Bailiffs took horses yesterday

[horseless]

A friend of mine had 2 of her horses taken yesterday and we need to know where we stand and what we can do

It debt is in dispute over a sale of a horse returned injured a woman wants full refund.

cut long story as short as possible... she went through the small claims court just saying it was money owing ..no explaination...

She employed Bailiffs who turned up yesterday with the woman and her horsebox and allowed her to cherry pick what horses she wanted picking 2 very valuble horses (resonable value of 30K ..the value of the origional horse was 5k)

They didnt bother with cars ,belonging etc just wanted those 2 horses... she saw them on the yards website.

my questions are .. can they do this and allow the horses to go straight into the possesion of the other party.?

They did this on a saturday not allowing the opportunity to talk to lawyers?

They broke an electric gate onto the estate whilst entering?

And most importantly both horses belong to other people not this lady.

This is very distressing ...the police where called who took lorry reg etc but said there is nothing they can do as its civil ...

[MARTIN3030]

So was her claim defended ?

How was judgement given ?

[horseless]

She did an N244 last month and it appears yesterday the court had posted her notification of the date to a wrong address so they ruled in her absence.

[postggj]

well if the horses belong to some one else

 

they have to be returned

 

have you any docxs to prove they belong to some one else

 

how did the court get the address wrong

[seanamarts]

If they took horses that did not belong to this lady then surely it is classed as theft. All sounds a bit 'set up' to me if you get what I mean.

Can you not get the owners of the horses taken to call the bailiff company and demand that they return their horses.

[horseless]

on the form she filled in a different correspondance address at bottom of form ..they sent it to origional address...

They were shown a bill of sale for one and they would not accept it ..the other horse is owned by someone miles away and could not be contacted at the time.. now he knows he is furious and wants it reported stolen.

Also these horses were used by her for teaching so could these be classed as tools of the trade?

[horseless]

If they took horses that did not belong to this lady then surely it is classed as theft. All sounds a bit 'set up' to me if you get what I mean.

Can you not get the owners of the horses taken to call the bailiff company and demand that they return their horses.

 

This is what we are all saying ...the owners tried to call bailif but he was not answering his phone so having to wait till the office opens in morning

[postggj]

well if a horse is secured by a bill of sale

 

that bill would be registered in the high court so its theft and needs to be reported to the police as such

[king100]

Sorry bit lost on this one.

 

They just turned up when you were there, took 2 horses of their choice into a horsebox and drove off?

 

Surely the 1st thing that you do is call the police.

 

Its called theft, for a 5k debt they cant take a horse that doesnt belong to who owes the debt.

[seanamarts]

Be interested to know who the bailiff company was.

[horseless]

The Police were called as when lady tried to take photographs of condition the first horse was leaving in they just led the horse to the lorry and when she tried to grab it back it got heated ... we were the ones who called the police... whilst that was going on they had already gone into the field and caught the other horse and were loading it into the lorry without recording markings,condition etc...

When police arrived all they did was look at ID and took reg and said I dont know where we stand and let them leave.

The bailiffs were Sherrifs high court ltd Croydon

[Bartok]

She did an N244 last month and it appears yesterday the court had posted her notification of the date to a wrong address so they ruled in her absence.

 

If you have proof of the address it was sent to, and its not your service address then look up Section 7 of the Interpretation Act 1978. You can get it revoked and goods returned plus all fees cancelled.

 

Post in then legal section and ask how to apply to a court to revoke the enforcement order.

[Ell-enn]

Personally, I'd take this to a solicitor right away - did the bailiffs leave you any paperwork ?

[horseless]

hi

She has spoken to the courts this morning and they have admitted they sent it to the wrong address and have asked her to pay a further £75 to se-submit the Set aside and to apply to get the order reversed ... should she have to pay for it again ?

Also the Bailiffs office are not contactable by telephone only by email ??

[horseless]

Personally, I'd take this to a solicitor right away - did the bailiffs leave you any paperwork ?

 

We are trying to speak with the lawyer now but yet again the office phone is going to answer machine arrrrgghh

The bailiff left a hand writen form stating first horse has no marks or cuts,

Second horse has a few old scratches ..no lumps or marks

 

That was all ...no photos of conditions ...I would have though a vet should have been called to idntify them

[Bartok]

Yes, the £75 is an application notice fee, you can reclaim it.

 

Keep it simple when you complete the form.

 

No need to contact the bailiffs, if the typo on the service address was made by a solicitor then its their Professional Indemnity insurance that pays you for the loss and deprivation of the lawful use of your goods.

[horseless]

 

No need to contact the bailiffs, if the typo on the service address was made by a solicitor then its their Professional Indemnity insurance that pays you for the loss and deprivation of the lawful use of your goods.

 

I dont understand this ... so does this mean the courts clerk who delt with it are liable ?

[Bartok]

If the court made the clerical error and you suffered a loss as a result.... hmmmm. Not sure how liability is apportioned. The parliamentary ombudsman will need to tell you what you can do.

 

It could have been the claimant or his solicitor who files the original document at court that made the error.

 

I think applying to get the order set aside because due process was not served is the best route for you.

[horseless]

We have been trying to contact the bailiffs office...they do not answer their phone on discuss through email

We asked to speak to someone today to prove ownership and this is their reply in full

 

Dear Sirs,

We acknowledge your email as detailed below and note the claims therein.

We would direct you to RSC Order 17 (2) which reads:

“Any person making a claim to or in respect of any money, goods or chattels taken or intended to be taken in execution under process of the court, or to the proceeds or value of any such goods or chattels, must give notice of his claim to the sheriff charged with the execution of the process and must include in his notice a statement of his address, and that address shall be his address for service

We must advise that unless we receive formal claims in accordance with the RSC Order as detailed above within 5 days of seizure, we shall sell the horses at auction accordingly.

