Help and Advice Needed

[blueknight61]

Hello,

 

I'm a new member and need some advice about a debt with Nat West.

 

I was contacted this morning completely out of the blue by someone from Wescot informing me that they had my Nat West debt and how was I going to pay the debt off.

 

The history of this is that my ex-husband took out a loan on our joint account over 10 years ago and when we split up Nat West hounded me for payment of the loan. I was first passed to Telford and agreed to pay them £5 per month. After a few years they then passed this loan onto Buchannan, Clark and Wells although I was not informed of this until I received a call from them threatening to take me to court for non payment.

 

I agreed a monthly payment with BCW and never defaulted on this, in November 2007 I phoned BCW asking for a new payment book, they informed me that Nat West had taken this loan back and to wait until Nat West contacted me.

 

I have had no contact from Nat West and had no idea that Wescot had this loan until this morning.

 

The first phone call I received he stated that I had defaulted on this loan as I had not paid since Nov 07. When I tried to explain the situation to him, he said he would contact his legal dept and put the phone down on me.

 

I then spoke to another lady, who stated that because I paid other creditors I should halve my payments to them and pay the rest to Westcot?

 

Can anyone help me with some advice as to where I should go from here? I spoke to CAB and they said as Wescot had refused my payment offer there is nothing more they could advise me but to speak to my Bank about a loan to pay off the Nat West Loan?

 

Sorry this post is so long.

[IdaInFife]

Hi and Welcome to CAG!

 

I would send of a cca request to ensure Wescot have the right to collect and all paperwork is in order.

 

I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY OR ANY COMPANY YOU CLAIM TO REPRESENT

Re: Account no: xxxxxxxx

Thank you for your letter dated (enter date) which has been noted for future reference.

This letter is a formal request pursuant to s.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide.

I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit. You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request, the provisions of s.77(6) will apply.

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance.

Yours faithfully,

 

Include £1 postal order and print your name do not sign it and send recorded delviery to Wescot

 

Ida x

[cerberusalert]

First send them a CCA request to see if they are entitled to collect this debt & if it's enforcable. They have 12 + 2 days to comply to your request. If they fail or the CCA is unenforcable you can legally withold any payment until they do. Send it recorded delivery enclosing a £1 postal order. When you get a reply, scan it & remove any identifying details and post it back here where we can have a look at it. We'll advise you from there;

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re:- Account No: XXXXXXXX/Your Reference Number: XXXXXXX

 

This letter is a formal request pursuant to s.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide.

 

I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit. You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request, the provisions of s.77 will apply.

 

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

 

Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

 

I enclose a postal order in the sum of £1.00, which is the statutory fee. Note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose.

 

If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee.

 

You should also note that I will only discuss this matter in writing and should it be your intention to arrange a “doorstep call”, please be advised that under OFT rules, you can only visit me at my home if you make an appointment and I have no wish to make an appointment with you or any of your associates.

 

There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.). Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your representatives to visit me at my property and if you do so, then you will be liable to damages for a tort of trespass and action will be taken, including but not limited to, police attendance.

 

I look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

 

(Print do not sign signature)

[foolishgirl]

Hi blueknight - welcome to CAG

 

Firstly, can you confirm that this was a loan with Nat West & not an overdraft?

 

2. If a loan, have you got a copy of the original agreement, if an overdraft a letter confirming details of terms etc? Have you ever applied for a copy of the credit agreement? If not, this would prob. be your starting point but post back with other details first.

 

3. Have you ever received a default notice from NW or a Notice of Assignment from NW or any other CRA? Is it possible that you have moved & not received these?

 

4. Most importantly, Westcot cannot just demand money from you over the phone. If they phone again, tell them to put everything in writing. Never, never speak to them.

 

5. Was this debt not included as part of your divorce settlement? i.e. although it is a joint loan & both your husband & you are jointly & severally liable for it, its existance should have been declared by your husband prior to the divorce & you may have a case for claiming against him but you would have to consult the solicitor who dealt with it on this.

[BankFodder]

Additionally, buy yourself a telephone recorder and record all calls.

 

They will always have you at a disadvantage if you don't

[blueknight61]

Hi,

 

Thank you for your quick responses.

 

The debt is for a loan and I do not have a copy of the original agreement.

 

I have never received a default notice or Notice of Assignment from NW or anyone else and all my post was being forwarded to my new address when I split up.

 

The debt was not declared by my ex and not included in any settlement. The settlement was quite complicated and at the time my solicitor said that I was liable to pay this loan as it was from a joint account, which is why I started paying NW in the first place.

 

I have no reference numbers from Westcot as it was just a phone call, but I will probably have something somewhere with a NW Ref No but if not will this matter when I write to them.

[cerberusalert]

You will probably receive one of their missives in the next few days, which will include a ref no. you can use.

[foolishgirl]

Hi,

 

The debt is for a loan and I do not have a copy of the original agreement.

 

Send off for a CCA with the 'I do not acknowledge this debt' letter as above as soon as you hear from Westcot. It may be that they cannot produce on in which case you could put the account in dispute after 12+2 days & not make the payments if/until they produce an enforceable CCA. Look around the forum, you will soon get the hang of the process, or post back.

I have never received a default notice or Notice of Assignment from NW or anyone else and all my post was being forwarded to my new address when I split up.

