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    • Indians, traditionally known as avid savers, are now stashing away less money and borrowing more.View the full article
    • the claimant in their WS can refer to whatever previous CC judgements they like, as we do in our WS's, but CC judgements do not set a legal precedence. however, they do often refer to judgements like Bevis, those cases do created a precedence as they were court of appeal rulings. as for if the defendant, prior to the raising of a claim, dobbed themselves in as the driver in writing during any appeal to the PPC, i don't think we've seen one case whereby the claimant referred to such in their WS.. ?? but they certainly typically include said appeal letters in their exhibits. i certainly dont think it's a good idea to 'remind' them of such at the defence stage, even if the defendant did admit such in a written appeal. i would further go as far to say, that could be even more damaging to the whole case than a judge admonishing a defendant for not appealing to the PPC in the 1st place. it sort of blows the defendant out the water before the judge reads anything else. dx  
    • Hi LFI, Your knowledge in this area is greater than I could possibly hope to have and as such I appreciate your feedback. I'm not sure that I agree the reason why a barrister would say that, only to get new customers, I'm sure he must have had professional experience in this area that qualifies him to make that point. 🙂 In your point 1 you mention: 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver. I understand the point you are making but I was referring to when the keeper is also the driver and admits it later and only in this circumstance, but I understand what you are saying. I take on board the issues you raise in point 2. Is it possible that a PPC (claimant) could refer back to the case above as proof that the motorist should have appealed, like they refer back to other cases? Thanks once again for the feedback.
    • Well barristers would say that in the hope that motorists would go to them for advice -obviously paid advice.  The problem with appealing is at least twofold. 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver.  And in a lot of cases the last thing the keeper wants when they are also the driver is that the parking company knows that. It makes it so much easier for them as the majority  of Judges do not accept that the keeper and the driver are the same person for obvious reasons. Often they are not the same person especially when it is a family car where the husband, wife and children are all insured to drive the same car. On top of that  just about every person who has a valid insurance policy is able to drive another person's vehicle. So there are many possibilities and it should be up to the parking company to prove it to some extent.  Most parking company's do not accept appeals under virtually any circumstances. But insist that you carry on and appeal to their so called impartial jury who are often anything but impartial. By turning down that second appeal, many motorists pay up because they don't know enough about PoFA to argue with those decisions which brings us to the second problem. 2] the major parking companies are mostly unscrupulous, lying cheating scrotes. So when you appeal and your reasons look as if they would have merit in Court, they then go about  concocting a Witness Statement to debunk that challenge. We feel that by leaving what we think are the strongest arguments to our Member's Witness Statements, it leaves insufficient time to be thwarted with their lies etc. And when the motorists defence is good enough to win, it should win regardless of when it is first produced.   
    • S13 (2)The creditor may not exercise the right under paragraph 4 to recover from the keeper any unpaid parking charges specified in the notice to keeper if, within the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which that notice was given, the creditor is given— (a)a statement signed by or on behalf of the vehicle-hire firm to the effect that at the material time the vehicle was hired to a named person under a hire agreement; (b)a copy of the hire agreement; and (c)a copy of a statement of liability signed by the hirer under that hire agreement. As  Arval has complied with the above they cannot be pursued by EC----- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- S14 [1]   the creditor may recover those charges (so far as they remain unpaid) from the hirer. (2)The conditions are that— (a)the creditor has within the relevant period given the hirer a notice in accordance with sub-paragraph (5) (a “notice to hirer”), together with a copy of the documents mentioned in paragraph 13(2) and the notice to keeper; (b)a period of 21 days beginning with the day on which the notice to hirer was given has elapsed;  As ECP did not send copies of the documents to your company and they have given 28 days instead of 21 days they have failed to comply with  the Act so you and your Company are absolved from paying. That is not to say that they won't continue asking to be paid as they do not have the faintest idea how PoFA works. 
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

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    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Sheriff puts Bank of Scotland to proof on bank charges


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Consumer panel calls for end to free banking

 

SIMON BAIN

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18 Jun 2011

Mike Dailly, the solicitor who helped lead the consumer campaign against unfair bank charges, has said free banking will have to end to allow proper competition in the current account market.

