DWP Interview Under Caution

[sinkinghelp]

Hello all

I am very new and came across this site trying to find answers. I am retired through ill health and have recently moved in council property as our home is soon to be re possessed. I have just discovered that my Incapacity Benefit has been suspended with no letters warning me and I have now been told by telephone that I am to be interviewed under caution along with a fraud investigator from our local council. A letter will be sent out within the next two to three weeks informing me of the date.

I have phoned and asked everywhere and it seems unless you pay I am unable to find anyone to attend the interview with me. CAB have had funding cut here so resources no longer available and I have phoned every other type of group for help.

I have disclosed everything I have to but the issue is that I failed to disclose a very old ill health pension from the 1980's. When I made my claim in 2005 I was distincly told that it was a 1980's pension and it was to be disregarded. I did disclose the pension formally in 2008 to the court when I was declared bankrupt when the insurance companies failed to honour the claim I made because I had a propensity for illness. Dont laugh that was their excuse

The HMRC have always deducted the right amount of income tax and were fully aware of my benefits.

I am sorry to have waffled on but I really do not know where or what to do next. I have gone round locally everyone I can think of.

Has anyone any experince - guidance - on what to do next. please ?

 

[sinkinghelp]

Hello its me again....I have now had very little sleep and the whole family are walking on egg shells. I still cant find anyone who has any knowledge about these matters and I hoped that someone here may be able to help. I am going to try the CAB again next week in case a different advisor may have some information or direction in which to go. My Incapacity Benefit is still suspended and now the council are going to suspend my housing and council tax benefit making liable to pay the full amount.

I really am desperate and any advice would be helpful.

thanks

[honeybee13]

Hello there, welcome to the forum.

 

I'm sorry you haven't had any replies yet. It could be because what you're asking is fairly specialised and many of us won't know the answer. There are a couple of people who might know and I've seen them around in the last few days, so hopefully they will spot this.

 

I'm one of the ones who don't have experience of investigations, but I have a couple of questions that might be relevant please. Can you prove that you were told in 2005 that a 1980s pension would be disregarded? It was an actual pension was it, and not an ill-health insurance policy? But then I thought IB wasn't means-tested, maybe one of our experts could confirm if I'm right?

 

Is this what they've said they're investigating?

 

I'm not sure whether the DWP would see information from a court case or your tax return. That sounds very 'joined up'.

 

I hope more help will be along for you later.

 

My best, HB

[sinkinghelp]

Hello honeybee13 - thank you so much for the reply. I cant prove at the moment that the conversation took place but as I disclosed the information on my HC2 application - HMRC - the court when I was bankrupted its not like I have not disclosed when asked. I was bankrupt in 2008 as the payment protection insurances gave the excuse for non payment because I had a propensity for illness not covered under the policy. Strange they did not say that all the years I was paying into their schemes.

I have had many phone calls over the years with DSS/DWP and they are usualy not followed up by letter. Over the past two years I have received amongst my documents other claimants personal papers. Birth certificates - payslips - court orders - including some really personal stuff. I used to phone and tell them and post back but of late I just get them to send me a pre paid envelope to return the items. I have tried to obtain on how often I have done this returning documents so I could at least show they do make mistakes but they denied it ever happens and terminated the call.

 

So - once again thanks for the reply and hopefully someone comes along who has some experience on what I could do next.

 

Our local court yesterday sentanced a 68 year old to 10 months who failed to declare a small army pension !!!!! I dont know the full information but it was headlines on all the local radio stations here Recently a prolific burglar got community service....