 

They have to send you a default notice in the prescirbed format & also a NOA before they are entitled to collect the debt. It may not have much relevance now but will have if they attempt legal action against you.

 

The debt was not declared by my ex and not included in any settlement. The settlement was quite complicated and at the time my solicitor said that I was liable to pay this loan as it was from a joint account, which is why I started paying NW in the first place.

 

It may be that the solicitor accounted for it in the financial arrangements but I suggest you check with the sols.

 

I have no reference numbers from Westcot as it was just a phone call, but I will probably have something somewhere with a NW Ref No but if not will this matter when I write to them.

 

Westcot will contact you quickly enough if they have been assigned the debt. Suggest you wait for the post for the moment & in the meantime, refuse to speak to them on the phone. As BF advises, get yourself a telephone recorder - you may need to prove harrassment one day

FG

[blueknight61]

Hi everyone,

 

I still have not received anything from Wescot in the mail although I have received five phone calls. This is despite telling them on the first call that I would like them to put everything in writing and stop phoning.

 

The reply I got was that they can't put anything in writing and that I was kidding myself!!

 

Anyway what I wanted to ask was although they haven't written to me I now have a reference number, so should I now send them a CCA request?

 

Although saying that I don't actually have an address to write to them!!

 

Besides all that, I would just like to say thank you for everyone that has ever written or replied to a post on whole of this forum (of which I've probably read most of them over the last few days) because if I'd never found this site I would be bawling my eyes out and getting myself all worked up that someone would be knocking at my door to take my stuff away. I'd also probably have agreed to everything they said on Friday and be paying them by now.

[cerberusalert]

Registered in Scotland No. 84131,

Registered Office:

Kyleshill House,

1 Glencairn Street,

Saltcoats,

Ayrshire

KA21 5JT

[foolishgirl]

Suggest you also include the 'harassment' letter with your CCA. Link to template here:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/letter-templates/131250-dca-creditor-harassment-telephone.html

[blueknight61]

Thanks everyone for the advice so far.

 

I have now sent the CCA Request and the Telephone Harassment letters off to Westcot. From reading this site I know they have 12 + 2 days to produce the paperwork, but is that working days or calendar days?

 

Thanks

 

blueknight61

[cerberusalert]

Calender days

[blueknight61]

Cerberusalert thanks for that.

 

I received this lovely black & red letter from Westcot today. Do I just ignore it until they send a CCA or contact them?

 

[babybear39]

It's 12 + 2 working days and I can't read the letter it's too small, but I'd ignore it for the time being.

[cerberusalert]

In the regulations it is 12 working days from receipt of your request, the extra 2 days is recommended to cover a weekend.

 

It's the usual Westcot threatogram saying what they 'might' do, 'may' do....... ignore it.

[blueknight61]

Hi,

 

By my calculations the 12 + 2 for Westcot was up today (they signed for letter on 16 Feb), received nothing from them or Nat West in the post this morning, does this mean I can now send the In Dispute letter today or will I have to wait until tomorrow?

[babybear39]

Don't send it until they contact you again

[blueknight61]

Thanks babybear,

 

I'll sit tight and wait for another one of their lovely red & black letters

[blueknight61]

Hi Everyone,

 

Well finally received a letter from Westcot (well over the 12+2 days) stating they had attached the original agreement and now require me to contact them within 7 days and pay the account in full!!! AS IF!!!

 

Am I right in thinking that Nat West should have sent a photocopy of the original signed agreement that my ex husband and I signed?

 

If so, what has been sent is not it. Unfortunately cannot scan in a copy as my scanner is not working. Trying to sort out, so hopefully will be able to copy later.

 

But in the meantime, basically the first page is headed Credit Agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and then lists the Nat West address and underneath my old address.

 

It then lists what the loan was for, the amount and the interest rate. Then underneath that the Total Interest and the Normal Montly repayments.

 

At the bottom it says IMPORTANT - You should read this carefully YOUR RIGHTS and then says what the act covers and my right to cancel.

 

On a second seperate page it lists 14 conditions and then on another page it shows a schedule of arrears.

 

The schedule shows my new address, the balance drawn, amount paid, total arrears and balance on the account.

 

It then goes on to give a list of missed payments to date under the original agreement.

 

Nowhere on any of these three pages is a signature or does it show any of the payments I paid to Nat West when the account was first defaulted on. I was paying them £5 a month and then BCW £5 a month until Nat West took the loan back in November 2007.

 

Please can someone advise if this is valid and what my next step would be?

 

Many thanks in advance

[blueknight61]

Finally got scanner working. This is what I received from Westcot regarding my CCA request.

 

 

 

 

http://i714.photobucket.com/albums/ww144/blueknight61/Westcot05.jpg[/iM

[blueknight61]

Hi,

 

Can anyone advise if this is enforceable? Also what would the next step be, Westcot have given me 7 days to reply.

 

Many thanks

 

Blue

[IdaInFife]

IMO it has all the prescribed terms

 

Ida x

[blueknight61]

Ida, thanks, but shouldn't it be a copy of the original signed agreement? There are no signatures on it at all.

[IdaInFife]

lol,

 

sorry didnlt notice,

 

was this an online application?

 

 

Ida x