We have so much debt, it seems only hope is selling house!

[Bigdebtor]

WC

 

Your thoughts are right - write back thanking them for their letter and telling them you had taken previous advice and contacted CCCS. The amount of £xx which JS have agreed by deed to accept as the new monthly payment amount is the amount worked out by CCCS. Tell them AGAIN you will ONLY comunicate in writing - and note they DO have the ability to send letters - so you are puzzled as to why they are insisting on telephone contact which makes you nervous and you have been advised by your GP to avoid undue stress - hence your insistence on writen contact only. Put your draft up for us to check as usual.

 

Did you get your doorstep visitor last weekend as promised?

 

BD

[Bigdebtor]

Just another thought for your reply. They say they cannot hold it long term without payment. You ARE paying and they have accepted the payments which accompanied your proposals in letters of xx. xx, xx etc.

 

Also they say "alternatively" contact CCCS etc. You HAVE done so - so even JS is saying there is no need to ring them.

 

BD

[wilchil64]

Thanks BD. My worry in this respect is that we cut the original payment to them by £100 to find that extra money for car repairs, tyres etc., as discussed above (months ago!), so they are no longer getting the pro rata amount. I could recalculate the whole lot and change the payments to the others, but they would all get less, obviously - how would that affect the two creditors who have agreed to lower payments? Arggghhh! Too complicated .....

 

No, they didn't turn up for the doorstep visit, although I think they tried to ring, but I don't pick up anymore, and tbh we aren't getting many calls at present.

[Bigdebtor]

I wouldn't worry about you reducing the amount and it not being pro rata. After all they didn't accept the first deal - so you were free to change it. If it becomes an issue later then you can re-calculate the amounts - but I have found once the principle of taking lower amounts and freeezing interest and charges is accepted by them then it is quite easy to get them to accept lower amounts a few months later (because YOU are then in charge) and the question of pro rata is never raised.

 

BD

[wilchil64]

Great, that puts my mind a little at rest, thanks.

[wilchil64]

Here's a draft letter to JS:

 

"Thank you for your letter dated xxx, the contents of which have been noted.

 

Further to your request that I contact your office by telephone to discuss the matter, I have consistently informed you that I do not wish to discuss this matter by telephone. My various letters illustrate that I am prepared, indeed anxious, to discuss the matter in writing and would counter it is Sainsburys who is refusing to have meaningful contact on this matter by insisting on telephone contact against my stated wishes.

 

Furthermore, I do not understand why you insist on me phoning, as anything agreed by phone would need to be subsequently agreed in writing in any case, and given the urgency that I assume you also apply to my situation I wish to avoid this further delay and go straight to a written agreement, which I thought I had already as you had banked my cheques sent with my proposals in previous letters.

 

You advised "alternatively" we should contact CCCS or other free independent money advisors you mentioned. We have however already taken your previous advice and contacted CCCS. The amount of £xx which you have agreed by deed to accept as the new monthly payment amount is the amount worked out by CCCS.

 

I note from your letter dated xx and previous written correspondence that you DO have the ability to send letters, so I am puzzled as to why you are insisting on telephone contact which makes us nervous. We have been advised by our GP to avoid undue stress, hence our insistence on written contact only.

 

You state in your letter that you cannot hold the account without payment for any extended period of time. However, I am making payments and you have accepted the payments which accompanied my proposals in my letters of xx, xx etc

 

Yours faithfully".

 

What do you think?

 

Thanks..

 

 

[Bigdebtor]

W

 

Excellent - You're getting bl**dy good at thsi letter writing lark!

 

Sock it to 'em!

 

Bd

[wilchil64]

 

Thanks!

I had the best teacher, you know!

[wilchil64]

Hi everyone,

 

We received the attached letter from Santander loans. Seems they're not prepared to accept a lower payment from us.

 

Background: used to be a Cahoot loan taken out April 2007 for 84 months.

 

We've told them in the past that we have contacted CCCS and filled in a budget form with CCCS online and worked out pro rata payments with CCCS.

 

Is there any chance of them accepting a lower payment in future, or should we now give up and go through CCCS for all lower payments on a DMP?

 

Up to now, 2 out of 7 creditors have accepted lower payments (altho one has accepted for just 3 months and then to review, one has said they will accept if we supply I&E, we have now sent an abbreviated I&E to that company in the hope they will then accept.

 

Also, today another creditor, the MBNA called my husband at work, but not on his extension - we don't know how they got the number or extension no. they called on but obviously want to avoid this happening again, as who knows who they will speak to. Am planning to send them the usual telephone harrassment template letter, is there anything we can do to make sure that they don't call there again? We have repeatedly told them we will correspond in writing but will not talk on the phone. Can we go ahead and report them for harrassment now and stop the calls? They also called me at home and I advised them we would only correspond in writing, so they went ahead and called my husband on his work no.!!!

 

I also received a phone call from M&S, when I asked them to write to us, as we would only correspond in writing, they just said the calls will continue as we need to speak to your husband! Shall we just send them the telephone harrassment letter also?

