Halifax sold me to Moorcroft!

[Livis]

Hello all,

I'm currently in dispute with Halifax over a CCA agreement which i don't think is valid.

Also i'm trying to claim back Charges that have been applied to the Credit Card Account.

Their last letter threatened intended litigation.

I have now recieved a letter from Moorcroft, threatening the same.

Am i right in thinking i should have recieved a notice of assignment?

Is this important that i haven't recieved this?

Will write back to Moorcroft this morning advising account in dispute, do i ask moorcroft about notice of assignment or halifax ?

Thanks

Livis xx

[cerberusalert]

Send Moorcroft this; http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/86-debt-collectors/574-letter-when-account-has-been-passed-on-whilst-agreement-request-is-in-dispute

[Livis]

Thanks cerberusalert, have you any advice about the notice of assignment ?

ta xx

[PGH7447]

I would'nt bother then if they take it further it is more ammo for you that they did not notify you.

[little miss complaint]

Hi Livis

 

Neither Halifax nor Moorcroft have any obligation to issue a Notice Of Assignment as it will state in the contract you signed, that Halifax may pass your account to a third party to deal, and if they haven't sold your account then the chances of you having any legal rights to one are next to none tbh. I have done extensive research into this and have taken legal advice myself about accounts not having NOA, and I was advised the above. See s136 Law Of Property Act 1925 for further info.

 

With regard to your CCA request, if Halifax are being deliberately misleading or you feel the CCA is invalid, I would contact OFT, they are incredibly helpful and will be able to tell you where you stand with it.

[cashins]

A notice of assignment would only apply if the debt had been sold to Moorcroft.

 

In the dealings I have had, (as have many others on here), Moorcroft are simply acting as collection agents.

 

Send the 'account in dispute' to Moorcroft.

 

David

[diddydicky]

have you had a default Notice and/or a termination notice?

[Livis]

Thanks for all your comments.

Halifax actually defaulted me some time ago. I've sent the account in dispute letter to Moorcroft, so will wait and see what their next step is .

xx

[cerberusalert]

Can you post the Default Notice up after removing identifying details?

[Livis]

Hello cerberusalert,

i've dug the default notice out and scanned it on, any comments are appreciated xx

 

[cashins]

They've made a pig's ear of that.

 

It does not allow the 14 days required by law.

 

If sent by 1st class post , they should have allowed 2 working days for delivery of the notice. They haven't done so.

 

That notice is defective and would be seen as such in a court.

 

David

[diddydicky]

you need to sit back now silently and wait for the termination notice or a LBA claiming the full amount

[diddydicky]

Hi Livis

 

Neither Halifax nor Moorcroft have any obligation to issue a Notice Of Assignment as it will state in the contract you signed, that Halifax may pass your account to a third party to deal, and if they haven't sold your account then the chances of you having any legal rights to one are next to none tbh. I have done extensive research into this and have taken legal advice myself about accounts not having NOA, and I was advised the above. See s136 Law Of Property Act 1925 for further info.

 

With regard to your CCA request, if Halifax are being deliberately misleading or you feel the CCA is invalid, I would contact OFT, they are incredibly helpful and will be able to tell you where you stand with it.

 

not sure about the validity of that legal advice........ it may well have been legal advice but they proposition that ANY organisation can suddenly demand you to pay an amount to them without he OC having first notified you that it has assigned the agreement to them would seem preposterous to me (not qualified but blessed with an awful lot of common sense)

[cerberusalert]

Have you received the Termination Notice too, or have they demanded the full amount owing?

[diddydicky]

Hi Livis

 

Neither Halifax nor Moorcroft have any obligation to issue a Notice Of Assignment as it will state in the contract you signed, that Halifax may pass your account to a third party to deal, and if they haven't sold your account then the chances of you having any legal rights to one are next to none tbh. I have done extensive research into this and have taken legal advice myself about accounts not having NOA, and I was advised the above. See s136 Law Of Property Act 1925 for further info.

 

With regard to your CCA request, if Halifax are being deliberately misleading or you feel the CCA is invalid, I would contact OFT, they are incredibly helpful and will be able to tell you where you stand with it.

 

this might be of interest

 

 

CCANotice of Assignment12. The Claimant asserts that Exhibit MI2 referred to in the Witness Statement of XXX evidences assignment of the alleged credit card account to the Claimant. I deny that Exhibit XXX evidences such assignment. I have no recollection of receiving a Notice of Assignment from MBNA.13. I assert that for a Notice of Assignment to be effective, explicit notice of assignment must be given by writing under the hand of the assignor in compliance with S 136 of the Law of Property Act 1925, [the LPA 1925], (which sets out the requirement for the legal assignment of legal debts, “Things in action”).14. Further, I note that the Notice of Assignment ‘MI2’ shows that the stated failure of a Notice of Assignment to be accurate invalidates the notice and, therefore, the legal right to the debt cannot be assigned effectually at law within the meaning of s 136(1) LPA, 1925.*[W F Harrison & Co Ltd v Burke and another {1956] 2 All ER 169],*applyingAtkin J in*Denney, Gasquet, and Metcalfe v Conklin*([1913] 3 KB at p 180):.

