Capital Bank Loan 1997 - Statutory Demand by Connaught / 1st Credit

[lisaclaim]

Hello

 

Will try and summarise..

. if I miss anything please let me know but would be so very grateful of any advice on what to do now.

 

Capital Bank Joint Personal Loan £5,481.20 outstanding taken out in 1997

It got transferred to Wescot Credit years ago and we had no communication with Capital Bank Direct at all.

It went to Legal & Trade Collections before Wescot and also a solicitors

but we adamantly paid the minimum and had been paying £40 a month to Wescot for a long time but not paid anything since beginning of 2009.

 

April 2009: received a letter with 'Your Annual Personal Loan Statement Agreement No: xxxxxxxxxxx for the period 01/10/2008 to 23/02/2009.

It shows a statement opening balance as at 1/10/2008 and then 3 payments october, november and december 2008 with a statement closing balance.

 

Had never received a statement before that at all.

Nothing shows even to this day on Experian

 

2nd May 2009: Sent a CCA

17th May 2009: Sent a failed to respond letter account in dispute

 

22nd May 2009: Received a reply from Capital Bank dated 20th May 2009

thank you for your statutory request for information in respect of the above Loan Agreement.

Please find enclosed a signed copy of the executed Agreement.

 

Thats it and then a 2 page agreement which can be viewed here

 

Page 1

http://i39.tinypic.com/jayh3p.jpg

 

Page 2

http://i42.tinypic.com/20ubd04.jpg

 

 

At the beginning of the year 2010

got a statement and then another one in February 2010 which is just a general statement showing what we owe and what was paid.

There are no charges on the account and no interest been applied.

 

 

13th August 2012

My husband got a letter dated 13th August 2012 (my name not on although a joint account):

 

"We are writing to notify you that Bank of Scotland PLC has assigned all of its respective rights,

title and interest in respect of the above referenced accouint (including the outstanding balance) to 1st Credit (FINANCE) 5 LIMITED, effective 31st July 2012."

 

.... plus more just stating that they are managing the account and we have to contact them to organise payment on the account as a matter of urgency.

 

There was also an 'Account Assignment' attached stating balance now due and to contact them to agree repayment options etc. etc. etc.

 

28th September 2012:

Today my husband received a Statutory Demand under section 268(1)(a) of the Insolvency Act 1986, Debt Liquidated Sum Payable Immediately - Form 6.1

 

Any advise would be much appreciated as read on a number of forums that Connaught always send these out and not worth anything then some forums saying that houses could be possessed ! if over £2,000 so take it seriously.

 

Also my name is not on anything it is always my husband although the original loan was a joint personal loan.

 

Many thanks in advance

Edited September 28, 2012 by Sidewinder
Edited out personal name

[lisaclaim]

Hi..

. I have just read a thread in these forums which looks like discouraging me to act with regards to the statutory demand.

 

Below is an excerpt from an excellent post

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?162131-Statutory-Demands-and-Service-By-Post(1-Viewing)-nbsp

 

but I am still unsure as to whether to take the statutory demand seriously.

 

It was delivered in the normal post and not signed for.

 

It does name the course but underneath that in bigger bold black lettering it says to contact 1st credit.

Please can anyone advise

.Many thanks in advance.

 

I hope I did not put anyone off responding due to the long initial message.

 

I just wanted to make sure you had all the facts to be able to help me.-------------------------

--What does this all mean?

 

The service rules are not something new to debt collectors.

They know this rule well.

The reality of the situation where a debt collector sends out a SD in the post is that he has absolutely no intention of petitioning the court for bankruptcy.

 

He has no intention because

[1] to present a petition involves his putting up serious money up front and into court

(currently, September 2008 - court fee on presentation: £190.00, deposit: £415.00,

plus fees to process server and solicitor on the hearing of the petition, p

erhaps another £750.00ish), and

 

[2] if the petition succeeds,

the debt collector ceases to have any further control over the collection of the debt.

 

On the contrary, the debt collector wishes to retain control of the debt's recovery as cheaply as possible.

His modus operandi is therefore to send out the scariest looking piece of paper imaginable in an envelope stuck to which is a second class stamp.

 

If the debt collector genuinely intended to pursue the debtor by bankruptcy,

was committed to paying the fees and losing control once a bankruptcy order had been made,

he'd ensure he complied with the service rules from the outset and would not take any short cuts which would frustrate that genuine intention.

It is an abuse of the process of the court and harassment to send out a statutory demand by post with no intention of relying on it in bankruptcy proceedings.