Yours faithfully

What is this in english??

[Bartok]

To the laymam its jibberish, its deigned to be. Bailiffs who like to appear intelligent by using initials when quoting a point of law knowing you have no idea what it is.

 

RSC ORDER 17 - INTERPLEADER - Ministry of Justice

 

Not really your problem, you have a document with an address typo on it so the following legislation needs to be applied on an Application Notice.

 

7 References to service by post.

 

Where an Act authorises or requires any document to be served by post (whether the expression “serve” or the expression “give” or “send” or any other expression is used) then, unless the contrary intention appears, the service is deemed to be effected by properly addressing, pre-paying and posting a letter containing the document and, unless the contrary is proved, to have been effected at the time at which the letter would be delivered in the ordinary course of post.

[tomtubby]

A friend of mine had 2 of her horses taken yesterday and we need to know where we stand and what we can do

It debt is in dispute over a sale of a horse returned injured a woman wants full refund.

cut long story as short as possible... she went through the small claims court just saying it was money owing ..no explaination...

She employed Bailiffs who turned up yesterday with the woman and her horsebox and allowed her to cherry pick what horses she wanted picking 2 very valuble horses (resonable value of 30K ..the value of the origional horse was 5k)

They didnt bother with cars ,belonging etc just wanted those 2 horses... she saw them on the yards website.

my questions are .. can they do this and allow the horses to go straight into the possesion of the other party.?

They did this on a saturday not allowing the opportunity to talk to lawyers?

They broke an electric gate onto the estate whilst entering?

And most importantly both horses belong to other people not this lady.

This is very distressing ...the police where called who took lorry reg etc but said there is nothing they can do as its civil ...

 

Firstly, you have not said how much the debt was for?

 

On the matter of whether the creditor can attend with the bailiff or not. This is unusual, but the creditor has merely been used as an "expert" on horses and therefore is able to "assist" as she would have knowledge on what was likely to be valuable horse as opposed to one that is shortly due for the "kncckers yard"....

 

Even better, she is able to provide suitable transport which the bailiff company would otherwise have to hire etc.

 

In the first place there is a serious problem with the administration at the County Court concerning the service of documents and you will need to speak with the court straight away to resolve this.

 

In many cases a quick solution to the ownership issue would be for the rightful owner to swear a simple Statutory Declaration which MAY work quickly but otherwise the OWNER has to file an INTERPLEADER Application and a copy needs to be sent to the High Court within the area. This could very likely be the High Court of Justice.

 

This is because the horses were not removed by a bailiff but by a High Court Enforcement Officer.

[horseless]

Firstly, you have not said how much the debt was for?

 

On the matter of whether the creditor can attend with the bailiff or not. This is unusual, but the creditor has merely been used as an "expert" on horses and therefore is able to "assist" as she would have knowledge on what was likely to be valuable horse as opposed to one that is shortly due for the "kncckers yard"....

 

Even better, she is able to provide suitable transport which the bailiff company would otherwise have to hire etc.

 

In the first place there is a serious problem with the administration at the County Court concerning the service of documents and you will need to speak with the court straight away to resolve this.

 

In many cases a quick solution to the ownership issue would be for the rightful owner to swear a simple Statutory Declaration which MAY work quickly but otherwise the OWNER has to file an INTERPLEADER Application and a copy needs to be sent to the High Court within the area. This could very likely be the High Court of Justice.

 

This is because the horses were not removed by a bailiff but by a High Court Enforcement Officer.

 

Firstly you must be involved in some way as you know the ins and outs of this that I have not mentioned..

I have stated previously that the origional horse purchased was 5k... the value of the dept is now £9.6k

Surely there are 101 horse experts to come in to assess horses value ..the woman they brought in was suppose to be a pet horse owner ??

The fact that her lorry lorry was used ...and a smart one too !! implies she was very experienced horse owner and should have put her hands up with buying a horse with a 5 stage vetting should prove a good sound horse.

...and the fact that she used her lorry also tells me they are in possesion of the horses ...not in a "safe holding"

The "enforcement offer was aware what horses belonged to the lady but left them in the field ... dont think any where ready for the Knackers!!!!

Also I feel both of these horses could be classed as tools of the trade as they are used to earn their keep on behalf of the owners.

[hallowitch]

Firstly you must be involved in some way as you know the ins and outs of this that I have not mentioned

 

 

The reason tomtubby knows the in and outs of this because she is an expert on bailiff law and fights for the Rights of detours every day in her day job

 

there is nothing sinister about tomtubby so please don't worry

[tomtubby]

Firstly you must be involved in some way as you know the ins and outs of this that I have not mentioned..

I have stated previously that the origional horse purchased was 5k... the value of the dept is now £9.6k

Surely there are 101 horse experts to come in to assess horses value ..the woman they brought in was suppose to be a pet horse owner ??

The fact that her lorry lorry was used ...and a smart one too !! implies she was very experienced horse owner and should have put her hands up with buying a horse with a 5 stage vetting should prove a good sound horse.

...and the fact that she used her lorry also tells me they are in possesion of the horses ...not in a "safe holding"

The "enforcement offer was aware what horses belonged to the lady but left them in the field ... dont think any where ready for the Knackers!!!!

Also I feel both of these horses could be classed as tools of the trade as they are used to earn their keep on behalf of the owners.

 

 

I am not in any way invovled. I am merely reading between the lines. We actually have a business advising the public with BAILIFF ENQUIRIES !!

 

You have said something very important about the horses being "tools of the trade" and this has reminded me of something that could assist. I will check my files and post back......

[horseless]

WHEW!!!

Ok Sorry

Thank you ...it is just really upsetting and sensitive as they are living creatures ...