Advent Computer Training (Barclays Partner Finance)Info and discussion thread

[malchus25]

I joined Advent in the middle of December 2009 and I went on holiday over the Christmas and new year, did not get back until 18th January so had no training at all.

 

Barclays had already made decision to cut funding end of September when the new boss arrived from American express, it was she who looked at the books and said to cut funding to a whole load of companies most of them training companies, they nearly all went bust within weeks of each other.. no coincidence, Barclays is the common denominator between them all.

 

I was out of work at the time I was signed up for the finance by Advent.. how was it I was given a loan? I was coming to the end of my job seekers payments, the last one was in the December so how could I be given a loan with an income of £250 per month taxable (yes dole office sent detail's to tax office they wanted their share of that money) and due to end the same month I do not get any dole money now, and have not worked in all this time... stinks.

 

Barclays was happy to give out money when things was going well, they took the profits and gave each other bonus payments because they was doing so well.. now its different story, we are all what they class as toxic debt.. they cant sell us on easily like they could have before, they know they are on a slippy slope and if they take us to court.. they have a good chance of losing because of what happened when we all signed up.

 

Miselling is what is going to sink the bastards ( Barclays partner finance are jointly and serverly liable with Advent) and when we sink em.. they will have to pay us compensation for stress and harrasment they have caused us all.

If we could find a way to prove that, it's because Barclays that Advent gone bust, would be great. It would be a decisive positive progress in our case. And the behaviour Advent had on knowing we'll come to this it's weird. It's like they've somehow hidden by going bust.

[Mustard2243]

I just read elsewhere that they are only bounty hunters working on commission if they can collect money.

They are not even good bounty hunters if they were they would have Boba Fett and the Dog working for them!!!

 

Any News fuzz?

[10pack]

Hi Guys

Found an interesting site with some good reading on debt recovery firms...

http://www.dpcregistry.co.uk/

[Fuzzbutt]

I have managed to wrangle the document from FOS that Barclays base their argument of not refunding us on. It is basically all the 'like for like' bull and an outline of the new 'bespoke' courses. Unfortunately, they do seem to have covered all the modules Advent had offered now, so far as I can see.

Updated details for Advent students are here on CT website.....

http://www.computeach.co.uk/advent-faqs

 

Question 12 runs. My contract had already expired. How can I continue my training? A. You can still continue your training with Computeach but this will require further financial outlay. If you would like to talk to one of our Course Advisors about signing up to complete your course please call 0845 60 99 020.

 

My argument to FOS is that my contract end date is Dec 2010 so that now leaves me a few weeks to complete a 2 year course after a year of my time has been wasted by first Barclays and then FOS in their delay in giving a final answer on this. Fair? No! I've argued the point that the sales reps gave us a verbal assurance that the course was open-ended (a sales rep even made a statement to that effect to our lawyer) but FOS say this is not evidence as we have no written proof (does the word of how many complainants now count for nothing? Are FOS calling us liars?)

Barlays claim that CT contacted everyone several times by email and phone in April, May and July. I received one initial email but no calls - until last week when a CT rep called and was surprised to hear that I was an ex-Advent student and not a 'new inquiry' as the system had me down as! I had called months ago for more detail about the 'bespoke course' - no one at CT had bothered to call me back!

 

All this will be passed to our lawyer. She's on leave for a couple of weeks now. I'm sending one last letter to FOS, just so it's on record that I'm not happy with Barclays account to them, then giving up with them.

Another issue has come to light that I can't speak of yet, but may have a bearing in our favour. I'll know more when I speak to Hausfeld about the latest.

Not good news I'm afraid regarding FOS - but keep up the fight.

[Savarok]

Are FOS calling us liars, well I would say yes. In one of the complaints I had with Advent was that the advisor told me that Advent would help re-finance the loan if I contacted them early enough for them to talk to loan providers. When I did contact Advent they had to open an investigation about bad selling, as the advisor should never had said that this issue was conviently still open when the company folded. I do not see what the problem was I had then (and still do) have all the advisors details so they should have spoken to him.

