Advice/Guidance- Bought a Faulty Car **Updated**

[Top Dog]

Hi All,

 

I've just had a response from the trader in it he claimed that I travelled the distance for the car as I knew it was good value (which is incorrect as I paid £400 over the book price on the belief it was a 'stunning' car as described by him) and also the fact he gave me a good part -ex for my old car(admittedly he did £600 more than the book price, but other traders were also offering over book price valuations for part ex for their vehicles). Is this relevant?

 

He also stated that the car is 6 years old and has done over 100000 miles hence everything isnt as as new, which I accept, but that doesnt mean that I should have to accept his car with some faults (and these are big faults if they were small I would have have just taken the hit)?- esp as he did not disclose any?

 

He also talks of the fact hes already spent £600 repairing already and that he spent £250 on my part ex (well so I'm led to believe- I have no way of verifying this) and states that I was happy with the car when I took it back (which is incorrect he left the car at a petrol station to collect as the garage was closing and I needed the vehicle).

 

Finally he says he is willing to investigate the faults and discuss the findings with myself and it would be helpful if I can get something in writing to help point them in the right direction of where the faults are ( I suspect he wants me to conduct a further diagnostics at my cost-like I did before).

 

To be frank I am sick of all this - the car is sat on my driveway undrivable and has been for almost 4 weeks and I dont trust the guy as he doesnt seem like he is willing to repair the faults and wants to 'discuss' the findings.....

 

I want to now send him a letter to state that I am not satisfied with his response and will have the car repaired myself and sent him the bill. Am I still within my rights to ask for this? or Do I have to be seen as 'reasonable' and go back to him (200 miles away) even though I've already given him the opportunity to repair?- as he is offering to investigate?

 

Can someone help me with my letter if I post it here (I will remove any sensitive info)?

[BrazilianCCK]

Hopefully Sailor Sam will find his way here shortly as he is good on the letters.

 

As far as repairs go, you will be seen as within your rights to get the car repaired by your garage as you have already had the car to the seller for repairs that have not been succesful, the fact that the seller is some distance away and that the car is in your opinion undriveable - just be aware as mentioned before that in doing so you will be deemed to have accepted the car.

 

I'm sure you are aware that whatever the bill amount the seller will probably dispute at least some of it, but it would appear to be the quickest and least stressful way of resolving the situation, even if financially it may not end up being the most cost effective.

[Bookworm]

I've just had a response from the trader in it he claimed that I travelled the distance for the car as I knew it was good value (which is incorrect as I paid £400 over the book price on the belief it was a 'stunning' car as described by him) and also the fact he gave me a good part -ex for my old car(admittedly he did £600 more than the book price, but other traders were also offering over book price valuations for part ex for their vehicles). Is this relevant?

Nope, not one bit. He obviously didn't sell you the car under duress, so his statutory obligations remain intact.

 

He also stated that the car is 6 years old and has done over 100000 miles hence everything isnt as as new, which I accept, but that doesnt mean that I should have to accept his car with some faults (and these are big faults if they were small I would have have just taken the hit)?- esp as he did not disclose any?

Nail - Head.

 

He also talks of the fact hes already spent £600 repairing already and that he spent £250 on my part ex (well so I'm led to believe- I have no way of verifying this) and states that I was happy with the car when I took it back (which is incorrect he left the car at a petrol station to collect as the garage was closing and I needed the vehicle).

:violin:

 

Finally he says he is willing to investigate the faults and discuss the findings with myself and it would be helpful if I can get something in writing to help point them in the right direction of where the faults are ( I suspect he wants me to conduct a further diagnostics at my cost-like I did before).

and what happens when he doesn't agree with the findings? More time wasting...

 

To be frank I am sick of all this - the car is sat on my driveway undrivable and has been for almost 4 weeks and I dont trust the guy as he doesnt seem like he is willing to repair the faults and wants to 'discuss' the findings.....

 

I want to now send him a letter to state that I am not satisfied with his response and will have the car repaired myself and sent him the bill. Am I still within my rights to ask for this? or Do I have to be seen as 'reasonable' and go back to him (200 miles away) even though I've already given him the opportunity to repair?- as he is offering to investigate?

 

Can someone help me with my letter if I post it here (I will remove any sensitive info)?

 

No need for the sensitive info, I'll give you an outline and you can just add/tweak the relevant info yourself:

 

Dear Mr XXX,

 

Thank you for your letter dated [date].