 

This sort of practice once cost a creditor its Consumer Credit licence (Credit Default Register Limited, licence number 0154753 terminated 5 May 1993).--------------------------------

[ken100464]

Lisaclaim

 

I think you need to get this thread moved to legal as you could be being missed here.

 

I cannot help as I am not an expert but I have alerted the site team that this thread is perhaps being missed

 

Best of luck

[dx100uk]

moved to legals

 

dx

[lisaclaim]

Lisaclaim

 

I think you need to get this thread moved to legal as you could be being missed here.

 

I cannot help as I am not an expert but I have alerted the site team that this thread is perhaps being missed

 

Best of luck

 

 

Thank you so much... I wondered why I wasnt getting a response

[ken100464]

Lisaclaim.

 

Not sure why you are not being picked up by the site team. Would suggest you hit the black triangle and put a short sentence this is a 1st Credit SD. Help requested or something like.

 

I cannot help or advise except that this is not something to ignore as 1st Credit from what I read tend to be the real thing. I am hoping not but best to get someone with more knowledge than me to help you

 

Good luck

[42man]

1st Credit are usually serious about taking people to bankruptcy..

...when was the last time you paid anything towards this debt ?

 

Have you sent off a CCA request ?

 

A SAR to the original creditor might also be a good idea to check for charges potentially missold PPI etc...

 

...I think sending them an email similar to this one may help,

usually at the sign of a dispute 1st Credit drop it....

 

- http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?367061-statutory-demand-under-section-268-1st-credit-finance%282-Viewing%29-nbsp

 

- If they do not respond then you should be ready to set aside.

[lisaclaim]

1st Credit are usually serious about taking people to bankruptcy.....when was the last time you paid anything towards this debt ? Have you sent off a CCA request ? A SAR to the original creditor might also be a good idea to check for charges potentially missold PPI etc......I think sending them an email similar to this one may help, usually at the sign of a dispute 1st Credit drop it.... - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?367061-statutory-demand-under-section-268-1st-credit-finance%282-Viewing%29-nbsp - If they do not respond then you should be ready to set aside.

 

 

Hi

 

Thank you for your reply... we have not paid anything since beginning of 2009

 

2nd May 2009: Sent a CCA

17th May 2009: Sent a failed to respond letter account in dispute

 

22nd May 2009: Received a reply from Capital Bank dated 20th May 2009

thank you for your statutory request for information in respect of the above Loan Agreement.

Please find enclosed a signed copy of the executed Agreement.

 

Thats it and then a 2 page agreement which can be viewed here

 

Page 1

http://i39.tinypic.com/jayh3p.jpg

 

Page 2

http://i42.tinypic.com/20ubd04.jpg

 

to be honest not sure if I have anything to put forward as a reason to set aside

 

hope someone can advise. many thanks

[42man]

I'm no expert on enforceability but I can't see any notice of cancellation rights prescribed by the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices And Copies Of Documents Regulations 1983).

 

Have you checked the statements to ensure the interest rate is correct as in Kotecha vs Phoenix ?

[lisaclaim]

Hello... there is no interest on any of the statements we have received. They have not charged us any. Please help anyone otherwise I may just have to ring them to arrange a payment as I do not know if I can do anything else.

 

Thanks in advance again

[lisaclaim]

Please can someone help on this. Also note that Capital One failed to respond to the original request within the allocated time period of 12 days that is why I sent another request to them so basically they cannot pass the debt to someone else ? and not chase for the debt?

 

Is that correct. I sent the letter that is on this site for when a company fails to send the credit agreement within the allocated time.

 

Thanks

[42man]

Unfortunately they have now supplied the agreement....whether they didn't supply it on time will not make much difference. Unless you want to get into a battle about unenforceability of agreements, or if there is any potentially missold PPI or a large amount of charges, then it may possibly be the best thing to make a repayment plan with them.

[lisaclaim]

Thanks... I sent them an email yesterday after seeing that someone else did so on this site as just wanted to get an answer. The email went something like this:

 

We do not acknowledge any debt to you or any other company or organisation that you claim to be representing

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Acc/Ref No xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

You have contacted us regarding the account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by ourselves, by way of a Statutory Demand ref xxxxxxxx.In the 'Particulars of Debt' you state that you have attempted to recover the amounts outstanding by telephone and letter collection methods. We have not received any letters from 1st Credit or telephone calls so we are unsure what you are trying to imply. This statutory demand is the first contact since our letter on the xxxxxx2009 as below and attached.

Since this correspondance we have sought professional advice from a National Debt Organisation, and are acting on their advice.