 

I will directly quote from a FOS resolution letter now

"I do not believe that Advent would have offered to refinance this agreement for you considering they were not a party to the agreement in anyway"

 

Flat refusal, I did ask the FOS adjudicator about whether he spoke to the advisor with the details I provided but I am yet to recieve a response on this.

 

One thing that I did note though, aren't Advent a party because it is a linked loan?

[arlee]

Hi everyone

It is my first post, but I've ben following the discussion on this forum since Feb2010. Big thanks to all of you who are contributing to this forum with all their experiences.

Just one question. Has anyone of you guys stopped making payments to BFP? I kept repaying, (as advised by CAB) but soon went under financial struggle and turned to CCCS for help. They've sorted me out with the deal with BFP, decreasing montlhy repayment from 204 to 99 (untill all paid back). I got to a point though, where I really have enough of this charity goin on. Does anyone have any idea what is more likely to happen if I stopped re-paying (considering the circumstances)?

Adrian

[arlee]

 

Question 12 runs. My contract had already expired. How can I continue my training? A. You can still continue your training with Computeach but this will require further financial outlay.

 

Fuzz, some months ago you asked for any proof of time-frame complete the study, provided to any of us by Advent reps. What's the outcome of that? What if I have nothing but remember exactly rep saying, that there's no pressure and that I can study at my own pace, wether it'd take 2, 3 or 4 years it doesn't matter. Nothing was mentioned about any contract during my inteview with rep. It's existence was a big news to me when Advent went bust.

Edited November 16, 2010 by arlee

[10pack]

Hi everyone

It is my first post, but I've ben following the discussion on this forum since Feb2010. Big thanks to all of you who are contributing to this forum with all their experiences.

Just one question. Has anyone of you guys stopped making payments to BFP? I kept repaying, (as advised by CAB) but soon went under financial struggle and turned to CCCS for help. They've sorted me out with the deal with BFP, decreasing montlhy repayment from 204 to 99 (untill all paid back). I got to a point though, where I really have enough of this charity goin on. Does anyone have any idea what is more likely to happen if I stopped re-paying (considering the circumstances)?

Adrian

 

I and many others have not been paying BPF.

 

I would have paid except that as soon as I was informed that computeach would be their selection of training company?? , I immediately phoned BPF and told them while computeach is the option I do not want to know, I have told them many times that as an ex computeach student I do not again wish to waste my time (or money) with that company, but BPF in their arrogance insist that we have to.. no explaination no discussion just a big stick.

 

If BPF had asked me which company would I like to study with there would for not have been a problem I would have carried on paying... but not while its computeach or else.

 

BPF's insistance that we must take this option and no other is available.. make me really suspicous and I think that they have dumped us on computeach for nothing, I think it has not cost BPF a penny and both companies are laughing BPF hopes to get us to continue paying and they have gone around their S75 obligations and computeach are laughing because their business model is to waste your training time until either you drop out from disgust or the money you have paid is run out in which case they get to charge you for more.

And I dont think I am far off the mark.. otherwise why are over 1,500 of computeach's current student's up in arm's and seeking a law suit against them.

 

There is no way BPF are honouring their S75 commitment to us, they are just taking the **** and expect us to pay them or else.. otherwise they would have offered us a choice and asked us what we want.. that is the reason why I refuse to pay up.

[Fuzzbutt]

Fuzz, some months ago you asked for any proof of time-frame complete the study, provided to any of us by Advent reps. What's the outcome of that? What if I have nothing but remember exactly rep saying, that there's no pressure and that I can study at my own pace, wether it'd take 2, 3 or 4 years it doesn't matter. Nothing was mentioned about any contract during my inteview with rep. It's existence was a big news to me when Advent went bust.

 

Unfortunately no-one seems to have this in writing, so FOS dismiss our argument out of hand.