Mr Dailly, principal solicitor at Govan Law Centre, was appointed to the Financial Services Consumer Panel 18 months ago and was making his first public comments as a panel member.

He told an audience of 120 bankers in London that the panel would like to see an end to free banking for those in credit, as it was preventing new banks from challenging the “big five” who held 87% of current accounts.

Mr Dailly said: “We would like to see charges related to the cost of the bank providing a particular service for a particular individual, in order to provide genuine full transparency in the UK current account market.”

In 2006 Govan Law Centre launched the campaign which saw more than 1.1 million customers claim an estimated £1.7 billion in refunds from the banks. All complaints were frozen in July 2007 and in November 2009 the Supreme Court ruled against a test case brought by the office of Fair Trading. Govan Law Centre however is continuing to pursue cases in the small claims court using different legal grounds.

Mr Dailly commented: “There is no doubt that the consumer panel is incredibly frustrated with what has happened with overdraft charges and we are trying to find a way forward. There needs to be transparency for people to be able to compare different services from different banks.”

Brian Mairs at the British Bankers Assocation commented: “Our members are committed to maintaining the free in-credit banking model because customers have demanded it.”

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“Our members are committed to maintaining the free in-credit banking model because customers have demanded it.”

 

 

I seriously doubt that "Free banking if in credit" costs anywhere near the amount of money they are getting from bank charges - if they say it does, lets see the proof

HTH (Hope This Helps) RDM2006

 

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I seriously doubt that "Free banking if in credit" costs anywhere near the amount of money they are getting from bank charges - if they say it does, lets see the proof

 

Strange they listen to customers who are in credit, yet totally ignore those that are overdrawn and being seriously impacted by the charges being applied, though, isn't it.I wonder which option the Boards of these Banks prefer? Answers on a post card.

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 3 weeks later...

I recollect highlighting the opportunity to contribute to a "call for evidence" some months ago (but can't recollect exactly which thread this was on). It looks as if only around 200 individual people and "interested bodies" responded to this "initiative" by BIS (Vince Cable's department) to comment on Bank Charges and many other means of screwing those most vulnerable debtors.

 

The results are outlined in the attached documents - very disappointing - especially given the huge influence we could have had - based on the number of people in CAG etc. - and the even larger numbers who have complained about Bank Charges etc. in the past few years.

 

It also looks as if every Bank etc and a few other Consumer Groups (including one along lines of "lawful longish low dogs with big ears and mournful expressions") did reply - but that CAG as a group and over 99.9999% of individual CAG members did not seem to do so. It's therefore hardly surprising the report is so uninspiring - and offers little hope of any positive outcomes in the short term!

 

If we don't take these chances to get our views heard by Cabinet Ministers then what chance do we have of getting things changed?

 

BD

 

http://www.bis.gov.uk/assets/biscore/consumer-issues/docs/c/11-1063-consumer-credit-and-personal-insolvency-responses

 

http://nds.coi.gov.uk/content/Detail.aspx?ReleaseID=420472&NewsAreaID=2

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I went to court and could not convince the judge i was right. The bank did not provide any evidence by the deadline date, then a piece of paper was put in front of me at the final hearing that i had never seen before, and had no answer to. The judge allowed the bank to use it as evidence, so it was the only piece of paper they used actually in court on 3 visits made by myself. I had supplied over 100 pages of supporting arguments that counted for nothing in the end. The judge didnt seem to care about the banks refusal to supply me with information regarding the terms and conditions i signed up to, saying i could have switched to another bank anyway. The bank changed the date on the system that my account was opened so no records could be accessed before 2001, my account was actually opened in 1991 and i had proof of that. The judge laughed and said that wasnt possible, but i had taken the name of the manager who gave me that information, and i had spoken to 3 different people who told me the false information. He also made reference to the governments meaningless headlines that they were going to tackle this subject, but they have spectacularly done nothing about it.