 

regards

 

sinkinghelp

[Messydesk]

Write and appeal against the decision to suspend your benefit and ask for a Statement of Reasons. Do the same if your CTB and/or Housing Benefit is suspended. If you have appealed in the case of CTB they cannot take recovery action whilst an appeal is ongoing. Make sure everything that you do or say from now on is in wiriting or backed up with a letter and ask the various bodies to do the same. I think you might have case for challeneging the PPI decision but its not my area of expertise. Remember that to commit fraud, you have to be proven to have deliberately set out to defraud . Incapacity Benefit is not means tested, so if they are trying to recover something, you must also get a means tested benefit like Pension Credit or Income Support - Is that right? Sadly disclosing anything to the Official Receiver doesn't mean the information will get to the DWP.

[sinkinghelp]

Hello Messydesk

 

Thank you for the reply. I used to get £0.10 ( ten pence ) a week Income Support and a further small payment monthly towards our mortgage before we were re housed in a disabled bungalow about 3 months ago.

 

On the telphone they said Incapacity Benefit is not means tested but anything over £85.00 in pension the Incapacity Benefit is reduced.

 

When I applied for a HC2 I am sure then I disclosed both pensions but I have phoned and asked for a copy of that application which was about 3 - 4 years ago and they said that nothing can be released as I am under investigation. I explained I needed this towards my defence but they just kept repeating that they could not supply anything.

The interview under caution is the next major hurdle and finding someone who knows the routine to advise would be very helpfull.

I cant afford a solicitor and the CAB did not seem to be able to help but I am going back with a copy of the interview details.

 

I will write and make an appeal against the decision to suspend my Incapacity Benefit and ask for a Statement of Reasons.

 

Thanks very much it is very appreciated

 

I also get DLA High mobility and Low care. That will be the next thing they attatck I bet.

 

kind regards

 

sinkinghelp

[kk3852]

A quick google shows that all new claims for Incapacity Benefit from 2001 were affected by payment of a private pension. Anyone who received a pension over £85 a week would have their Incapacity benefit reduced.

 

It really doesn't matter if you have correctly declared your pensions on an HC2 form (as that goes to the people who deal with free prescriptions) or to the HMRC (as that is the tax office)...it matters whether or not you declared them on your claim forms for Incapacity Benefit and if the local council are involved - on the claim form for HB/CTB. There is a specific question on the claim forms which asks about pensions from other sources and it depends on your response on that form whether or not a fraud case would be considered.

 

I'm not sure who you are asking for the return of your HC2 form but if that it the DWP Investigation team - they will not have it.

 

There is no right of appeal against a suspension of benefit, the right of appeal comes along when a decision is made on your claim and that will be done after you have been interviewed. Your benefit has been suspended as they cannot allow any overpayment of benefit to continue and increase.

 

I've just realised that you said that you also received income support - again there are specific questions on that claim form which relate to pensions from other sources, income from other sources where a private pension should have been declared.

 

Not much help for you I know but saying that you have reported pensions to other government departments isn't really going to help. The DWP/LA will have the claim forms which presumably show that you have not declared them on the benefit claim forms.

[sinkinghelp]

Hello KK3852

 

Thanks for your reply. I was trying to just explain that I have declared to other departments my pension and that I had no intention of defrauding anyone. It was a result of a conversation with DWP that I was told that as I was awarded an ill health pension in the 1980's it would be disregarded for the purpose of calculating benefit from about 2007 onwards when I could no longer work through more serious illness of which I am still suffering. The mental torture this is causing is horrendeous both to me and my family add to the mix of house repossession its becoming difficult to cope any more

 

Carefully looking at your response it would seem that as I had nothing in writing about the disregard I am well and truly stuffed.

 

I just do not know what to do now that is for sure.

 

kind regards

 

sinkinghelp

[jabba jones]

Can you remember how you claimed benefit in 2005 or 07?

Did you fill the forms in yourself or do it over the phone?

[sinkinghelp]

Hello jabba

 

I was medically retired in 1999 and in late 2000 I started work again. I remained in full time work no claims until late 2005 when the wheel partialy fell off again and I was sometimes claiming I think but in 2005 I made full claims over the phone as it was the start of when they did all the interviewing over the phone which is why I firmly believe this is when I was told.