[Fuzzbutt]

IBPF's insistance that we must take this option and no other is available.. make me really suspicous and I think that they have dumped us on computeach for nothing, I think it has not cost BPF a penny and both companies are laughing BPF hopes to get us to continue paying and they have gone around their S75 obligations and computeach are laughing because their business model is to waste your training time until either you drop out from disgust or the money you have paid is run out in which case they get to charge you for more.

And I dont think I am far off the mark.. otherwise why are over 1,500 of computeach's current student's up in arm's and seeking a law suit against them.

 

There is no way BPF are honouring their S75 commitment to us, they are just taking the **** and expect us to pay them or else.. otherwise they would have offered us a choice and asked us what we want.. that is the reason why I refuse to pay up.

 

You've hit the nail on the head there, 10pack...it all stinks. My anger and disgust is directed at Barclays rather than Advent, as it initially was after the collapse. Lets not forget it was Barclays pulling out at short notice that caused the collapse in the first place.

 

This is my last letter to FOS, after challenging their first decision and asking for a second opinion from the Ombudsman him/herself...

 

Dear Ms Webster

Thank you for your letter dated 12 November and for forwarding the documentation provided to the Financial Ombudsman Service by Barclays Partner Finance, justifying its appointment of Computeach (CT) as a replacement to Advent Computer Training.

Before FOS gives a final decision, I would just like to make a further couple of points to my complaint however, which I think are key to the unfairness of this situation.

According to the Computeach website, FAQ for Advent students www.computeach.co.uk/advent-faqs, Question 12 runs – ‘My contract had already expired. How can I continue my training?’ Answer – ‘You can still continue your training with Computeach but this will require further financial outlay.’

Question 16 asks – ‘My contract with Advent was just about to end. Can I carry on studying if I want to?’ Answer - ‘You can still continue your training with Computeach but this will require further financial outlay.

Barclays also states in the document that it considers it quite reasonable that Advent students should pay the Advent fee for an identical course with Computeach that is some £1,760 cheaper. How is that fair? Barclays can’t have it both ways. If they are assuring me they are providing an identical like-for-like course then it should be for a like for like price, surely? Why are they refusing to refund the difference?

Barclays claim that Computeach contacted all the Advent students several times by email, letter and phone on April 1st (letter), April 28th (reminder email), May 24th and July 2nd (phonecalls). Well, I can categorically state that after I received the initial email explaining CT had taken over from Advent and the reminder to sign up with them, I had NO FURTHER CORRESPONDENCE from Computeach in any way, nor any attempt to contact me with the details of the bespoke replacement course in writing, as I’d requested. In fact, when I telephoned them for that information after I’d received the reminder, the rep could not answer my questions and promised to get someone to call me back. NO ONE DID -for THREE MONTHS! When a CT rep did call in the first week of November, he was surprised to hear that I was an ex-Advent student and not a 'new inquiry' as the system had me down as! I had to explain the whole situation to him. This is atrocious customer service and Barclays and FOS wonders why so many Advent students do not want to take up with this company? This is an example of the type of ‘student service’ CT is known for! And the comments on the forums clearly show I’m not alone in this appalling lack of communication and confusion on behalf of CT.

My argument to FOS is that this is unfair as my Advent agreement end date is Dec 2010 so that now leaves me just a few weeks to complete a 2 year course, or else I have to pay Computeach MORE money on top, just to finish my studies! This is due to virtually a year of my time having been wasted first by Barclays Partner Finance taking 3 months to appoint CT, and then FOS in your delay in giving a final answer on this. Fair? No! Even if I had wanted to take up the CT training it is too late now to complete within my deadline.

I've argued the point that the Advent sales reps gave me a verbal assurance that the course was open-ended (a sales rep even made a statement to that effect to our lawyer, that they were encouraged to make this clear in the sign up meeting to prospective students) but you tell me this is not considered evidence as I don’t have any written proof of it. Does the word of how many complainants now, all telling you the same thing, count for nothing? Why cannot this be taken as evidence? Are we all lying?