 

Basically i was steamrollered and overruled on all counts, one by one. I am just waiting to hear if there is a ruling from a higher court so i can take my arguments back to court again, but i doubt it. The ruling i knew nothing about was regarding the CCA140 i was using as an argument. On one single occasion my account had gone into the black, and according to a judge in southampton this meant that the agreement had been settled, and a new one started the next time i went overdrawn. My claim, if successful, would have been reduced from £391 to £80 in one foul swoop.

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My deepest sympathy fireprism for a very topheavy unfair trip to Court.

I'm sure there will be lots of knowledgable peeps here to pick this apart and give advice and support.

Keep up the fight against Bank Charges.

 

 

Got Debt problems?

Don't panic, put the kettle on and read this

 

:-) Everything I write comes from my heart and head! The large filling cabinet that is my knowledge of life, however warped that may be!! :-)

 

<<< Please tickle my star!! if I have managed to help you or just made you chuckle!

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BD, until people decide they want change and figure out what to do to get that change.....:roll:

The matrix is intrinsically flawed. Within it is the program for it's own destruction. If you are reading this, you are in the matrix and it's days are numbered...so watch out! :eek:

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BTM

 

I totally agree - given the majority of people don't seem to have been hit by unfair charges they will always be quite happy to let the disadvantaged minority pay through the nose for their "free" banking whilst in credit! What gets me is that nearly all CAGGERs (and CAG itself), having been made aware of this "call for evidence" failed to take advantage of it - but virtually ALL banks and other "interested parties" didn't waste the opportunity to put over their point of view.

 

Perhaps the Banks etc. should have ben asked to canvas the views of their customers - or reproduced the views expressed in the huge numbers of complaints they receive every year?

 

In any case, with such unbalanced feedback, it looks like another white wash - just like the SC verdict!

 

Hopefully Mike Dailly will be able to redress the balance in Glasgow Sheriff Court soon!

 

BD

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BTM

I totally agree - given the majority of people don't seem to have been hit by unfair charges they will always be quite happy to let the disadvantaged minority pay through the nose for their "free" banking whilst in credit!

Nein! I don't think it's because the majority have not been hit, I think they have. The issue is that they do not seem to care enough to take the necessary action.:!:

 

However, what IS mysterious to me is the apparent inaction of the general CAG populace on this point as Caggers are by nature action takers.:???:

The matrix is intrinsically flawed. Within it is the program for it's own destruction. If you are reading this, you are in the matrix and it's days are numbered...so watch out! :eek:

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Sorry to hear about your loss Fireprism. The fact that the judge 'laughed' must have told you everything. At best, LIPs usually have an uphill task; LIPs against the banks (apparently the court's most favoured persons) have a mountainous challenge. It seems the lender has to be almost completely incompetent for you to have any real prospects. But for a LIP to take on a bank, on the sensitive matter of bank charges, with the high winds of the SC ruling bearing down and no real new tools to fight with, is asking for a whipping.

 

If you have a thread for this please post as much as you can there for the knowledge and edification of all. Sorry again.

The matrix is intrinsically flawed. Within it is the program for it's own destruction. If you are reading this, you are in the matrix and it's days are numbered...so watch out! :eek:

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busthematrix and bigdebtor, have you seen the following thread...

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?240365-Bank-Charges-Campaign-Continues

 

CAG is still campaigning against unfair bank charges and have recently written to all MPs via the Newsletter. There is also a letter template that you can send to your MP independantly in order to keep the pressure on.

:)

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Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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CB

 

Thanks for this. I'll get a letter off to my MP PDQ.

 

Is there any way of CAG monitoring the availabilty of - or being alerted by HMG to - "calls for evidence" - such as the one I reported (and responded to)?

