series3 v MBNA/Optima

[Series3]

I'll do it a.m.

thanks for your help it is very much appreciated.

just checking but would it have to be in on the 24th Feb?

the claim was dated 22 Jan..

thanks again snooper

[supasnooper]

How long do you have to file the required responses to a claim?

 

Counting from the date of issue -

Acknowledgement of Service:

5 Days (service) + 14 Days = 19 Days. (An Acknowledgement of Service gives 14 days extra from the date of service to file a defence).

 

So, the AOS must be done by 10th February

 

Defence, after filing Acknowledgement of Service:

5 + 14 + 14 = 33 Days in total.

 

Therefore your defence must be submitted by 24th February, as you have correctly calculated.....I'd err on the safe side though and get it submitted a bit earlier.

[Series3]

Thanks again.

I received a letter from Optima this morning

It says.they received my cpr31.14 and they have asked their clients (MBNA)

It also said they may not be able to get then within the time (7 days)

then, last line.

In any instance our file is to remain on hold until all documents have been provided.

 

What do they mean "on hold"?

I take it I'll have to file an embarrassed defense to court if I don't get the documents in time..

[supasnooper]

I take it you've read the link to pt2537's thread I posted in post #18.

 

I'd look at following the advice given there.

[Series3]

I have read it, over and over.

now, at this stage, do I try to get the court to enforce an order compelling them to give me the documents relating to cpr31.14?

or.

wait and see, file a defense and then in the defense tell the court I have had not received the documentation I asked for.

I don't want to mess up with the timing.

I have read the thread but I am no wiser as with when I ask the court for a compliance order.

 

does that sound right.

I'm also asking if I'm doing this right.

[supasnooper]

You need to ask the Court for a Compliance order now.

 

The Courts are tiring of seeing embarrassed defences as it is clogging up the system.

 

As you can see from what pt2537 has written, you are taking control of the situation by submitting an application for CPR 31.14 compliance and will put Restons on the back foot............it will show them that they have to put up or shut up; i.e. discontinue.

 

If you wish to submit an "embarrassed" or holding defence then this allows Restons to dictate terms and drags the case on and on.

 

You will have also noted that if there is no Agreement then there is no case to defend; you then apply for a strike out of the case.....and claim your costs.

[Series3]

I get it..

I'll read through it again a few times

Thanks again..

[supasnooper]

...............and once the case is struck out, MBNA\Optima would have very little chance of trying to run another claim against you for the same debt.

[Series3]

Today..I got these from Optima..

they came with a copy of the latest terms and conditions..

 

personal data removed.

 

this is front and back of my cca....

 

 

I need to get a defense to court by the 24th February.

To me it looks just like an application. I doubt that anything was on the back but I can't be sure.

what do you think?

and why have they not sent terms and conditions that were from 2001?

Edited February 21, 2010 by Series3
Page two deleted.... Personal details visible from fron of doc.

[Series3]

I actually remember filling this form in when I went to the RL Cup match at Twickers...I got a free hat....

I have noticed that where I sign..It does say to read section 11 0f the T & C's...

the ones on the back are on about not charging interest for 5 months ..

 

clearly not anything to do with this Application.

 

any help?

[supasnooper]

Oh dear, what have Optima sent you ?

 

If you look at the date codes on the two scans at the bottom right hand side.

 

In the first scan it reads DP-01-01-319-M

 

The second scan reads 12-00 and is a typical MBNA tear off agreement which doesn't fit a Virgin Agreement.

 

Have a look at this link and you'll see why - http://consumeractiongroup.co.uk/resources/templates-library/86-debt-collectors/609-mbna-agreementsapplication-forms

 

I don't see any tear-off perforations on the first scan.

Edited February 20, 2010 by supasnooper
correction

[Series3]

it is an mbna card, not virgin...

I filled the form out at the entrance to a rugby match.

There were no terms and conditions.

 

thanks for looking.

I am going to need a little help with a defense. It has to be done and in by Tuesday/Wednesday.no Agreement then there is no case to defend; you then apply for a strike out of the case"?

would I be right in thinking what you said earlier "

[Peedee123]

Hiya, I haven't got any advice for you but just wanted to say that I am in exactly the same boat with MBNA/Optima and ironically the same time scales! They also issued my CCJ on 22nd Jan and I have to file my defence by 24th Feb. Like you despite reading lots of the threads I'm still a bit bewildered as to what to put in my defence. I haven't received a copy of my CCA yet despite sending off a CPR31.14 and previous to that a CCA request. My thread is here http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/245171-mbna-optima-legal-court-2.html#post2780807 if you would like to have a look.