 

I am rather disappointed in your reply, which doesn't address my issues as a buyer, which I detailed to you in my previous letter. Instead, you choose to go on how hard done by you have been, none of which is frankly my problem. MY problem is that I have paid a lot of money for a car which doesn't function properly, and that the trader who sold it to me seems to be dragging his feet when it comes to upholding my statutory rights.

 

So as to avoid further prevarications, let me set out clearly what I expect you to do:

 

a - to come and collect the car from [address] within the next 7 days, at your expense, and take it back to your garage/repair shop.

b - to carry out all necessary repairs, at your expense, promptly and properly, so that I am not inconvenienced for any longer than strictly necessary, AND that if problems arise (obtaining parts for example), you will keep me informed regularly with the reasons for the delays.

c - to return the car to me, at your expense, as soon as it is fixed.

 

Please note that none of the above is meant to be taken as behaviour consistent with having accepted the goods as defined under SOGA 1979 (as amended), but merely the chance for you to provide an adequate remedy. Should the car subsequently fail again, please let's be clear that I will have no hesitation in rejecting the goods and demanding a full refund, plus associated costs.

 

I understand of course that you have the choice of remedy, and if you feel that the cost of transport, repairs etc... exceeds the value of the goods, then you have of course the choice to refund me in full (including the part-exchange value of my previous car) and recover this car instead (I think we can both agree that a replacement, the 3rd choice of remedy, would be time-consuming, inconvenient and unsatisfactory for either of us). That is your right under SOGA and I await your decision in the matter, in either case, I expect a response from you detailing your chosen course of action within 7 days of this letter.

 

Should you fail to respond positively, then I will have no choice but to ask my local repairman to deal with the repairs, and will then ask you to pay for these repairs, as well as incidental costs such as hire car etc... through the court system if necessary. I point out that this will still not mean that I accept the car and should it fail again, I still reserve the right to reject and get a full refund from yourself.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

[sign]

 

 

*****************

 

 

Ok?

[heliosuk]

What beemer is it exactly and current mileage?

[Top Dog]

Thanks Brazilian/Bookworm your help is greatly appreciated, I will respond with the letter that Bookworm suggested which sounds good.

 

Helios- the car is a bmw 04 plate 320d m sport which had done 107k mileage.

[Top Dog]

Hi All,

 

I've just had my 3rd letter from the trader who states that its down to the consumer to bring the vehicle back to the dealer and states that if I was closer he would have borrowed a truck and bought it back...Do I have to take the car to him again as he is offering to inspect (not fix)? Even though I've taken the car to him before?

 

he then goes onto speak about how much of a good deal it was for me as he paid me £600 more for part ex of my old car against the book price (which is true) but he also had his advertised £400 above the book price, so it wasn't a bargain by any means....especially now its had all these faults....

 

He then talks of that he is a one man team and cannot provide the level of service I am requesting (ie to bring my car back to him)....-this maybe true but he has 15 cars for sale with the highest priced car at £15k (including a porsche) -not sure how relevant all this is.... Am I still within my rights to request this as he failed repairing the car successfully the first time?

 

He then states if the car is unsafe to drive now its obviously a wear and tear fault and not an 'inherrent fault' as I drove it back and it had an MOT at the time....

 

Hes asking me to bring the car back and he will diagnose and we will sort something out between ourselves amicably (I doubt he will from how hes approached the whole affair), he states he is sending all his correspondance to consumer direct to avoid future complications and he has now given me a 2nd opportunity to bring back the vehicle......Again do I have to take back?

 

Basically its a repitition of his previous letters and nowhere in the letter does it appear like he will repair the issues I have.....My concern is I believe this will end up in court and I dont want it to appear to the judge that I was being unreasonable (as the trader states hes now given me 2 opportunities to repair, even though his first one was not suficient), as I have been anything but and I have incurred the additional expenses with diagnostics/tracking/travel inconvenience etc....

 

Its been over a month and we seem to be arguing over points in the letters.....

 

Can someone help with a response to this?- I used Bookworms letter earlier which was great...Bookworm?

[Top Dog]

Hi All,

 

I sent the trader my final letter early this week stating I will seek a repair myself and want him to reimburse the costs also if I've stated this does not take away my right to reject the car should it develop a fault.

 

I've booked the car in BMW today for a diagnosis of the faults and it went in today.

