Alleged misuse of blue badge

[Nige1]

Hi all,

I received a PCN from a LA even though my blue badge and time clock were clearly on display. I obviously appealed and this is where it gets interesting:

 

On the day in question I arrived at 1.30pm, parking on a single yellow line, setting my time clock (for 1.30 obviously)

 

I then left around 3pm ( I can't remember exactly, but certainly with the 3 hours permitted)

 

I then returned at 6pm, parked in a designated parking bay ( restrictions are in force until 7pm).

 

I have received a photograph showing my timeclock set to 6pm but the timestamp on the photo shows as 15.54.

 

I am absolutely positive that I set my timeclock correctly and there must be some error on the photo timestamp.

 

I have drafted the following letter. Any thoughts, revisions or omissions would be gratefully received.

 

 

I can confirm that I was parked in [LOCATION] on [DATE] with my time clock set to 6pm as shown in your photograph. However, this was in a prescribed parking bay and in a different location to which this alleged offence relates to. It seems that the time stamp on the photograph does not match the actual time that I was parked in the location suggested.

To be clear on this: On [DATE] I parked in [LOCATION], arriving at 1.30pm, setting my time clock for this time. I left [LOCATION] before 4.30pm, arriving back at 6pm, parking in a prescribed parking bay and setting my time clock for 6pm.

To avoid any confusion, I have enclosed a map which I would be grateful if you would indicate the exact location that I was parked in at the time of the alleged offence and return it to me.

On receipt of the clearly marked map I will consider any further action I need to take.

[green_and_mean]

You cannot get a PCN for misuse of a Blue Badge as its a criminal offence. You probably got a PCN for a parking contravention which if you informed us of what it was for and at what time we may be able to assist in some way.

[Nige1]

My apologies.

Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours.(7am -7pm)

first observered 15.44 Notice issued 15.49.58

 

However see my above post for the complications. I think someone somewhere is trying to pull a fast one.

[green_and_mean]

I'm confused! So you are saying when you got back to the car there was a PCN on it issued at a time you were never parked?

[Nige1]

I never looked at it like that. But yes!

 

I think the enforcement officer saw my car parked earlier in the day, with a blue badge correctly displayed in a yellow line, then came back and saw me later in the day and had incorrectly set the timestamp on the camera, took a picture to show my badge showing 6pm and applied it to my earlier parking.

 

Does that make any sense?

[green_and_mean]

I never looked at it like that. But yes!

 

I think the enforcement officer saw my car parked earlier in the day, with a blue badge correctly displayed in a yellow line, then came back and saw me later in the day and had incorrectly set the timestamp on the camera, took a picture to show my badge showing 6pm and applied it to my earlier parking.

 

Does that make any sense?

 

No it doesn't.

 

There are only two reasons you could have got a PCN (excluding BB abuse/fraud) and that is either..

 

He had reason to beleive you parked over 3 hours

 

or

 

The badge was set to 6pm prior to 6pm.

 

The first is unlikely as the time first seen should be 3 hours before the PCN was issued.

The second would either mean you are fibbing and parked before 15.40 and the CEO is correct or the CEO changed the time on both his camera and computer when he saw you at 6pm and pretended you parked at 15.40. for some reason and issued a PCN.

If its a case of him lying it will be easy to prove as his PCNs are issued in numerical order so if he issued one with the clock changed it will be between ones issued at 18.00 when you say the ticket was issued and he is caught bang to rights.

[Nige1]

Thanks.

That makes it a little easier to prove knowing that it is possible to change the times on the camera etc. I'll ask for the ticket numbers either side of mine to be checked for time stamps and see what that brings to light.

 

I can assure you that I am not fibbing in any way. What would be the point? I have a legitimate means of parking for free, why would I abuse it especially when the restrictions ended before my 2nd 3 hour parking window?

 

I can only assume that the officer had a quota to meet for the day and i was an easy target.