 

The documentation from Barclays will be passed to our lawyer as part of our group action challenge to this appalling mess created by Barclays, who were instrumental in sending Advent down the pan in the first place by withdrawing their partner funding at short notice, as they also did to many other private training partners such as Access2Trade also.

My argument still stands – that I did NOT choose Computeach and do not see why this training provider should be forced upon me. I insist on a refund for a product I did not receive.

Nor do I have any faith in the Ombudsman Service anymore in defending the little people against giants of industry who treat them as non-entities for exploitation.

[arlee]

Question 12 runs – ‘My contract had already expired. How can I continue my training?’ Answer – ‘You can still continue your training with Computeach but this will require further financial outlay.’ [/i][/font]

 

When a CT rep did call in the first week of November, he was surprised to hear that I was an ex-Advent student and not a 'new inquiry' as the system had me down as! I had to explain the whole situation to him.

 

That is exactly what happened to me, with the expemption, that it was only during that very telephone conversation with CT rep, when I got to know that there was a 2-year contract. Unfortunatelly, because it has already expired, I wasn't entitled to get alternative training with CT. I could, however, pay in additional 1,700 and do my studies with CT. So where's my money gone, and what am I actually repaying now? Barclay's boss' bonuses?

[arlee]

I and many others have not been paying BPF.

 

I would have paid except that as soon as I was informed that computeach would be their selection of training company?? , I immediately phoned BPF and told them while computeach is the option I do not want to know, I have told them many times that as an ex computeach student I do not again wish to waste my time (or money) with that company, but BPF in their arrogance insist that we have to.. no explaination no discussion just a big stick.

 

What was (or still is) the outcome of you deciding not to make any further payments to BFP?

[skyblue dave]

What was (or still is) the outcome of you deciding not to make any further payments to BFP?

 

Barclays have put their in-house deby collectors (Mercer) on the case. They have, more recently, passed it on (or least given our details to) various external debt collectors. (eg Moorcroft).

We have been given a template letter to request the debt collector's 'Deed of Assignment'. I can't speak for anyone else, but in my case Moorcroft have not replied to this letter. (About three weeks now).

This would seem to suggest that they do not have the correct paperwork.

[arlee]

Or they just are not in a hurry. How is that going to affect your crdit rating?

[10pack]

What was (or still is) the outcome of you deciding not to make any further payments to BFP?

 

For me.. so far they are on their third debt collecting agency against me.. last one as usual demading money or else, when I sent the standard letter telling them I did not recoginse owing them money and could they provide me with a deed of assignment for the loan, they answered that they would apply for it from BPF.. thats illegal they should have had this in the first place.

having multiple agencies on your back is breaking banking guidlines also.

 

So far I have refused to pay and explained my reasons for doing so I point out that its not like for like and also since I have already been a computeach student.. I do not wish to be again.

 

And the other week I again wrote to BPF this time making an official complaint about their employees actions, they have caused more trouble than good.. again no answer.

That is the 2nd letter now I have sent in the past few months without getting a reply from them, this despite BPF telling me in a earlier letter I had 8 week in which to reply to their letter about my original complaints, while they waited for my reply.. they set another debt agency on my back... also at the same time they have been marking my credit history with non payment notices.. this despite telling me they will investigate my complaints.

This is how low down they are, I will never trust this company again.

 

and I also have to ask..

BPF must be a IS9000 registered company? they should have a mission statement somewhere?

BPF emplyees must have taken ethical training courses (I know I had to go through these for IS9000 creditation with the company I worked for) so BPF emplyees are breaking their ethical conduct code by continuing with the illegal harrassments.. yet another line they don't care about crossing.. and we are the ones who are being unreasonable by refusing to accept computeach??

[10pack]

Barclays have put their in-house deby collectors (Mercer) on the case. They have, more recently, passed it on (or least given our details to) various external debt collectors. (eg Moorcroft).