 

We do not acknowledge any debt to you or any other company or organisation that you claim to be representing. We would also like to point out at this stage, that you contacting us, you phoning us, or us contacting you does not indicate acknowledge of an alleged debt case law shows clearly that this can only be done by written acknowledgement by us or payment by us, providing either of these actions occur WITHIN the six year time frame. If these occur outside of the 6 years, that does not unbar a debt (See Halsbury's Laws of England for applicable case law).

We had had numerous letters from varying debt collection agencies with regards to this debt so on the xxxxxxxxxxx2009 we sent a letter (see attached) requesting a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account number together with any other documentation of the Act required them to provide.

They failed to comply with our request and as such the account entered default on xxxxxxxxxxxx2009 so we sent another letter on thexxxxxxxxxxxxxxx2009.

Please see the attached two letters that we sent.

We had not received a reply at all and received no true copy of a credit agreement.

The limit expired (exceeded the 12 working days for a request) and as you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

Because of this failure to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it consequentially any legal action pursued will be averred as both UNLAWFUL AND VEXATIOUS.

Please see attached letter sent on xxxxxxxxxxxfor further statutory information sent.

We hope you can shed some light on this for us and look forward to your speedy reply.

---------------------------------------------

Any ideas on if and what there response might be or am I wasting my time waiting and better ringing them to make an arrangement ?

Thanks

[42man]

You mention 6 years....is there a gap of 6 years (5 years in Scotland) where you have not made any payment towards the debt at all ? If so then it will be statute barred

[lisaclaim]

hi, it was beginning of 2009 so not statute barred

[lisaclaim]

Hello... Just wanted to confirm I suppose it better I ring up and offer a payment plan! Please can someone confirm if there is anything else that may be done. I fully understand if not just want to be sure before I ring them.

 

Many thanks again

[42man]

You can of course dispute the amount...PPI, charges etc....so say that until you get the results of the SAR then you consider it to be in dispute. Only talk to them on the phone if you record it though....otherwise put it in writing

[lisaclaim]

Hi

 

Does that mean I have to do this SAR - what is it ? I also found a letter dated 13th August from Bank of Scotland stating that they had assigned all of its respective rights, title and interest in respect of the account to 1st Credit, effective 31/7/12

 

I am pretty sure never had PPI

 

Thanks

[lisaclaim]

Sorry can I just ask as well the date on this statutory demand is 26/9/12... do I have 18 days from that date as it is getting close and I am thinking of contacting them. I don't want to be cast as bankrupt as that is scary. What will they do now. How do I stop them from carrying on with this. Please thanks

[lisaclaim]

I found details on SAR on this forum... if I send this via email will that put a stop on them continuing or do I have to go to the court and ask them to set aside because I am disputing (but on what grounds):

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

 

ACCOUNT/REF NUMBER: xxxxxxxxx (or multiple numbers if more than one account)

 

 

Please supply me with copies of all the data which you hold on me in relation to any matter and in any form and for any period of time.

 

 

 

Please note that I require disclosure of any personal data which you hold on me for the entire period of my dealings with you.

 

This Subject Access Requestis includes - but is not limited to any data you hold about me in respect of any matter and held in any form including notes, screen notes, recordings, internal correspondence and external corresppondence.

 

 

I enclose the statutory maximum fee of £10. You have 40 days in which to comply.

 

 

If there is specific information which you require in order to satisfy yourself as to my identity, please let me know by return.

 

If I do not hear frm you then I will assume that this Statutory Request is satisfactory and that the 40 day timescale has started.

 

 

 

Yours faithfully,

[lisaclaim]

Please could someone reply this mornin on how i can put a stop on this statutory demand. If i cant then that is fine. First credit did not respond to my email. I will hav to ring them this afternoon if no response on this forum as 18 days just about up. Thanks

[AndyOrch]

Hi Lisa responding to your PM

 

I can only endorse what 42man has already advised ....if there is is no dispute/ or miss sold PPI/ unfair charges and you have been supplied with a copy of the CCA then your only option is to speak to them today and arrange a suitable affordable payment plan.

 

Im sorry I can't offer any other advice,.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[lisaclaim]

hi all. spoke with first credit today and recorded the call. just asked them to respond to the email I sent them on the 9th... in the email, posted earlier in this thread, I had noted no response with regards to me requesting the credit agreement. They are going back to Capital One to see if they can get a copy of the agreement. I also got recorded that this Statutory Demand is on hold until they get back to me regarding the agreement. So let's see, may be only a delay but giving it a go. Thanks again all I will keep you updated

[AndyOrch]

Well done Lisa lets see what transpires.

 

Andy

[lisaclaim]

Well done Lisa lets see what transpires.

 

Andy

 

Thank you Andy... will do