 

I'll keep you informed

[Jamberson]

Have you checked the PCN is definitely for your car (ie the registration number stated on it is your car)? Might sound like a silly question, but sometimes drivers get a pcn then put it on someone else's car in the hope that that person will just pay it! It has been known!

 

Also, the pcn will also state the location - is this the location you were in from 6pm onwards, and not earlier in the day?

 

If it's the correct registration and location, then the time issue comes to the fore. They should have photos of the vehicle when the pcn was issued. At 6pm (or thereafter) it will be dark. If the pcn was issued at 3:49 it will be broad daylight.

 

Have you seen the photos? Call the council and ask them if it's daytime or nighttime in the photos - and ask for copies. They should be happy to send them - maybe by email even.

 

This will help get to the bottom of what happened.

[sizzler1893]

I then returned at 6pm, parked in a designated parking bay ( restrictions are in force until 7pm).

 

Was the bay designated as either on street parking or Disabled parking? If not your Blue Badge wouldn't be valid within the restriction times.

[Nige1]

Hi Guys,

Sorry for the delay in updating postal service and xmas etc.)

 

It appears that I was in the wrong and did set my clock for 6pm before 6pm. I am informed that the LA have checked the issueing officer's notebook and they have sent me all the pictures etc.

 

However, now I know the position I was parked in at the time of the offince, I went back last week to check the lines, and 10 yards from where I parked I found this:

 

 

You can also see the pole that the restrictions are posted on too. I believe that the ends of yellow lines need to have a bar at the end to be valid? Does anyone know of a template letter or the exact part of the regs that I can quote in my reply telling them to bugger off? (I'll phrase it better than that though)

 

 

Thanks

[kwaks]

Yes lines need a bar, however if the break is due to repairs, yet the meaning is clear then they still stand. Is that yellow paint all over the street or were you trying photoshop?

 

You have a "a legitimate means of parking for free, why would I abuse it" blue badge which you abused/set wrong. You were caught out. Its up to you whether you try to fight on a technicality or realise that you intentionally or not inconvenienced other road users without the proper authority in place.(ie a properly displayed badge)

[Nige1]

Thanks for the reply.

The yellow tinting is just my crappy camera. No photoshopping or paint whatsoever

 

I appreciate what you are saying and whilst I made an honest mistake, it's clear that due to my disability I have a "legitimate means of parking for free" so a little bit of leeway and understanding from the council would've been nice. There are also big industrial sized bins all along that stretch of road causing more of an obstruction than I ever could along with other breaks in the line. I have photos of them too, just didn't post them

 

Does the legislation actually allow for breaks in the line due to repairs or is it just a 'given'

 

Honestly, I know I'm in the wrong but if they want to issue me with a PCN on the technicality of a incorrectly set timeclock then I will fight it on every tiny little thing I can find.

[green_and_mean]

What time was it set at?

[Nige1]

My badge was mistakenly set to show 6pm, although thinking about it now, the photos still only show my car parked in one position and my time clock set to 6 pm in a different photo, which 'could' have been when I was parked later. There doesn't seem to be a definitive 'here is you car parked in this position with the clock set to 6pm' photo.

 

I'm getting very confused by all this.

 

I can't find the actual piece of legislation that says the lines must be continuous, unbroken with a bar at each end and that there are no permitted variants. So either I'm not looking in the right place or I'm imagining that it ever existed.

 

Any help anyone?

[kwaks]

The loophole which allowed you to get off parking charges because the lines had faded, were broken by repairs etc was closed, in so much as if the meaning of the lines was still clear then they stood. Going by your pic the lines which can be seen are clear, not worn and the meaning is still portrayed.

 

I think you are getting too caught up in the pics you have, why would the warden pick on you by taking pictures later to "make up" an earlier ticket? He will not even remember your car from earlier.

 

The "legislastion" you remember about the lines being continous etc can be found in the Highway Code

[Nige1]

I certainly do not consider it a 'loophole' If the law states something, then it must be obeyed. This is why they are persuing me for a PCN (however ridiculous I think an incorrectly set timeclock contravention is) If I can use the law to my advantage, I will because you can be damn sure they would if the situation was reversed.