 

I'm sure if we could alert all CAGGERs to these then there would be a much more balanced (and much less bank-friendly) consensus of replies.

 

BD

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CB

 

Thanks for this. I'll get a letter off to my MP PDQ.

 

Is there any way of CAG monitoring the availabilty of - or being alerted by HMG to - "calls for evidence" - such as the one I reported (and responded to)?

 

I'm sure if we could alert all CAGGERs to these then there would be a much more balanced (and much less bank-friendly) consensus of replies.

 

BD

 

Many thanks for that BD.

 

In respect of your other queries, they might be better directed to Caro who is the leading lady in the continued fight against Bank Charges :)

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Thanks CB, no, I wasn't aware but am now and will be taking action. Rgds

The matrix is intrinsically flawed. Within it is the program for it's own destruction. If you are reading this, you are in the matrix and it's days are numbered...so watch out! :eek:

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Ah ! looks like that iffy post has gone :-)...well done mods |!!:-D LOL !

Nemo me impune lacessit

 

 

Advice & opinions given by johnnymitch are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

 

If you think I've helped you please feel free to tickle my star :-D

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Ah ! looks like that iffy post has gone :-)...well done mods |!!:-D LOL !

 

Johhny

 

Looks like I missed it totally. D*mn!

 

I like it when "iffy" posts start off a good "debate" (or "rammy" as they usually become in Glasgow). :wink:

 

BD

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Hi BD ,

 

It's OK to have a "rammy" if there's something to argy aboot ...lol ! ....but this was hieroglyphics disguising an Advertisement for something or other ... and I've had 3 e-mail notifications of different ones through CAG under this thread ... :mad2: .. beginning to think I've been hacked somehow ... :( ..

 

But no doubt they'll give up and b****r off eventually ... LOL !

Nemo me impune lacessit

 

 

Advice & opinions given by johnnymitch are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

 

If you think I've helped you please feel free to tickle my star :-D

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  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks els, wishing her all the very best with this ongoing battle, and will be watching this with interest.

Keep up the fight against Bank Charges.

 

 

Got Debt problems?

Don't panic, put the kettle on and read this

 

:-) Everything I write comes from my heart and head! The large filling cabinet that is my knowledge of life, however warped that may be!! :-)

 

<<< Please tickle my star!! if I have managed to help you or just made you chuckle!

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I think that says it for us all Night Owl ....we await the result with interest ... Mike Dailly has worked sooo hard for this ... he deserves a favourable result ...

Nemo me impune lacessit

 

 

Advice & opinions given by johnnymitch are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

 

If you think I've helped you please feel free to tickle my star :-D

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CHAPTER 18 AMENDMENT OF PLEADINGS

 

 

18.1. Alteration of sum sued for

18.2. Powers of sheriff to allow amendment

18.3. Applications to amend

18.4. Applications for diligence on amendment

18.5. Service of amended pleadings

18.6. Expenses and conditions of amendment

18.7. Effect of amendment on diligence

18.8. Preliminary pleas inserted on amendment

 

 

 

There may be another part of the process as well but rule 18 isn't likely to cause much fuss.

 

M1

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Thanks for the info folks. Let's hope this is the beginning of the end, although I suspect it'll be a long time before it's finally resolved.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Evening all,

 

I wish the claimants involved the very best outcome.

 

Best wishes to all

 

Dougal

Update: 2013 Following our recent (9/7/13) hearing about Bank Charges at the Court of Appeal, and refusal to grant permission to Appeal; an Application has just (23/10/2013) been made for a fresh hearing and the Court Location is yet to be confirmed!

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I hope yesterday went OK

HTH (Hope This Helps) RDM2006

 

THE FORCE (OF CAG) IS WITH YOU

;)

 

We've Helped You To Claim - Now Help Us Remain

A live Site - Make a Donation

 

All advice and opinions given by people on this site are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, please seek qualified professional legal Help.

 

However, if you have found any advice you have been given helpful.

Why not show your gratitude And

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