 

Surprisngly I get a text from the trader today (hes been reluctant to discuss over the fone or by text in the past stating he wants to do it in writing) asking for exact odometer reading? and Asking for a pic? Whats this got to with anything??

 

Firstly I cant do this as its in the garage and secondly should I do this? (as hes been unhelpful in the past).

[Top Dog]

Hi all,

 

Latest update: I've had the car repaired locally and in total its cost me around £1200! (I've kept all receipts used different garages for diagnosis/repair and kept all the old parts). The trader has been in touch suggesting that I didnt give him an opportunity to verify the fault independantly to which I argued its been almost 3 months since I bought the vehicle yet you didnt do that he also suggested that even if I went to court I would get less than half what I paid??- is this true?

 

I've done some reading and it appears the trader can argue 'betterment' for the parts (ie new wishbone bushes/glow plug relay engine mounts) therefore do you think its reasonable if I offered to accept 75% of the total cost? (or should I accept 50%?)- I know this is subject to opinion but want to get a feel on what the average person would consider reasonable... ideally just want to get on with my life and not have this additional stress.....Even though half of me feels the trader shouldnt get away with what hes done.....but its been a stressful few months already and I've hated every moment of it....

 

If the trader refuses to pay (which I suspect he will) I will then send him a letter stating he has 14 days before I file for small claims action.....at this point can I charge interest on the amount claimed?-if so how do I work out how much to charge?

[Conniff]

It's certainly satisfactory for the dealer to fit used part, but to expect a 'real' garage to go hunting bits from breakers yards is over the top.

I think you will get all you ask for as you can argue that you have given him every oportunity to do the repairs and he failed to do so.

[Top Dog]

All,

 

Latest Update:

I've just submitted my claim via MCOL (yesterday) as I had not heard anything since my final letter however I just received a letter in the post today from the trader stating that the delay was a result in bad weather (prob true due to bad weather in UK recently).

 

He argued that even in the event he lost the case he would counter-sue me as my part exchanged car required some work that he had to do before selling, there was slight dent to the driver side rear which was obvious at point of sale and I pointed out to him....However he also claims it required new brakes, which I'm totally unaware of and he has receipts of the work he conducted? I've got no way of proving this other than taking his word for it.....Can he counter sue?- he goes on to say that I will end up with a CCJ which will affect me purchasing a property blah blah blah

 

He is then stating he would offer me half the price of the works if I sign a pre-prepared statement that I do not contact him if anything else is to go wrong with the car.....I am thinking of accepting on the basis the whole legal route is a headache and time consuming.....Do you think this is a reasonable offer and treat this as a lesson learnt (at least I get half of my costs back?).

 

Thanks all for your help in this so far....

[Top Dog]

Sorry its been a while since I last updated this thread but I've receieved messages which I haven't been able to respond to given my lack of posts to date :-S.

 

The outcome of my story was:- once the dealer received the summons he had his solicitor send me a letter and we reached an agreement where he paid for the bulk of the cost (tbh I should have held out for the whole amount but the whole drama was emotionally draining and I just wanted to move on).

 

Lessons Learnt- Don't let these traders shirk their responsibilities, they have legal obligations which they must fulfill. Don't let the whole court thing put you off too much (I would have had to travel to Northampton each time from london- which would have made it difficult). You must also be reasonable (ie if its a small cost not worth the whole drama/effort/cost). Also a bit wiser when it comes to repairs too .

 

Finally wanted to thank all that contributed to this thread and helped as tbh I would not have gone through with it if I didn't have the support/encouragement here and generally its made me more challenging (not just accepting it as 'tough luck') when things have turned faulty as a consumer (I often quote the SOGA!-the wife cringes everytime lol).

[Conniff]

I don't think I've ever seen such a time between updates before.

 

 

Thanks for coming back Top Dog and so glad the outcome was satisfactory to you.

[MrNumbskull]

Reading this post with interest as I am in a similar situation. In my case, the trader will not even acknowledge I have any rights in law.

 

Thanks for posting your result back, and well done for sticking it out. It is only with people like you prepared to make the effort that traders will think twice before ripping people off

[Conniff]

Reading this post with interest as I am in a similar situation. In my case, the trader will not even acknowledge I have any rights in law.

 

Thanks for posting your result back, and well done for sticking it out. It is only with people like you prepared to make the effort that traders will think twice before ripping people off

 

 

If you are interested in getting help to put right your problem, say so and I will give you your own thread and you can tell us your story.