Good luck with everything and if I find out anymore I'll let you know.....

Onwards and upwards!!

[Series3]

thanks, I have seen that thread and I'll re-read it.

I'm sure we'll get some advice (hope so)

If you look further back, this is what they sent after my cpr 31:14 request.

it took longer than the 7 days but...

I'm still waiting for the SAR from mbna.

I said earlier that I remembered when I filled it in, bit of a rush job. Outside the ground, all because of a free hat. lol.

anyone else any ideas about my defense please?

I need to let them know it's not a CCA, just an application for a CC.

Would it be an embarrassed defense, to see what comes back for the SAR?

Or should I go for a strike out because the lack of an enforceable CCA?

thanks in advance.

 

Series3

[Peedee123]

I've sent you a pm... hope it helps

[Series3]

would anyone else like to comment on the CCA they sent me?

Any help would be welcomed.

Only a few days left before I have to send a defense to court.

[gezwee]

I'd say its unenforcable as it stands.......... but theres no accounting for the judge on the day (if it gets to a hearing stage).

 

Build up as much data as you can on any other discrepancies with the way your account was terminated, always best to have a second line of defence just in case

 

Gez

[Series3]

the "terms" they have copied to the back of the application have NO default charges.

they also have an APR of 15% or something like that.

I was only paying around 7% for a long time..(until they got mad at me.)

they started by dropping my credit limit by £9.500

then again by £5.800.....to £2.200. thus adding £12 overlimit charges.

I will check through my statements in the morning.

Has this any relevance to my defense?

I really would like to shove this one up them, just because the way they became aggressive at the first instance.

[gezwee]

Have another read of your DN, refers to term 8 of your agreement......me thinks not

 

That gives you 2 documents referring to terms in a 3rd (which carries the PT's) which has no relevance to either.

 

You really need to double check all the details of your case and refer each to the relevant CCA section to ensure you don't get caught out with a simple mistake.

 

You mention they have been reducing available credit over a period of time, assume you now have default arrears noted on the DN at the difference between current balance and credit limit?

 

The agreement really shouldnt pass any inspection but if you get a creditor friendly DJ you never know.

 

Gez

[Series3]

thanks for your comments. I didn't notice the DN one...

 

series3

 

 

(added in edit)

I think it means on the latest terms and conditions that they sent

Edited February 21, 2010 by Series3

[miss muppet]

Peedee and Series 3, not quite sure about the CCJ issue but have you looked at the legal successes forum particularly Staying Calm's thread? There is an excellent defence on there which I plagurised myself and won:D

[gezwee]

Right, had another look at your CCA attachments and....... unless they've become proficient at photoshopping ghosted images together there may be a slight issue.

 

I had a play around on photoshop to see if I could improve the resolution and pick out any other details and I can read all of your personal info on the reversed image.

 

I still think they've overlayed the front to reverse and bodged something together but you'll have an argument on your hands to rebutt their position.

 

I've seen this on several other threads and condition/term 11 always seems to come up as not being on the reverse.

 

May be worth jumping into some other threads (check for Won in the search tab) to see how they went about getting a discontinuance or strike out on this basis.

 

Would also think about taking your attachments down and rescanning with the reversed image top section covered.

 

Gez

[Series3]

the scans are what optima sent. It was one page printed on both sides.

I'm sure the they put them on one sheet of paper to make believe that's where they belong.

the paper is just standard printer paper, so quite thin.

I'll re-scan and cover the front.

I can read most of the terms and conditions on the back apart from the interest and apr bits, they are blurred...

I have a couple of days to get a defense sorted so no great rush.

I doubt there is a thread on here that I haven't read. Some are sooooo long.

I know what I need to get across but putting it int words is another thing.

all your comments are appreciated

[gezwee]

Hi Series3

 

Have you read the Lynne Thorious decision from last year, this was primarily concerned with PPI - but note the reference to the terms and conditions!

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/mbna/243487-mbna-lynne-thorius-solicitors.html

 

Gez

[Series3]

Yes, a very good read.

Most certainly use to persuade a judge about Terms and Conditions relevant to the card.