutory interest, i.e. under the terms of an agreement, terms and conditions or a court summons, am I right in thinking this?

Edited November 8, 2012 by Borris the Bold