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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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employment tribunal advice please


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Hi,

 

In laymans terms judge Mummery [a leading circuit judge at the time]decided and came to a decision in the Selkent v moore case, which set a presedence where hardship is balanced with injustice.

 

And the above case is used as a yardstick in all ET decisions.

 

In otherwords you have got to base your`e argument around what hardship[in law] you would suffer if they were to allow your employers late response and also the injustice you would suffer if the ET were to allow their late response,and vice-versa.

 

I hope you get the drift,In the Selkent case Mr Moore was not going to suffer any hardship for his appeal failing as he already had a case for unfair dimissal and thats why he lost his appeal.

 

I hope you understand what i am trying to say.

 

Good luck.

Edited by madari
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  • 4 weeks later...

hi again everyone, well i had my pre hearing monday as it turned out i didnt need to bother about trying to get the late response thrown out. The judge said he was going to allow it but then said to the respondant that means that i have two claims that they must defend ,.he went on to tell them to settle as any of my points could succede at the constuctive dissmissal and it looked as though i had been unfairly dissmissed anyway.

 

What a releif ,without doubt the most stressful experience in my life.

 

The only thing was he listed the case for next may, the other side wanted a one day case but the judge said its a three day case.

 

I have a question that im wondering if anybody knows the answer.

 

Im wondering the likely date they will settle ? will it be around next april or as the other side got told off by the court will they settle quicker rather later?

 

Many thanks for all the help previously.

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Hi,

 

Looks good, In answer to your question they may settle sooner rather than later.

 

But my guess is,if they are going to settle,( dont forget a three day trial is more costlier than a one day hearing)they will settle on the day of the hearing in May,which is in the legal field known as `Brinksmanship`.

 

That way it has a twofold effect, one,you are kept on your toes and under undue stress, two,and heaven forbid, you may have died come May,and they get off scott free.

 

These are all tricks of the trade so keep battling........ onwards and upwards.

 

Good luck.

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Thanks maderi and neil conflicting advice lol but i know what you both mean. I had to stop myself from asking the respondant solicitor in the court to settle there and then !

 

What i was thinking was say they were going to drag it out with brinkmanship etc that would mean more expense to comply with the case management orders so my first thought was they would settle early then i thought of my ex boss someone who used to pay on the last possible day in the month and a bit of a ruthless dictator type so its possibly depending on who makes the final decision. Its an insurance policy cover with employment consultants that they have!

 

The best thing i can do is pray lol

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It would make sense for them to settle early however don't bank on it. It seems that you have a very good case.

 

Madari does seem at times to not give very good advice on here IMHO

 

My Advice is based on personal experiance, whats yours based on,personnal insult`s ?????

 

Please do tell...lol

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My Advice is based on personal experiance, whats yours based on,personnal insult`s ?????

 

Please do tell...lol

 

 

Question for you, have you an ET case going on now?

 

You give out alot of mis-leading info on this threads and you are still doing it.

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Neil if you think any particular advice is mis-leading you must say why you think that.

Simply stating that advice is wrong just creates arguments on a thread and the op gets no help.

 

Will do, but I have had dealings with that poster before.

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Question for you, have you an ET case going on now?

 

You give out alot of mis-leading info on this threads and you are still doing it.

 

 

Whats the problem neil, Royal Mail giving you a hard time are they????

 

If you think my advice is misleading then noone is asking you for your opinion or comments on my educated advice.[or are they?]

 

I am sure you are of the opinion that i have connections with your ex employer,hence the nasty comments.

 

You are wrong.

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Whats the problem neil, Royal Mail giving you a hard time are they????

 

If you think my advice is misleading then noone is asking you for your opinion or comments on my educated advice.[or are they?]

 

I am sure you are of the opinion that i have connections with your ex employer,hence the nasty comments.

 

You are wrong.

 

 

I will leave people to judge your posts themselves.

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Hi again honeybee,

 

Thanks for intervening and calming down the argument lol. I feel as though I dont have the willpower to fight them if they do take things to next may.

 

Its just crazy, my employer sacks me with an unsigned undated letter, doesnt follow the three step procedure that was in force last feb when they sacked me ( I was told this was the legal minimum requirement by solicitor ) , then their representitives miss a deadline to respond.

 

We get to the court ,the judge tells them off ,tells them that I was prevented from returning to work and the respondants representitive even admits in front of the judge my employer prevented me from returning because " I had anoyed them" and he was appologising etc.

 

Straight after the hearing the respondants solicitor asked me about settlement, I told him what I wanted ( a quarter of my shedule of loss) and a reference and still he was unhelpfull. my parting shot was when he said he would be in touch i said "BET ITS AROUND NEXT APRIL"

 

my understanding is that even if it was next april or may they are within their rights and if say I did settle withut going to court that settlment could not be enforced by this new fast track system which is in place to enforce employment tribunal orders it can only be used to enforce actual orders made by the tribunal.

 

If my understanding is correct I would dearly love to force them to an early decision one way or the other.

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Sorry, I don't know the answer to whether you can force the issue, but someone will.

 

I can understand it's very draining and you probably want to move on with your life. The day will come, I expect, when the matter is resolved in your own mind one way or another.

 

My best, HB

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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  • 1 year later...

Hi davuck, like you I am in the middle of filling in the form for a Case Management Discussion Agenda and I have been in tears with it. I am stressed out to start with, bringing my claims to Tribunal, and this form must have been designed for only Corporate Lawyers to understand. I have come to the same conclusion as you, fill it in to the best of my ability. I'm lucky in the way that I have a Union representing me and they will get a copy of this form, and suggest changes if necessary. But the whole business is really stressful, and I wish it was over. Good luck with your case.

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I told him what I wanted ( a quarter of my shedule of loss) and a reference

 

Hi Davuk,

 

I haven't read the whole tread, but if your schedule is realistic, AND your claim has merit, I would have thought 25% + an agreed reference is a good offer for them?

 

Was there any pre-claim conciliation with ACAS ; and if so, why not ring the conciliator, and ask him / her to contact R and formally offer this?

 

Che

...................................................................... [FONT=Comic Sans MS]Please post on a thread before sending a PM. My opinion's are not expressed as agent or representative of The Consumer Action Group. Always seek professional advice from a qualified legal adviser before acting. If I have helped you please feel free to click on the black star.[/FONT] [FONT=Comic Sans MS] I am sorry that work means I don't get into the Employment Forum as often as I would like these days, but nonetheless I'll try to pop in when I can.[/FONT] [FONT=Arial Black][FONT=Comic Sans MS][COLOR=Red]'Venceremos' :wink:[/COLOR][/FONT][/FONT]

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