[green_and_mean]

I certainly do not consider it a 'loophole' If the law states something, then it must be obeyed. This is why they are persuing me for a PCN (however ridiculous I think an incorrectly set timeclock contravention is) If I can use the law to my advantage, I will because you can be damn sure they would if the situation was reversed.

 

It is not physically possible to ensure every inch of every yellow line in the whole country is continuous 24 hours a day. Using your argument a hairline crack in the line would invalidate the entire restriction which is ridiculous. You are not being persued for a minor technicality you set (whether deliberate or not only you know) your clock in a position which would get you several hours free parking on top of your legal entitlement.

[Nige1]

Firstly, ridiculous or not, that is the law. I don't write them, I just try to obey them and expect others (individuals and public servants) to do the same.

 

Secondly, the restrictions on that road end at 7pm. Why would I deliberately set my clock for 6pm when I'm entitled to 3 hours free parking?

 

I would gladly pay the £70 PCN if it would give me back full use of my legs.

[Jamberson]

Firstly, ridiculous or not, that is the law. I don't write them, I just try to obey them and expect others (individuals and public servants) to do the same.

 

This issue isn't exactly what the law says. It's how it is defined and enforced. It would be ridiculous to interpret it absolutely literally, and your case won't succeed if it is based on ruthlessly exact readings.

 

Secondly, the restrictions on that road end at 7pm. Why would I deliberately set my clock for 6pm when I'm entitled to 3 hours free parking?

 

I don't think anyone is suggesting you would. The problem is, there is no way to determine if a driver has overstayed, if the clock is not correct from the outset. So, a PCN is issued. It doesn't imply you deliberately flouted the regulations - just that (for whatever reason) you did not comply with them.

 

So where are you at? What correspondence have you received most recently?

[Nige1]

Last communication was the LA sending me all the photographs they took so it was clear where I parked (I had parked in two separate locations in the same street that day). Even now I still don't have a definative 'here's your car in this position with it's timeclock set at 6pm' photo, only a collection of photos but I suppose I'm going to have to live with that.

 

Once I knew exactly which position the PCN applied to, I went back to have a look around and take some photos of my own (one of which I posted above). That was on December 22nd. Just trying to figure out how to approach this now, so any help would be appreciated.

[green_and_mean]

Last communication was the LA sending me all the photographs they took so it was clear where I parked (I had parked in two separate locations in the same street that day). Even now I still don't have a definative 'here's your car in this position with it's timeclock set at 6pm' photo, only a collection of photos but I suppose I'm going to have to live with that.

 

Once I knew exactly which position the PCN applied to, I went back to have a look around and take some photos of my own (one of which I posted above). That was on December 22nd. Just trying to figure out how to approach this now, so any help would be appreciated.

 

I'm still confused when you started this thread you said you got a PCN when you parked the second time ie after 6pm now you are saying it was on the first visit....which is it?

[Nige1]

I assumed it was on the second visit because of the timeclock. According to the photos it's when I was parked the first time. I'm confused too and I was there

[green_and_mean]

I assumed it was on the second visit because of the timeclock. According to the photos it's when I was parked the first time. I'm confused too and I was there

 

When did you find the PCN stuck on your car? Are you saying it was stuck on the first time and you drove around and re-parked without seeing it?

[Huff&Puff]

Have you just tried appealing to the council's better nature? It isn't hard to mis-set the clock, or like I did the other week, forget to set it at all (luckily I didn't get caught). A neighbour of mine did exactly the same as you, and set his for the wrong time, and he wrote to the council and they let him off. And that was a council (LB Barnet) who are well known for playing hardball.

[Nige1]

When did you find the PCN stuck on your car? Are you saying it was stuck on the first time and you drove around and re-parked without seeing it?

 

Yes. It was stuck right over my tax disc in the lower corner of the windscreen. It wasn't until about 1.30 am on my way home when I stopped to get a can of coke that I noticed the PCN