 

It is very difficult to put information together as I have nothing to reference it too

 

I also returned to full time work and came off benefits at some point but I need to find out dates. My illness and personal circumstances have left huge gaps in my memory which will only fuel suspicion when I am interviewed.

 

I have received some council tax benefit for some time but housing benefit for 3 months.

 

Incapacity benefit on and off over the past 4 years I think - but not sure same with Icome Support

 

The more I wright the more even I can now see how bleak this looks.

 

I definetly need help to go through what paperwork I have to put dates together.

 

But looking at what kind people have said it looks like its cut and dried and that I will be judged guilty because of what has happend.

 

regards

 

sinkinghelp

[sinkinghelp]

Well having spent over a week now worrying my self stupid and looking at the misery this is causing my family I am at a dead end. The way they calculate how much benefit you are alledged to have had as compared to what you actualy have received is mind blowing - how on earth do they achieve some of the totals ?

 

All the court reports I have come across no one ever seems to win at all. The punishments handed down seem so aggresive and punative compared to other offences. All to do with public money I expect

 

And before anyone says taxes - I have always paid tax on both my pensions ! and I have worked full time for the past 34 years...

 

Anyway I will go back to CAB and see what they can suggest as last time the advisor I got was well out of his depth

 

thanks for the replies so far

 

kind regards

 

sinkinghelp

[Messydesk]

One thing I would do is get all the papers that you have together. Then put each benefit or other matter in its own file, in date order. It really helps!

[MIKEY DABODEE]

Being a ten pence claim for mortgage purposes this means you were on I.S.

 

I dont know the full rules for disregarding pensions on IB but what I can see the goolge search already made sounds correct.

 

Your problem I think maybe with your I.S claim.. It would appear they may have no occupational pension on your claim by the sounds of it. Did Income Support send you a review letters for the uprated pension award every April, if not then, no, they didnt know. I.S is a means tested benefit so the pension would have effected your help with the mortgage..

 

A pension is an income for I.S purposes there is no disregards and its taken in pound for pound into account

 

I think as you have been paying tax on your pension then this has been maybe picked up in a GMS match and this is how they have found out.

 

Being on I.S means you would have got full housing benefit so hence their interest

 

What happened to the house with the mortgage?

[Messydesk]

I have been thinking - it couldn't be that they think you are no longer eligable for Incapacity because they think you have been working - or that you are not as disabled as you say. Occasionally people reort other people even when there is no basis. It couldn't be anything like that could it?

[sinkinghelp]

Hello Mickey dabodee

 

Its just a total nightmare. The house is still up for sale but having reduced it to £84,950 for quick sale it was reduced again for to £68,000 for an even quicker sale but the folks coming forward have problems with deposits and or credit related stuff. Developers offer us around £43,000 to £48,000 tops. I am three months in arrears and the interest and charges that are going onto the account is huge. I have tried asking for help from the mortgage company but as we were on a reduced interest only payment for two years they dont wnt to go any further.

 

MESSYDESK

 

No not been working. Would love to be well enough to work but not going to happen with my ailments. I think that is one of the major problems going back to work so soon after being seriously ill.

 

regards both

 

sinkinghelp

[sinkinghelp]

Hello again

I have been trying to sort dates and trying to get my head into gear - but one thing that keeps popping up is my bankruptcy in 2008. I was dealt with in 2008 and declared bankrupt. So has the DWP got more power than the High Court and go back beyond 2008 if they want to. One of the debts dealt with by the bankruptcy was the local council community charge. Can they also now bring that back up ?

I know this is a difficult question and I have tried to look it up on the internet but I cant seem to find an answer that fits the question.

It has been suggested to me that the DWP interview will go back as far as their records allow them to and basically try and shake the tree and see what falls out. My friends terms not mine !