 

Thanks!

santander loan rcvd 251010.PDF

[wilchil64]

I've found the telephone harrassment letter so will send that off to MBNA. Not sure what to do about Santander as they say they will only accept lower payment through CCCS. Can they do that or may they accept lower payment if we provide I&E details so they can see they are getting pro rata payment? Surely the bit about not being able to accept lower offer as it will result in increased arrears is rubbish - as that would be the same if through CCCS??

 

Grateful for any advice.

[Bigdebtor]

W

 

I would also complain to Stuart Rose at M&S re telephone calls continuing when they ARE accepting and banking your cheques - so deemed to have accepted your proposals.

 

Re Santander, I would say - since you clearly have accepted my reduced payments on XX. XX etc. I do not understand why I need to involve a 3rd party such as CCCS - and also bit about arrears as you say above. However you could also say if they DO NOT wish to continue accepting the reduced payments DIRECT from you then you WILL agree to CCCS paying them - so can they just return the payments "made in error" by you under the new agreement you thought you had made with them - and then you'll set up something through CCCS - otherwise you'll continue to send them the agreed monthly payment of £xx - to show good faith you are enclosing November's payment - but this should ONLY be banked IF they ARE WILLING to continue to accept payments direct from you, freezing all further interest and charges. I bet they won't return a penny! - so stalemate - but you're still being seen to keep YOUR side of the (new) agreement.

 

Good luck!

 

BD

[wilchil64]

Thanks for that BD.

 

I'm happy to keep sending cheques to Santander but they did return October's cheque with their letter (think I forgot to mention that above, sorry), so guess they will return this one too, so it seems a waste of time to send another?

 

M&S repeatedly state in their letters that all cheques are banked before the letters are passed to the relevant department, which I know is ridiculous but it seems a waste of time to keep telling them they are accepting my payments when they just reply explaining as above.

[Bigdebtor]

OK - perhaps tme to just stop doing anything with Santander until they either crawl back wanting the amount you were paying them - or pass it to a DCA. Unless you're worried about DN's that's what I would do.

 

Possibly also time to stop paying M&S - just send the letter saying you're perfectly willing to pay them the amount of £xx as previously accepted nby them on XX. XX etc. - but only if they accept your proposals. Some OC's and DCA's only take notice when the payments actually stop. Also send the no telephone harassment letter - or include a bit from it with your new letters?

 

Good luck

 

BD

[wilchil64]

Thanks BD. I think I've lost the plot now - not sure what I'll gain from either of those things. If they don't return the cheques, how will that help me? And where would I go from there?

 

My understanding so far was that if I'm seen to be making a regular payment -even though it's a lower payment, it is all I can afford - this will be seen as a positive thing by the court if I should be taken to court. So if I stop making payments, won't that look bad in front of a court or in any case? Or am I hoping that they will be pushed into issuing a dn that doesn't stand up to scrutiny at some point?

 

We're not bothered about receiving a DN,already have one from their credit card people. Our credit rating is terrible now anyway, so as far as I understand it would make no difference.

 

Sorry if I'm being dim and thanks for your help again.

[Bigdebtor]

Thanks BD. I think I've lost the plot now - not sure what I'll gain from either of those things. If they don't return the cheques, how will that help me? And where would I go from there?

 

My understanding so far was that if I'm seen to be making a regular payment -even though it's a lower payment, it is all I can afford - this will be seen as a positive thing by the court if I should be taken to court. So if I stop making payments, won't that look bad in front of a court or in any case? Or am I hoping that they will be pushed into issuing a dn that doesn't stand up to scrutiny at some point?

 

You've tried paying what you can afford for several months - but they are not playing their part - so no one could blame you for now concentrating on the ones who are playing ball. The others will crawl back either themselves or through a DCA - an dyou'll probably then get the kind of deal you have asked for.

 

A dodgy DN would be good too (hopefully - apart from recent Brandon case - see Pinky69's thread for more if you want to) .

 

In any case you can always start sending them the same payment again after a few months if they get really heavy - you've really nothing to lose as any court (never happended to me) will only award affordable monthly payments - which is exatly what you have offered countless times. In t emeantime save any money not sent in a sepaerate account for emergencies - or to catch up if they want to play ball (on your terms) in the future.

We're not bothered about receiving a DN,already have one from their credit card people. Our credit rating is terrible now anyway, so as far as I understand it would make no difference.

Correct- their only real weapon won't hurt you now.

 

Sorry if I'm being dim and thanks for your help again.

 

No problem - it's difficult - but you've sometimes got to remain flexible to get results. See bold answers above.

 

BD

[wilchil64]

We have received a DN from Sainsburys which I've attached. I got abit carried away, blacking out dates etc, but the date they have given us to pay total arrears by is 13 Nov.

 

In their previous letter earlier this week they said they are prepared to accept our formal offer of lower payment if we provide I&E but would first issue a DN with a 14 day expiry date, and after expiry they would send confirmation of agreed arrangement and would pass the matter to their solicitors Blair Oliver and Scott.