We have been given a template letter to request the debt collector's 'Deed of Assignment'. I can't speak for anyone else, but in my case Moorcroft have not replied to this letter. (About three weeks now).

This would seem to suggest that they do not have the correct paperwork.

 

They dont have it moorcroft answered my request and wrote they would apply for it from BPF.. what they have done is illegal and they know it, ignore any further letters

[arlee]

Would anyone of you guys suggest I should stop paying them?

[skyblue dave]

Would anyone of you guys suggest I should stop paying them?

 

You've got to do your own thing mate. We've had dodgy posters on here before, and I'm starting to think you might be another one.

[nelpin]

I have managed to get hold of my copy of the agreement from BPF and it cleary states our rights for unsatisfactory goods... i have officially stopped paying BPF!

[10pack]

I have managed to get hold of my copy of the agreement from BPF and it cleary states our rights for unsatisfactory goods... i have officially stopped paying BPF!

 

yes it does say that.. and when I called BPf in January the rep there told me BPf was looking for an alternative training provider that will be as good as or better.. otherwise we can sure them.. his words

 

but BPF dont look at it that way now.. you must pay for any bag of **** they throw at you

Edited November 18, 2010 by 10pack

[10pack]

I just checked my credit report this morning.. BPF have now given me an "8" on this account. which means I am now in default and the wording on it is the loan agreement is ended.. so what does that mean???

[Savarok]

You've got to do your own thing mate. .

 

Indeed none of us are qualified to give that sort of advice, its a decision you have to make on your own.

[arlee]

You've got to do your own thing mate. We've had dodgy posters on here before, and I'm starting to think you might be another one.

 

I know I gotta do my own thing, but credit rating is what I'm on about. I really don't want to put myself into some s**t. As I said, paying for the service which I'm not getting anyway isn't what I want to be doing, I'm looking for the advice and for other members to share their experiences, so I know what to expect when I stop paying. As we all now, CAB's not much of a help and as many of you I can't afford a lawyer. I'm sure that'd explain it all to you Dave

[arlee]

What's the best web site if I wanted to chek my credit report for myself pls?

[10pack]

I opened an experian account to check my accounts some years ago.. but for other reasons than what we have here... that is what I use and I also used it to put a notice of correction against theis loan for anyone else to see.

 

I had an alert on my credit report yesterday and checked, BPF have now given me an "8" which means I am now in default.. strange because I never got to see 7 , I suspect its them escalating things rather than trying to sort things out with their customer.

 

and even more interesting is that all my other accounts credit cards etc all show perfect repayments.. so again anyone want to check my credit history will wonder what is going on with Clydesdale / Barclays Partner Finance.. why is there a problem with repaying them and not all my other bills cable,mobile,card's etc

 

Today got a letter from BPF today telling me the state of my account.. its an arrears notice with 9 of those £22.50 charges added for good measure,

and its telling me because i am behind in payments they have added all the extra charges to my account blah blah, its got the usual if I have not already agreed to a repayment plan and having troubles paying to contact them.. (this clears themselves since they have made an offer and i am being totaly unreasonable to not pay them any money).

 

No mention of that I have asked for many months now for my account to be in dispute and can they actually communicate with me instead of hitting me with a stick?.

 

One thing the letter does state is that included with the letter was an information sheet from office of fair trading this letter has imortant information about my rights and where to go for support and advice and if they were to apply for a time order.. if its not included you should contact us to get one... well guess what.. there was not one enclosed with the notice!.. so looks like I will have to contact BPF for the information sheet..

 

And I bet if they apply for a time order they wont tell the department in question the reason why I am in arrears, just that I have not paid them.

 

Interestingly this letter not only has a signature you can read.. but also a name in print ... ooooh! theres a new one.. all letters I have had with the stick, have been signed with an unreadable scribble and no printed name so you cant go and ask them what they are playing at.

 

I think I may give this person a call I have a name ??