15. The Notice of Assignment is inaccurate in that the address shown of ’15 Old Bailey, London, EC4M 7EF’ is not the address shown in the exhibit MI3 and further that as the entity of an ‘LLC’ is not known within England & Wales, there is no way to verify the true address of the claimant. Therefore, the Notice of Assignment could not bring"to the notice of the debtor with reasonable certainty the fact that the deed does assign the debt due from the debtor so as to bind the debt in his hands and prevent him from paying the debt to the original creditor,” as required by the case law*[Denney, Gasquet, and Metcalfe v Conklin*([1913] 3 KB at p 180)]

16. Further, it is asserted that for the assignment of a debt to be effective and so giving the Claimant a right of action, a valid Notice of Assignment must have been sufficiently served on the Defendant by a registered postal service pursuant to s196 (4) LPA 1925 before court action is commenced.17. It is noted that by the Recorded Delivery Service Act 1962 a recorded delivery letter is equivalent to a registered letter and that under the Postal Services Act 2000 Schedule 8 any reference to registered post is to be construed as meaning a registered postal service (eg Royal Mail recorded delivery or special delivery).18. I deny that I have received a valid notice of assignment for the alleged debt from the original creditor and it is also denied that any notice of assignment was sufficiently served in accordance with section 136(1), of the Law of Property Act 1925, in respect of the alleged debt and so the Claimant has no right of action.The Default Notice.19. Service of a default notice is a statutory requirement as laid out in sections 87,88 and 89 CCA and section 87 makes it clear that a default notice must be served before a creditor can seek to terminate the agreement or demand repayment of sums due to a breach of the agreement. It is denied that MBNA has served a Default Notice and therefore the agreement cannot have been terminated by MBNA.20. The prescribed format for such document is laid down in Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1561) and Amendment regulations, the Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) (Amendment) Regulations 2004 (SI 2004/3237).21. It is averred that the default notice referred to in the Particulars of Claim does not allow the prescribed timeframe of 14 days after service to remedy any breach referred to in said default notice.23. A default notice needs to be accurate in terms of both the scope and nature of breach and include an accurate figure required to remedy any such breach. Failure of a default notice to be accurate invalidates the default notice*(Woodchester Lease Management Services Ltd v Swain and Co - [2001] GCCR 2255)*The amount detailed in the Claimant’s claim, includes penalties charges in excess of £410, which are unlawful at Common Law,*[Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Company Ltd v New Garage and Motor Company Ltd [1915],*and also under The Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 and The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.24. Further, in respect of that which is denied, if the credit card account had been properly assigned to the Claimant, and if the breach had been remedied by the payment of the sum of £161 as stated in the documents MI3, the agreement was not capable of being continued since the Claimant is not an authorised firm under the Financial Services and Markets Act 2001 and as such could not operate a credit card accountInterest25. The Claimant’s claim to be entitled to*£xxxxxxx*to*interest*or to any other sum is denied.

[little miss complaint]

They haven't assigned anything to Moorcroft, they have simply requested that they collect the outstanding balance on Halifax's behalf, so for Halifax to advise Livis the account has been 'assigned', would not be correct. The original agreement remains with the creditor (Halifax) and all legal obligations are still with Halifax, and has not been 'assigned' to Moorcroft. Read the t&c's of most bank accounts and it will advise you that your account may be passed to a third party to deal, and that is all they are obliged to do. The default notice clearly states on it that further action may be taken including being passed to a DCA.

[diddydicky]

i would have thought that a third party acting on behalf of a client can issue a dn or tn on their behalf provided that the notice clearly stated that it was issued on behalf of XXXXX

 

i agree the word assigned is confusing and many people seem to use it these days when they really mean it has been passed to a third party to deal with and not in its literal sense

 

perhaps the oft ought to clear this up

[creditcardmug]

Moorcroft act only as a DCA for HBOS/Halifax/BOS

 

No Moorcroft cannot issue DNs, or TNs... the OC does that, before taking action to recover the debt

[diddydicky]

Moorcroft act only as a DCA for HBOS/Halifax/BOS

 

No Moorcroft cannot issue DNs, or TNs... the OC does that, before taking action to recover the debt

 

i'm always learning but let me get this straight

 

you are saying that moorcroft acting on behalf of say halifax cannot send a DN to me on behalf of halifax (9clearly stating the the Notice is issued on behalf of Halifax and with the halifax name and address on the DN ) and cannot negotiate or enter into agreements or arrangments on behalf of its client?

 

A solicitor acting on behalf of halifax can act on their behalf and do these things

 

i can appoint a friend or relative or solicitor or CMC to act on my behalf or via a POA so what legistlation says only a solicitor can act on behalf of an oc?

 

i'm not being contentious i genuinely don't know where there is anything to prevent whoever the oc wants to act on their behalf from doing just that=

 

it certainly is acceptable in business

 

is their something in consumer legislation that prevents this?

[little miss complaint]

Moorcroft can set arrangements, on their clients behalf, as their instruction is to collect the balance, so it would be pointless if they couldn't set an arrangement. But the contract/agreement remains with the OC and all rights to that agreement/contract also remain with the OC. Although Moorcroft have been given authorisation by their client (Halifax in this instance) to collect the outstanding balance and take whatever recovery action is needed, Halifax still 'own' the account and have the final say on any action to be taken.

 

The only DN that Moorcroft could and would send, is if you miss a payment that you had agreed to make to them. Moorcroft are NOT a creditor and cannot affect your credit file, so the OC has to issue the DN as that is registered on your credit file, and creditcardmug is correct, the DN or TN is issued prior to recovery action being taken, as your account has to have defaulted before they can pass it to a DCA.

[Livis]

I've dug this out, it's the front page that was attached to the cca that they sent.

Does this mean the account has been terminated?

[cashins]

Yes, very clearly

 

David

[cashins]

Just looked back, you have a defective default notice:eek:

 

They are up the creek without a paddle.

 

David

[Livis]

is that because of the number of days given to rectify ?

[babydoll0141917]

yep they havent allowed the full 14 days to redem by..so your DN is defected !!