 

We have sent abbreviated I&E to them and am thinking now we will just continue to send lower payment, unless you advise otherwise.

 

Thanks.

sainsburys rcvd 281010 a.PDF

sainsburys rcvd 281010 b.PDF

[Bigdebtor]

W

 

I think you're probably right.

 

Incidentally BOS are NOT solicitors - they are just the HBOS in-house DCA's (JS uses HBOS for its cards and loans) - they'll probably accept the lower payment you make indefinitely - and even let you decrease it if your circumstances get worse . That's what I found with my HBOS Visa (£5k balance - on which I was paying £5 per month to BOS - so would have taken 1000 months to clear - but once I dug into what it was made up of I got the whole lot written off as unfair charges plus contractual interest!).

 

The DN might (just) give you 14 clear days to pay up arrears - but only relevant if/when a TN or demand for the full balance is made on back of dodgy DN. Keep the DN AND the envelope in case they ever DO demand the full balance - then you may be able to go for unlawful repudiation/rescission - depending on outcome of the upcoming Brandon Appeal - in Pinky69 thread.

 

Good Luck!

 

BD

[tinafromeast]

Thanks Elsa, for all of the info. below. I didn't understand either, so thanks too to wilchil64 for asking the question!

I tried clicking the 'star' at the bottom of your post, to add to your reputation, but I don't seem to be allowed to.

Tina xx

Hi,

CCA Request = Consumer Credit Agreement Request, whereby you send a letter to the Credit Card/Loan/Catalogue Company requesting a copy of your credit agreement. They have 12 days from receipt to supply it. If they fail to do so you can legally withhold payment till they do.

Subject Access Request = A request for all the data the company holds on you..statements, computer records, correspondence etc. You'll see more about it if you hover your mouse over the words in black on your earler post.

We have template letters for CCA and SAR requests..the links are in my signature below. You need to enclose a £1 POSTAL ORDER with each request and send by recorded delivery. Save the receipts. Don't sign anything from now on..just hand print your name (fraud prevention)

We've all been there, you'll soon pick it up

[wilchil64]

Hi all,

 

Re. Sainsburys:

 

We have received this week a letter from Albion Collections Ltd. about the Sainsburys loan, scanned copy attached.

 

As mentioned above, last correspondence )written by humans) from Sainsburys said they would accept lower paymetn if we sent I&E's then we would be issued with an Notice of Default and they would pass to their solicitors Blair Oliver & Scott. We sent abbreviated I&Es, then we received a DN from them. We sent another monthly lower payment cheque. Then they wrote to say they are looking into the issues we have raised! Now we have this letter from Albion.

 

Not sure now what we should do. Should we write to both Albion and Sainsburys? Do we need to check they are doing what they said or whether they have now changed their minds about acceping lower payment?

 

Thanks for your help in advance and have a good weekend.

sains-albion rcvd 111110.PDF

[wilchil64]

Hi again,

 

Re.: MBNA

 

Latest letters received are attached.

 

To recap:

 

We sent abbreviated I&Es about a month ago in a hope they would accept lower payment. No acknowledgement of receiving them at all. They still referring to a letter of ours a month before! And are still asking for I&Es. Should we presume they haven't got round to reading that letter and replying to it yet? Or shall we presume they want more details? Am happy to wait for them to reply to the letter we sent including abbreviated I&Es (which was just total in, total out, total debt, how much remaining to pay off debts, debt to MBNA remaining, what pro rata they are, what amount they can have!)

 

We could just send a letter saying "Further to your letter dated xxx and our letter dated xxx enclosing our I&Es, we trust you have now had time to process this information and look forward to receiving your response. YF".

 

Grateful for comments. Thanks!!

mbna rcvd 061110 pg1.PDF

mbna rcvd 061110 pg2.PDF

[wilchil64]

Anyone got any suggestions how to deal with these? Thanks.

[sillygirl1]

I would write back enclosing the offer letter already sent simply stating

 

"Further to your automated letter of xx date please read attached already sent on xxx. Should you not be able to read English we can get this translated at your cost into whichever language you need."

 

Treat them with the contempt they deserve.

[sillygirl1]

Then you put a complaint into the FOS as they have invited, stating you have tried to deal with them but the cannot turn their threatomatic machine off.....

[wilchil64]

Like it! ;-)

[Bigdebtor]

W

 

Sorry - have been away for a few days, so just got your posts.

 

Whilst I like SG's ideas for when I don't want or need any co-operation from them, I'm not sure it's the best way to get them onside.

 

I would send the letter you along the lines you suggest in post 370 - enclosing a further copy of your last letter "for their convenience".

 

"Further to your letter dated xxx and our letter dated xxx enclosing our I&Es, it would appear our last letter of XXX has been misfiled or has not been received by you. We enclose a further copy for your convenience and trust you will now process this information appropriately and look forward to receiving your response. YF".

 

If they don't deny it was perhaps misfiled then that's useful ammo - as it shows things MIGHT get misfiled or go astray - if you need to use this in future. I they say "we got it" then they look stupid for ignoring it - a win either way!

 

Good luck

 

BD