So has anyone have any experience PLEASE as to whether the DWP have to stop at bankruptcy or can they go beyond.

thanks in anticipation

kind regards

sinking help

[sinkinghelp]

Hello all

 

I still have not received any letters from the DWP and have exhausted all avenues for help where I live for someone to attend with me when the Interview under Caution takes place. Until that happens I cant do any more what so ever I dont think. The bankruptcy date and the issue's I cant find out if the DWP can go beyond that so hopefully when and if someone comes along they may have an idea

 

regards

 

sinkinghelp

[kk3852]

I have never heard of the DWP only going as far back as a bankruptcy - they will not be aware of a bankruptcy and as far I as am aware the only thing that they are interested in is whether or not benefit has been paid correctly or whether there has been an overpayment.

I will stand to be corrected if necessary but it doesn't seem very probable to me

[sinkinghelp]

Hello kk3852

 

Thanks for the reply. The DWP do know as I did tell them and the council and sent them the various court notices etc. I have just read on another site that between 2006 and 2007 the DWP tried to claim from 65,000 claimants overpayments which had been made but were as a result of various DWP errors. The Supreme Court made a ruling stopping the DWP from issueing county court proceedings

 

So mistakes are made and to tell me that they do not make errors at all does seems quite wide of the mark

 

thanks again

 

regards

 

sinkinghelp

[Messydesk]

With regard to the Interview Under Caution - which part of the country do you live in? If they are saying you have committed fraud, that comes under criminal proceedings and you can get a solicitor on legal aid - its one of the few things that you still can. If not, you always have the option to say nothing at the interview and/or take a friend or relative with you.

[sinkinghelp]

Hello Messydesk

 

Thanks for the reply. I have approached a couple of solicitors who say that I cant get legal aid to pay for someone to sit along side of me in the interview under caution and only if and when it goes to court I may qualify but even then they were not sure. Its seems my occupational pension of £280.00 per month and the disputed ill health payment pension I get from the 1980's of £380.00 a month puts me over the threshold. I do pay tax on both as well.

 

Its the no knowing that is the problem. The whole family has been turned upside down

 

I live in Nottinghamshire.

 

Waiting for the postman everyday is just appalling and the lack of sleep and nightmares are just getting worse.

 

But I know what I was told and it seems I was told wrong. But I am not going to plead guilty even if the sentance is slightly reduced as I am adamant the DWP are in error

 

regards

 

sinkinghelp

[Messydesk]

If you were nearer I would come with you. However, I think you have two choices. If you are over the threshold for legal aid, then it might still be worth paying for a solicitor. Otherwise, you have to go along and not answer questions. This would at least give you an idea of what they are waning to know from you.

[sinkinghelp]

Hello messydesk

 

Thank you for the reply and the offer to come into the interview with me is really so kind. The solicitors localy all want £160.00 plus vat and one solicitor bless him said he would send someone from the firm for £90.00 plus vat instead of the usual charge.

 

However whilst it is important it is just as important that I provide for my family and I cant put that sort of money together

 

Thank you once again and the postman has just gone by so unless he has missed me it looks like nothing today.

 

One glimmer of hope now dashed is that a local welfare rights centre may have had someone experienced to come with me but due to funding cuts now cant help until after the 9th of January 2012 and they will look at it again

 

I keep saying I must stop looking at court reports on the internet but I have yet to find anyone who has pleaded not guilty and it be upheld in court.

 

thanks again messydesk

 

kind regards

 

sinkingfast

[sinkinghelp]

Hello All

 

Well something very strange has happened today. I went to the bank to check the account and I have been paid Incapacity Benefit !!!!! I thought this is a trap - sorry but that is how low I am feeling.

 

Nothing in todays post re the interview - also the Incapacity Benefit was a normal payment and it should have been reduced to take into account the reduction cuased by my second pension.

 

I think this just highlights the mess

 

regards

 

sinkinghelp

Edited November 30, 2011 by sinkinghelp

[Nystagmite]

I seem to remember that benefits are paid in arrears. So your IB would be for the date 2 weeks ago.